> So in summary to make the value creation visible I would start making
> by making a model. To do it in a way that  "supports  and strengthens
> coordination and cooperation"  i would compare the continuously
> updated model to a theoretical Viable System Model [2].
>
> I'd use a TW -- the original but continuously improved reusable
> non-linear personal web notebook -- to make the model.

In respect of your suggestion some time ago I created a TW that allows
an individual to save and categorize information from TiddlyWiki
Google groups.  While it has some obvious short comings it could serve
in some way as a model to do as you suggest.

It uses TiddlySnips ( which is in danger for it is no longer supported
by the author) however it is my attempt to preserve information from
the Group in some kind of order including links back to the original
source. It needs more thought put into the categories and could be
improved in many other ways to achieve something similar to what you
suggest.

The rather random meanderings of the threads in the Group precludes
preserving the precise author and/or the best post within the thread.
However it gives good degree of order and provides a searchable means
of finding information in spite of having a limited number categories.

It was originally designed to fit into the Firefox sidebar for handy
reference purposes. See it here http://sidesnips.tiddlyspot.com/

Morris Gray
http://twhelp.tiddlyspot.com
A TiddlyWiki help file for beginners









On Feb 23, 5:12 am, Alex Hough <[email protected]> wrote:
> Hi Greg
>
> Re: "This last point brings us right back to the original thread and
> motivation for the feedback form experiment.  Namely, how do we make
> visible the value created within the community in a way that supports
> and strengthens coordination and cooperation?"
>
> As well as TiddlyWiki, I am also a big fan of Stafford Beer's Viable
> System Model (VSM). The model is intended to be used to design and
> tweak organizations so that they adapt to the environment. My approach
> to your question (very unsurprisingly to those who know me) would
> involve making a model of the system and  I would use a TiddlyWiki!
>
> In the VSM, coordination and cooperation are systems, 'System 2'  and
> 'System 3'  respectively. There are other systems which connect to
> these.
> *System 4 -development, looking out for the future
> *System 5 - identity, policy, governance
> *System 1 is where all the opperations are and where the direct value
> exchange with the environment is.
> **Inside a System 1 is another viable system. The model is often
> described like a Russian Doll, or like looking under a car's hood /
> bonnet only to  find another car.
>
> Systems 3,4 and 5 act to dynamically balance the organization's
> present, future and its identity, but they too are part of a viable
> system - at a 'higher level of recursion.' So the VSM is a fractal
> model - made up up of other viable systems.
>
> The VSM is an expression of Ashby's Law of Requite Variety. The
> systems and communications channels between them have to have the
> capacity for dealing with the variety (aka complexity). To be viable,
> the systems at each level need to be able to communicate the
> complexities they need to do their job between them. They also need to
> communicate to systems at this 'higher levels of recursion' . For this
> communication to work in real life, the varieties have to be
> 'amplified' or 'filtered.' otherwise people get confused, not listen
> too or give up trying to communicate.
>
> The background to the question "how do we make visible the value
> created within the community in a way that supports  and strengthens
> coordination and cooperation?" was an enquiry into  connection between
> 'the community' and 'those that Unamesa resource to help the
> community'.   Some people start  modeling starting with the
> 'complexity drivers':  Technology, time, TwUser , geography,
>
> At the moment one way of measuring the technological complexity of a
> question is which group it gets posted to: it's either a Tw or TwDev
> question.
> Other -- though possibly not very sensible ways -- could be length of
> question, length of thread, requirement for the question need to be
> posted in an example TW to give it context...
>
> We can look at the two google groups as two systems with connections
> to different elements of the 'system in focus.' I would say that Tw
> group has a stronger connection to System 5 (identity)  -- the 'value
> exchange' is that  TwUser gets their problem solved and personally
> experiences the identity of the project. The project has a satisfied
> customer and all those that contribute to the identity of the project
> gain some goodwill. TwDev's questioners  are more likely to already
> know about the identity of the project and there will be different
> value exchanges. New developments emerge. For the sponsor company,
> this link is a highly important structural one; between its System 4
> and part of its external environment. But more important is the link
> between its System 1 and the environment - it is a link that is often
> missing.
>
> Expanding the model from this point would then begin to show
> archetypal issues like missing connections and unbalanced complexity.
> Then some changes could be tested. For example reducing the number of
> questions from new TwUser could be addressed by tweaking the
> connections between the systems that produce the list of frequently
> asked questions. Reducing the complexity of the journey to the
> question (perhaps measured by number of clicks?) would make it easier
> for new TwUsers to find the list of frequently asked questions ,
> leading to less questions asked.
>
> The  question of producing  a clear list of FAQ on tiddlywiki.com,
> with the default option of downloading a TW copy with the list worth
> considering? It is a governance issue.
>
> The tiddler help and support tiddler[1] for example could be writen in
> a way in which the complexity  of ideas is reduced and unfolds
>
> HELP AND SUPPORT
> --------------------------------
> !Help
> Here is a list of [[Frequently asked questions]]
> !Support
> If you can't find the answer to your problem you can search our
> [[google groups|http://google.groups.tiddlywiki]]
> To post a question you will need to join the group. This is a simple
> process, the only reason is to prevent spam ;)
> The community is very FreNDly please jump in with any question.
> It your question is difficult, you might want to make a [[test
> tiddlywiki]] so that your problem can be solved more quickly, and
> become an example which may help someone else
> !!More
> A [[community wiki|http://tiddlywiki.org]] is for community members to
> share general information.
> The roadmaps for the project is at [[trac|http://tiddlytrac]] code is
> stored at [[svn|http:tiddlysubversion]]
>
> --------------------------------
>
> So in summary to make the value creation visible I would start making
> by making a model. To do it in a way that  "supports  and strengthens
> coordination and cooperation"  i would compare the continuously
> updated model to a theoretical Viable System Model [2].
>
> I'd use a TW -- the original but continuously improved reusable
> non-linear personal web notebook -- to make the model.
>
> Best Wishes
>
> Alex
>
> [1]http://tiddlywiki.com/#[[Help%20and%20Support]]
> [2]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Viable_System_Model
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