Just to add, sliders created using the <$range/> widget are now also smooth as butter, as long as the tiddler being updated is an unsaved draft, eg:
<$range tiddler="Draft of 'edit-range'" min=0 max=10 default=5 increment=0.5/> I've tested this on desktop and mobile. Even on desktop, removing the few seemingly imperceptible miliseconds of choppiness made a huge difference. This seems to make it clear that the benefits of delayed refresh go so much farther and are not limited to smooth typing experience alone. Regards, Hubert On Friday, 11 October 2019 11:51:25 UTC+1, Hubert wrote: > > Hi Jeremy, > > Thank you for taking the time to respond, I appreciate it. > > We could add an additional field that we check for along with the >> “draft.of” field, such as “refresh.slow” as suggested in the thread above. >> I don’t think that’s going to be particularly convenient in lots of >> situations (e.g. ensuring that $:/temp/search gets that field). Another >> possibility might be to use a special prefix e.g. $:/dampened/ or perhaps >> $:/volatile/. >> > > I would be happy with either solution so long as such a non-draft tiddler > is excluded from instant refreshes. Perhaps a tiddler having a field > refresh.slow could be referenced in $:/temp/search in italics (similar to > how shadow tiddlers are in bold)? > > May I ask whether this is something that could be considered for the next > release? > > I’m not sure what you mean here. Are you talking about the draft tiddler >> notification at the bottom of the screen? >> > > Yes, that's exactly it. I've found it's defined in > $:/core/ui/PageTemplate/drafts and have already overwritten it accordingly, > removing only the single "Draft of..." tiddler I'm editing using > <$edit-text/> widget in another tiddler. > > I may have missed something in the thread earlier, but you can keep a >> perpetual draft by not opening it directly, instead editing it via an >> edit-text widget from another tiddler. >> > > This is exactly the approach I'm taking now, but I failed to express it as > concisely. > > Best regards, > Hubert > > > > > On Friday, 11 October 2019 11:25:09 UTC+1, Jeremy Ruston wrote: >> >> Hi Hubert, >> >> Thank you for finding this thread from 2015: >> >> https://groups.google.com/d/topic/tiddlywiki/hlIvXE6jRys/discussion >> >> As you note, I think we are still in the same place: on lower powered >> devices, it would be useful to be able to extend the refresh dampening >> mechanism to selectively apply to tiddlers that are not drafts. >> >> The code that checks for tiddlers that should be included in refresh >> dampening looks for the presence of the “draft.of” field: >> >> >> https://github.com/Jermolene/TiddlyWiki5/blob/master/core/modules/startup/render.js#L82-L88 >> >> We can change that logic, but we need to keep it simple because it will >> be executed every time any tiddler is modified. So, for example, using a >> filter would be ruled out. >> >> We could add an additional field that we check for along with the >> “draft.of” field, such as “refresh.slow” as suggested in the thread above. >> I don’t think that’s going to be particularly convenient in lots of >> situations (e.g. ensuring that $:/temp/search gets that field). Another >> possibility might be to use a special prefix e.g. $:/dampened/ or perhaps >> $:/volatile/. >> >> You asked >> >> Now I have to figure out how I can prevent this open text tiddler from >> being constantly referenced in a red notification rectangle >> >> >> I’m not sure what you mean here. Are you talking about the draft tiddler >> notification at the bottom of the screen? >> >> >> and to prevent TW from saving it, because once it exits editing mode the >> lag is reintroduced. >> >> >> I may have missed something in the thread earlier, but you can keep a >> perpetual draft by not opening it directly, instead editing it via an >> edit-text widget from another tiddler. >> >> Best wishes >> >> Jeremy >> >> >> >> >> Regards, >> Hubert >> >> >> >> On Friday, 11 October 2019 09:09:34 UTC+1, Hubert wrote: >>> >>> Hi Mark, >>> >>> My TW now has 63k entries, and, in a meeting the other day,I was able to >>>> look up entries about as fast as people asked. >>>> >>> >>> That's impressive. Did you use a search bar or your own <edit-text/> >>> widget? I'm particularly interested if it was the latter. >>> >>> But that was using a Kindle Fire, which might have a stronger processor >>>> than a motorola phone. >>>> >>>> I don't believe you've mentioned what browser you're using. My tests >>>> were on an old version of FF that I'm not upgrading because it >>>> can still use TiddlyFox. >>>> >>>> It might be worth experimenting with different browsers. I