On Mon, 29 Jun 2020 at 07:53, Paul Allen <[email protected]> wrote: > On Mon, 29 Jun 2020 at 12:02, Jake Edmonds via Tagging > <[email protected]> wrote: >> While it might be used in Paul’s area, McDonalds is not a cafe where I am >> from, and would put money on most British people calling it a fast food >> restaurant > > I am surprised that there is anywhere in the world that would glorify a > McDonalds sit-down area with the term "restaurant." Candle-lit quarter > pounders for two? Would sir like wine with that? > > However, taking another look at the wiki for fast food, I see it covers > sit down as well as takeaway only. Which surprised me (never having > had to map a McD). For me there is a very, very big distinction between > a takeaway-only place and somewhere you can sit down to eat. Counter-only > service is not a biggie. Speed of the food is somewhat important but speed > is a continuous variable, even at a single establishment: I can go to a > chip shop and, if there's no queue, have my order filled in under a minute; > or I can go in and they've run out of chips and I have to wait 10 minutes > while they fry more. Whether or not I can sit down out of the rain > matters far more to me. > > But we have what we have: a tag that seems specially crafted for McD, > whether it has seating or not, as opposed to a tag for somewhere with > no seats at all.
(Sorry for bringing this thread about cukiernias further off-topic. This is also related to the parallel discussion that started off being about bubble tea places.) This is getting faintly ridiculous. It is all good and well to use British English in OSM, but let's not extend it to mean that we have to limit ourselves to definitions of places as they exist in parts of the UK. Per guidelines set out by you, a lot of establishments mapped as cafes in OSM aren't cafes (Starbuckses, Costas, and anything even remotely similar), and a lot of establishments mapped as fast_food are actually cafes (McDonald's and anything similar). I'm half-expecting to hear that a Starbucks is actually a bar with drink:coffee=only. At some point we have to draw a line and say that OSM tagging of almost a million objects is unlikely to be changed, regardless of what the words strictly mean in British English. McDonald's is an extremely common type of gastronomic service in American-like-culture world: you place an order from a fixed menu, food is prepared from pre-made supplies, possibly being warmed or grilled but not a meal fully cooked to order, there is normally no table service, there is usually casual seating in the establishment, and takeaway trade is also quite high. There is no way amenity=fast_food is "special crafted for McD". Here's a local shawarma place near me, serving wraps or plates with assorted vegetables, sauces, and meats, assembled in front of the customer from prepared ingredients (links lead to images hosted on Google servers): - there is some non-fancy seating and there is also a lot of takeaway trade: https://goo.gl/maps/ve2YXgi29z8jstdH6 - ingredients are pre-chopped, meat is cooking on a vertical rotisserie, nothing is fried in a back kitchen: https://goo.gl/maps/PxUAyt4UXXT4wmW27 Here is an American import in Manchester that operates on the same principles: https://goo.gl/maps/HKxevHp8rpceQw8RA , https://goo.gl/maps/xZv2cH5LZZJ3QNaQA How should my shawarma place be tagged per British English? Is it a cafe even though it doesn't have a back kitchen and doesn't serve cooked meals? A fast_food? But it has seating. Surely not a candle-lit restaurant. shop=food perhaps? amenity=fast_food_with_seating? --Jarek _______________________________________________ Tagging mailing list [email protected] https://lists.openstreetmap.org/listinfo/tagging
