************* The following message is relayed to you by [email protected] ************
PS: I thought it would be helpful to anyone responding to my letter, that I had three very good releases from auditing, since I started getting audited in 97. The first release only made my tired spells much worse. But the spells were very deep and I could not even stay awake by walking around. But I was very clear and perceptive and powerful otherwise. The other two, I don't exactly recall, but I think they were pretty free of of these anaten spells. I had a release 13 yrs prior to getting into scn from a prolonged meditation, which from what I remember was all clear of the spells. All releases lasted about two weeks each. David
From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Date: Sat, 25 Dec 2010 15:47:47 -0500 Subject: [TROM1] BT (Body Thetan) was Re: Possession ************* The following message is relayed to you by [email protected] ************ Thanks to Jon, Pete and Ant for your input on my question on possession. The reason I ask is that I have a problem with day time somnelescence which means (in my case) that thoughout the day, every hr and an half to two hrs ( depending on how much stress I am under) I get a tired spell which I fall asleep for 5-10-15 or even 30 minutes ( depending how much stress I am under). Then I wake and I am in fairly normal conditon until the next period. It seems to follow a pattern similar to the bio rythyms charts you see in the newspapers. But my lows are so low I fall asleep. This is not due to a lack of sleep. A lack of sleep only puts me under more stress and makes it worse. But I can sleep 7 or 8 or 9 hrs and the problem still occurrs. ( I had this problem since I was about 14. I was in grade ten. I would fall asleep in one class in school in the morning and one in the after noon. I think the problem is due to getting a lot of severe beatings as a kid for being a bad boy, from dad. of which the earliest occurred at about 4 or 5 yrs of age. ) ( Besides the sleep problem in school, I would always get lost when changing class rooms and going to the washroom. They were not big schools, less than 200 kids. If I am on my feet and busy physically, I can avoid the sleep, but I get confused and disoriented easily ( and therefore accident and mistake prone ) on where I am and what I am doing. To the best of my knowledge and experience I think it is more like "anetan" than sleep. I had to quit work three years ago, mainly because of this problem. That was when I collapsed as I wrote in my earlier letter, which Jon replied to. I was working as a truck driver on 12 hr shifts and it got so bad that could not drive more than 20 minutes without falling asleep. I managed to work as a truck driver fairly well until they put GPS trackers in the trucks. Prior to the GPS, I would stop and have a nap ( where ever I was ) and as long as I did my work, no one knew and so nothing was said. I would also work in naps with my stops, so it was a bearable problem. But when they put GPS in the trucks they wanted an explanation of every stop, and it became increasingly difficult to do the job, because I could not put "stopped for nap" in my log books. I got caught a couple of times and got shit. At the same time competition was getting stronger and profit margins getting thinner and companies demanded more out of the drivers. I tried to do it until I could not go on any more. After I quit work, three of us in the Toronto area formed a little auditing group at my place. I would "pass out" a few minutes after getting "in session". It was extremely difficult for me to get audited. And frustrating. It was really bad after quiting work for about two yrs. after which I am better and my naps are now only a few minutes and usually no more than two a day and usually one. I have been off work for three years now. I have been researching this in every way possible and really haven't got any resolve. (I had some technical explanations with experts from Dr. Hamer's work. ) (They can identify the problem through Brain CT scans but they do not have real good tech to resolve the problem. They need to learn scn processing to get that. ) The only thing I am pretty sure of is that it is "anetan". I have had about 300 hrs of auditing (mostly R3X, but a fair bit of other processing too) and I told my auditors about it and they were not able to resolve it. I have discussed this with several very experienced auditors and they really did not have anything or anything much to say on it, or anything of any use. Now when I do TROM and especially R!s, I usually pass out. I find RIs pretty difficult to do. But I do do some. I usually pass out after doing TBing if I am sitting on my sofa chair doing it. I guess that is why I get better results while walking. If I take a good quality energy drink, like Rockstar pomengranite which has a lot of B Vitamins and is a very high quality drink, I can do fairly well. But they are fairly expensive at $3.00 a can. I do find deals on cheaper and poorer quality energy drinks, but they are not as good. And I get tired of taking them. I do feel better if I just sleep it through. I see this as energy drink as similar to scientology B vitamin therapy. Anyways, a few days ago I asked another scn old timer for his help in solving thjis problem. This was his reply: The problem is that it is not your case. It is attached beings. Locate a source of the tiredness feeling (and don�t wander or you will have too many in restim and nothing will happen.) Ask What are you and acknowledge the answer. Ask Who are you and acknowledge the answer. You can get into comm. And find out how it makes sense to be stuck to you but eventually it will blow. Find another