believe >>>> browser makers have wide latitude in how they implement JS internals. >>>> >>> >>> I'm now at a Windows PC with i7 processor, 8 gigs of RAM and running >>> latest FF. The lag is still there, albeit of course not that annoying as on >>> mobile. Same issue on Chrome. >>> >>> >>> On Thursday, 10 October 2019 16:29:56 UTC+1, Mark S. wrote: >>>> >>>> In my case, I kept the tags but removed all usage of the tag filter >>>> operator. My TW now has 63k entries, and, in a meeting the other day, >>>> I was able to look up entries about as fast as people asked. But that >>>> was using a Kindle Fire, which might have a stronger processor >>>> than a motorola phone. >>>> >>>> I don't believe you've mentioned what browser you're using. My tests >>>> were on an old version of FF that I'm not upgrading because it >>>> can still use TiddlyFox. >>>> >>>> It might be worth experimenting with different browsers. I believe >>>> browser makers have wide latitude in how they implement JS internals. >>>> >>>> Good luck! >>>> >>>> >>>> On Thursday, October 10, 2019 at 8:00:47 AM UTC-7, Hubert wrote: >>>> >>>>> Sounds counter-intuitive, but I've just checked it nevertheless. >>>>> >>>>> Nope, 400 is much worse in my case. >>>>> >>>>> The circumstantial evidence I have so far is pointing to tags... >>>>> >>>>> On Thursday, 10 October 2019 15:49:30 UTC+1, Mark S. wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> I you know, I think experienced this before, and commented. Try >>>>>> resetting the timeout back to 400 and reloading. >>>>>> >>>>>> After setting the TO to 60000, it feels *slower* when typing into >>>>>> the input box. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Thursday, October 10, 2019 at 5:53:07 AM UTC-7, Hubert wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi Mark, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just testing now, and setting it to 60000 doesn't seem to impact >>>>>>>> the speed with regular editing nor inside a form box. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Have you reloaded the wiki after setting it to 60000? It might not >>>>>>> take effect until reloaded. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Is there anything special about your TW file? Have you tested on an >>>>>>>> empty ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> No and yes, respectively. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The lag on mobile may be more or less noticeable, which could even >>>>>>> depend on the size of the wiki and/or on the number of tiddlers >>>>>>> currently >>>>>>> open. I lack the knowledge to draw conclusions but I do suspect it has >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> do with the refresh mechanism. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> BTW. my wiki is just slightly over 5 megs. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Regards, >>>>>>> Hubert >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Wednesday, 9 October 2019 21:15:04 UTC+1, Mark S. wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> I've mentioned typing speeds in the past. I never found that the >>>>>>>> draft speed setting really changed anything one >>>>>>>> way or the other. Maybe it makes a difference on Mac but not on >>>>>>>> Android. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Just testing now, and setting it to 60000 doesn't seem to impact >>>>>>>> the speed with regular editing nor inside a form box. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Is there anything special about your TW file? Have you tested on an >>>>>>>> empty ? >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Good luck! >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On Wednesday, October 9, 2019 at 12:49:43 PM UTC-7, Hubert wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Hi Mark, >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What vintage is your phone? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> It's a fairly recent midrange Motorola. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> What version of TW are you using? There are size/speed >>>>>>>>>> improvements in 5.1.20. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I'm using the latest stable TW version (5.1.21). >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I tried your test on the full downloaded TiddlyWiki.com page on my >>>>>>>>>> 2012 era samsung phone. The speed of course was slow, but it was the >>>>>>>>>> same >>>>>>>>>> for the edit box as for editing the tiddler itself. