----- Original Message -----
Sent: July 03, 2004 12:31
Subject: RE: [TruthTalk] Divine
Nature
I agree. This has
been a good discussion... and for the most part it has been discussed with
level heads and calm hearts.
I would like to
point out something in your opening paragraph that strikes me as
interesting.
You said
"I am thinking that when we define who we are by what we do rather
than what we are and who we are attempting to become, its kind like the sample
(apparently clear) while the pool is stinking."
For the most
part, there are two ways of looking at life: with a Semitic mindset or a
Hellenistic mindset. Now, I am not here to argue the superiority of one over
the other, because there are positive things to hear from each one. I am one
who is more in-tune with the Semitic mindset... and this tends to
garnish me some grief here on TruthTalk. That's ok, though. This forum is
no different than real life. John, here, is one who sees things with a
more Hellenistic mind... and that's ok too.
John is
concerned with the essence of the man. This is clear by his concern over
"who we are attempting to become" and, for him, this defines the
waters of the pool. From a Semitic mindset, what we do defines the waters
of the pool.
Yeshua said,
"You shall know [my disciples] by their love" (an action, not their essence).
The essence is an important topic to the Hellenized mindset, so the question
becomes: does the essence of a man define his works or does the works of a man
define his essence. In like manner, "Did the egg come before the chicken or
the chicken before the egg?
Since these
questions both have two answers depending upon the working mindset, they are a
useless argument. For me, the latter of both questions is the correct. For
John, it is the former.
--
slade
It is a good discussion and an
good analogy, Jonathan. I just finished cleaning the filter on the
pool. We are fighting the green water from hell. Happens
once or twice a season. Its funny but when we dip a sample, the quart
container looks clear as a bell -- but the pool is green. I am
thinking that when we define who we are by what we do rather than what we
are and who we are attempting to become, its kind like the sample
(apparently clear) while the stinking pool is in drastic need of outside
assistents that will actually effect the pool itself.
Something else and then I gots to go to work -- I
have always thought of Adam and Eve before the fall as somehow different
from us in terms of human nature. Apparently that ain't
so. They were always susceptible to temptation as we and they were
always just as mortal as we -- hence the "tree of life."
The only thing different that I can see is the belly button
thing.
Have a good day all
a brother,
John
In a message dated 7/3/2004 8:01:00 AM Pacific Daylight
Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Just a few thoughts on this one:
In the garden were two
trees:
1) Tree of Life
2) Tree of Knowledge of Good
and Evil
The tree of knowledge of
good and evil was forbidden. This is the tree of judgment.
With the ability to discern good and evil we are able to judge (this ties
in to my earlier post on the conscience). If we work from this
center (judgment) we work out our lives from the Fall. If we choose
the tree of Life (Love in Christ) and work out of that center we become
radically different. Unfortunately I most often choose to work out
my life eating from the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil. This is
an excellent discussion done in Gregory Boydâs new book âRepenting of
Religionâ. I think that this conversation is vitally important and
am greatly enjoying everyoneâs contributions