one and do the same. Don�t worry if you fall asleep. Just keep going. It will take 2 to 3 years doing this an hour a day. End of his reply. This answer from him spurred my question on possession on this list. So now you know. I have not replied back to him yet, and I do not know what to say, what to do, or even what to think about his answer. Now; my first reaction to this, ( it was a bit of a shock, but not a lot) for one thing, doing it for one hr perday for two or three hrs is overwhleming. ( and I haven't worked up enough of that stuff it takes to do it yet either. ) And I can't imagine doing it it for one hr per day for one year, never mind two or three yrs. The other question I have especially to those who have a fair bit of auditing experience, have you encountered such a "case" before? If so, I would like to know of your experience and if you have resolved the case successfully? I also wonder how he came to the conclusion that it was "other's" case, and I have to assume he means "entities", which is, for all intents and purposes is the same as "possession". ( I am not afraid of other entities, or hearing what may be the truth about it. ) Is this a well known phenomena in scientology? Could these be considered "walk-ins". If you know what walk-ins are? They were made popular by Shirley Mclean in her books. That is when another spirit overtakes a traumatized body. I know personally of one guy who had been pinned under a overturned car and his body was overtaken by another spirit. Some other relevant data is that my dad had a similar problem, and my brother has a mild case of it also. So with all this data can anyone give me more insight or more understanding and especially a solution ( an easier one ) to this problem. David > Date: Sat, 25 Dec 2010 20:18:00 +0100 > To: [email protected] > From: [email protected] > Subject: [TROM1] BT (Body Thetan) was Re: Possession > > ************* > The following message is relayed to you by [email protected] > ************ > At 16:31 25-12-2010, David M. Pelly wrote: > >I looked up the definition of body thetans in the tech dictionary > >and it is not there, at least in my edition. > >Can someone please enlighten me on that subject? > Dear DAvid and fellow TRommers, > > The definition I remember when I was on OT3 was: "a thetan* that is > connected to the body, but not in control of it". That certainly > does not cover the many context I have seen the word used in. I > consider the subject of low importance, except to the few people who > experience something they attribute to body thetans (if it is a > problem, there are simple ways of handling without getting excited > about it), and the people who have gone effect of the "big fuss" that > has been made of the subject in Scientology. > > You would not find it in the Tech Dict. because in official > Scientology it was considered confidential, and I have signed > some (I hope) worthless paper saying I will not reveal this data to anyone :-) > > All best wishes, > > Ant > > * thetan being a spirit or being, or you could say, a spiritual being > (are their non spiritual beings?) > > _______________________________________________ > Trom mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom Thanks to Jon, Pete and Ant for your input on my question on possession. The reason I ask is that I have a problem with day time somnelescence which means (in my case) that thoughout the day, every hr and an half to two hrs ( depending on how much stress I am under) I get a tired spell which I fall asleep for 5-10-15 or even 30 minutes ( depending how much stress I am under). Then I wake and I am in fairly normal conditon until the next period. It seems to follow a pattern similar to the bio rythyms charts you see in the newspapers. But my lows are so low I fall asleep. This is not due to a lack of sleep. A lack of sleep only puts me under more stress and makes it worse. But I can sleep 7 or 8 or 9 hrs and the problem still occurrs. ( I had this problem since I was about 14. I was in grade ten. I would fall asleep in one class in school in the morning and one in the after noon. I think the problem is due to getting a lot of severe beatings as a kid for being a bad boy, from dad. of which the earliest occurred at about 4 or 5 yrs of age. ) ( Besides the sleep problem in school, I would always get lost when changing class rooms and going to the washroom. They were not big schools, less than 200 kids. If I am on my feet and busy physically, I can avoid the sleep, but I get confused and disoriented easily ( and therefore accident and mistake prone ) on where I am and what I am doing. To the best of my knowledge and experience I think it is more like "anetan" than sleep. I had to quit work three years ago, mainly because of this problem. That was when I collapsed as I wrote in my earlier letter, which Jon replied to. I was working as a truck driver on 12 hr shifts and it got so bad that could not drive more than 20 minutes without falling asleep. I managed to work as a truck driver fairly well until they put GPS trackers in the trucks. Prior to the GPS, I would stop and have a nap ( where ever I was ) and as long as I did my work, no one knew and so nothing was said. I would also work in naps with my stops, so it was a bearable problem. But when they put GPS in the trucks they wanted an explanation of every stop, and it became increasingly difficult to do the job, because I could not put "stopped for nap" in my log books. I got caught a couple of times and got shit. At the same time competition was getting stronger and profit margins getting thinner and companies demanded more out of the drivers. I tried to do it until I could not go on any more. After I quit work, three of us