On 22/11/2020 11:24, Richard Fairhurst wrote:
[cross-posted to talk-us@ and tagging@, please choose your follow-ups wisely]

If you go against the accepted principle of not X-posting on a newsgroup, you've no entitlement to lecture how others respond.

Brian M. Sperlongano wrote:
> It seems that we are increasingly doing things to simplify the
> model because certain tooling can't handle the real level of
> complexity that exists in the real world.  I'm in favor of fixing
> the tooling rather than neutering the data.

Actually, splitting way because software can't handle it, is making the database more complex.

I sincerely hope "I'm in favor of fixing" translates as "I'm planning to fix", though I fear I may be disappointed.

More broadly, we need to nip this "oh just fix the tools" stuff in the bud. (etc)

Likewise we need to stop software developers from expecting contributors to add data purely because they can't be bothered/not competent enough to write a few lines of code. (OSM-carto demanding boundaries on ways & numerous routers expecting multiple foodways to criss-cross pedestrian areas, are just two examples)

Contributing to the database (also *volunteers*) are expected to map to a certain standard. There shouldn't be a reason to expect develops not to do the same.

Desiring relations to list in their entirety is *not* a "0.1% case". Splitting them into 'super relations' should not be the desired, final solution.

If developers are offended at receiving suggestions on how to improve their software, or even have it criticized, then they should rescind it.

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