Dave wrote:
Terry Clifton wrote:
DAVEH:
You are suggesting LDS theology adds to the requirements, yet
you seem to have requirements for salvation too, do you not Terry? It
seems to be a matter of where the line is drawn in your theological
world. In the LDS realm, grace is the action Jesus did (I don't think
I worded it very well) that makes it possible for us to be saved. Had
he not atoned for our sins, nor been resurrected so we too can enjoy
that gift.....then nothing we could do on our own could bring salvation
to ourselves. Therefore.....it is by the grace of Jesus we are saved.
That does not mean we do not have to meet certain requirements as many
Christians believe. Jesus gave the requirements....and as I see it,
many Christians want to minimize the importance and necessity of some
of those requirements.
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Everything
you state above is true. I guess that our big differences boil down to
what is faith and what is required besides faith. To me, faith is
repenting of my sins
DAVEH: Ohhhhhh......I did not realize you felt that way. I thought
faith is one requirement, and repentance another. But you apparently
understand them to be one in the same, Terry?
and
completely selling out to Jesus. It is no
longer me that is important. It is all about Him. My complete trust is
now in Him, denying self, following Him,doing as He commanded.
DAVEH: Hmmmmmm......it is almost sounding to me that you believe
doing all that (doing as He commanded) is a requirement for salvation,
though I know you really don't believe such.....do you?
Therefore, faith is a matter of devotion and obedience.
DAVEH: Then, logically wouldn't failure to be obedient be a reflection
that one is not saved?
Salvation does
not require that you be a foot washer, or a snake handler, or that you
speak in tongues or be baptized, or do good works, or wear sacred
garments, or go into all the world preaching, otherwise there could be
no deathbed conversions.
DAVEH: How do you perceive Jesus' comment......
But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved.
.......Do you perceive endurance unto the end to equate to
faith/repentance? To me, this comment suggests salvation isn't
resolved/accomplished until the end, yet apparently many TTers
do not see it as I do. What do you think Jesus was trying to convey,
Terry?
Terry
It's pretty somple to me Dave. Why would a Christian not endure to
the end? A follower follows. A devoted servant does not abandon his
master. It is completely logical to stick with the one who created you
and has the power to save you or destroy you. Anything other than that
is foolish. Are there fools in this world? A quick look around will
answer that question real quick. Why are they foolish? Depends on who
you ask. All I know is as of right now, I plan on enduring to the end.
Having said that, when Jesus talked to Zaccheus, if I remember
correctly, He said, "This day", salvation has come to your house.
Nothing about enduring to the end. Let me know when you figure that
out.
Terry
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