in the Toronto area formed a little auditing group at my place. I would "pass out" a few minutes after getting "in session". It was extremely difficult for me to get audited. And frustrating. It was really bad after quiting work for about two yrs. after which I am better and my naps are now only a few minutes and usually no more than two a day and usually one. I have been off work for three years now. I have been researching this in every way possible and really haven't got any resolve. (I had some technical explanations with experts from Dr. Hamer's work. ) (They can identify the problem through Brain CT scans but they do not have real good tech to resolve the problem. They need to learn scn processing to get that. ) The only thing I am pretty sure of is that it is "anetan". I have had about 300 hrs of auditing (mostly R3X, but a fair bit of other processing too) and I told my auditors about it and they were not able to resolve it. I have discussed this with several very experienced auditors and they really did not have anything or anything much to say on it, or anything of any use. Now when I do TROM and especially R!s, I usually pass out. I find RIs pretty difficult to do. But I do do some. I usually pass out after doing TBing if I am sitting on my sofa chair doing it. I guess that is why I get better results while walking. If I take a good quality energy drink, like Rockstar pomengranite which has a lot of B Vitamins and is a very high quality drink, I can do fairly well. But they are fairly expensive at $3.00 a can. I do find deals on cheaper and poorer quality energy drinks, but they are not as good. And I get tired of taking them. I do feel better if I just sleep it through. I see this as energy drink as similar to scientology B vitamin therapy. Anyways, a few days ago I asked another scn old timer for his help in solving thjis problem. This was his reply: The problem is that it is not your case. It is attached beings. Locate a source of the tiredness feeling (and don�t wander or you will have too many in restim and nothing will happen.) Ask What are you and acknowledge the answer. Ask Who are you and acknowledge the answer. You can get into comm. And find out how it makes sense to be stuck to you but eventually it will blow. Find another one and do the same. Don�t worry if you fall asleep. Just keep going. It will take 2 to 3 years doing this an hour a day. End of his reply. This answer from him spurred my question on possession on this list. So now you know. I have not replied back to him yet, and I do not know what to say, what to do, or even what to think about his answer. Now; my first reaction to this, ( it was a bit of a shock, but not a lot) for one thing, doing it for one hr perday for two or three hrs is overwhleming. ( and I haven't worked up enough of that stuff it takes to do it yet either. ) And I can't imagine doing it it for one hr per day for one year, never mind two or three yrs. The other question I have especially to those who have a fair bit of auditing experience, have you encountered such a "case" before? If so, I would like to know of your experience and if you have resolved the case successfully? I also wonder how he came to the conclusion that it was "other's" case, and I have to assume he means "entities", which is, for all intents and purposes is the same as "possession". ( I am not afraid of other entities, or hearing what may be the truth about it. ) Is this a well known phenomena in scientology? Could these be considered "walk-ins". If you know what walk-ins are? They were made popular by Shirley Mclean in her books. That is when another spirit overtakes a traumatized body. I know personally of one guy who had been pinned under a overturned car and his body was overtaken by another spirit. Some other relevant data is that my dad had a similar problem, and my brother has a mild case of it also. So with all this data can anyone give me more insight or more understanding and especially a solution ( an easier one ) to this problem. David > Date: Sat, 25 Dec 2010 20:18:00 +0100 > To: [email protected] > From: [email protected] > Subject: [TROM1] BT (Body Thetan) was Re: Possession > > ************* > The following message is relayed to you by [email protected] > ************ > At 16:31 25-12-2010, David M. Pelly wrote: > >I looked up the definition of body thetans in the tech dictionary > >and it is not there, at least in my edition. > >Can someone please enlighten me on that subject? > Dear DAvid and fellow TRommers, > > The definition I remember when I was on OT3 was: "a thetan* that is > connected to the body, but not in control of it". That certainly > does not cover the many context I have seen the word used in. I > consider the subject of low importance, except to the few people who > experience something they attribute to body thetans (if it is a > problem, there are simple ways of handling without getting excited > about it), and the people who have gone effect of the "big fuss" that > has been made of the subject in Scientology. > > You would not find it in the Tech Dict. because in official > Scientology it was considered confidential, and I have signed > some (I hope) worthless paper saying I will not reveal this data to anyone :-) > > All best wishes, > > Ant > > * thetan being a spirit or being, or you could say, a spiritual being > (are their non spiritual beings?) > > _______________________________________________ > Trom mailing list > [email protected] > http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom _______________________________________________ Trom mailing list [email protected] http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
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