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Thanks for having a go with the test on mobile. Have you modified >>>>>>>>> the TypingTimeout value before testing? I'm having a "native" (no >>>>>>>>> lag) >>>>>>>>> typing experience when editing a tiddler after setting the value in >>>>>>>>> $:/config/Drafts/TypingTimeout to 60000. By default, this value is >>>>>>>>> around >>>>>>>>> 400 (ms), which results in a noticeable lag in my case, so just >>>>>>>>> wondering. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> You probably know this already, but be sure to not have your >>>>>>>>>> "recent" tiddler opened in the sidebar. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Yes, I do :). I have it disabled across the whole wiki. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Wednesday, 9 October 2019 19:55:31 UTC+1, Mark S. wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> What vintage is your phone? >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> What version of TW are you using? There are size/speed >>>>>>>>>> improvements in 5.1.20. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I tried your test on the full downloaded TiddlyWiki.com page on >>>>>>>>>> my 2012 era samsung phone. The speed of course was slow, but it was >>>>>>>>>> the same >>>>>>>>>> for the edit box as for editing the tiddler itself. In either >>>>>>>>>> case, the upper limit to typing was my ability to use the tiny >>>>>>>>>> keyboard. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> You probably know this already, but be sure to not have your >>>>>>>>>> "recent" tiddler opened in the sidebar. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Good luck! >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 8, 2019 at 7:47:00 AM UTC-7, Hubert wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Hello, >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Before I go into details, my $:/config/Drafts/TypingTimeout >>>>>>>>>>> tiddler has a value of 60000 (60 seconds), which fixed the lag when >>>>>>>>>>> entering text / typing in a tiddler in edit mode. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> However, I'm still experiencing lag when entering text using >>>>>>>>>>> <$edit-text/> widgets (of course, the tiddler being populated as I >>>>>>>>>>> type is >>>>>>>>>>> separate to the one that has the edit-text widget). >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> This lag is negligible on my Chromebook or Windows PC (I have no >>>>>>>>>>> means of measuring it but even if it's 5ms then it's not much to >>>>>>>>>>> worry >>>>>>>>>>> about) but it is very noticeable on Android (using Chrome as an >>>>>>>>>>> example). >>>>>>>>>>> It gets better if I close all tiddlers except the one that has the >>>>>>>>>>> <$edit-text/> widget and I assume that the lag has to do with >>>>>>>>>>> TiddlyWiki >>>>>>>>>>> re-rendering all the open tiddlers as I type (though I'm not sure >>>>>>>>>>> if that's >>>>>>>>>>> the case). >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> What exactly is introducing the lag when using <$edit-text/> >>>>>>>>>>> widgets? Is it realtime rendering? If so, could the scope of >>>>>>>>>>> $:/config/Drafts/TypingTimeout be extended to also include >>>>>>>>>>> <$edit-text/> >>>>>>>>>>> widgets, so that the lag is fixed at the expense of instantaneous >>>>>>>>>>> rendering? Is there any other mechanism that is at fault here? I do >>>>>>>>>>> not >>>>>>>>>>> believe that we should require a multicore workstation to have a >>>>>>>>>>> smooth >>>>>>>>>>> typing experience. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Typing into a tiddler in edit mode and entering text in a >>>>>>>>>>> password prompt both work with absolutely no lag on mobile (this is >>>>>>>>>>> the >>>>>>>>>>> 'native' typing feel), but these are the only two examples. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> The <$range/> widget seems to suffer from the same lag >>>>>>>>>>> occasionally (it's not super smooth) but I'm not sure if it's >>>>>>>>>>> affected by >>>>>>>>>>> the same root cause. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Finally, apologies for awkward phrasing; English is not my first >>>>>>>>>>> language. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Many thanks, >>>>>>>>>>> Hubert >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "TiddlyWiki" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected]. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/fe01d5db-9694-480a-bb2a-bd0625a0812e%40googlegroups.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/tiddlywiki/fe01d5db-9694-480a-bb2a-bd0625a0812e%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >> . >> >> >> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWiki" group. 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