Thanks John and Izzy,
much of what I and Slade say is controversial to many on this list. Thats fine, a large portion of what we (dare I say it this way?) preach is counter to what most have ever heard. However, I see in some of you we have sparked an interest in learning the truth. We have a loving and compassionate God. Something I am very thankful for! Yet the truth is often ignored or whitewashed in the church. The church repeatedly teaches that the God of the Older Testament is an angry and vengeful God, bent on rigid rituals and laws. Nothing could be further from the truth. I thank God that minds and hearts are softening to His message. I'm also cognizant of the fact that much of this way of thinking is both strange and new to those that "Have ears to hear and eyes that see." Fully realizing that like Sha'ul and Ya'acov (ok, Paul and James) it is going to take time(Acts 15:21). Each of us in on that path, but we are all at different points in our walk, thats as God intended when He touched the council and directed them not to DEMAND immediate compliance. After all what does that gain? Nothing, until it comes from the heart. And when it does God blesses your socks off! This is not meant to sound like I think I'm smarter or closer to God than some of you, I'm only asking that you do as Sha'ul instructed Timothy, "Study to show yourself approved..." it is meaningless to me if you are approved by men. But it is very meaningful to be approved by God. I'm sorry if this sound offensive, but He doesn't want the warm fuzzies of most churches today. Please continue to study the scriptures found to the left of Matthew, Torah in particular and see what the God of Abraham, Isaac , and Jacob is saying to you. Because it is Yeshua speaking through Moses and the prophets. Obedience to Him is what its all about!
Whew! time to get off the soapbox,
Jeff
Jeff - Your enthusiasm for your faith is remarkable. And if you and Slade are on the same page, I understand that that we are members of the same spiritual family. How does that effect doctrinal thinking? To the point of sameness? Well, if we are speaking of degrees, then I do see many of us on TT growing "together," influenced to one degree or another by the thinking and thoughtful presentations of the others. The only way to avoid this growth by osmosis is to act out a response of disrespect and judgmentalism. If we can side step those carnal inclinations, we will find ourselves in closer union -- almost without trying. Your way of thinking is completely foreign to me when it comes to the Torah. Understand, this is not a criticism.......just a statement of where I am in relationship to you, Slade, Kay, perhaps Laura. I am a Gentile believer. My ancestry is Greek/English/Cherokee. I have studied the biblical message for nearly 40 of my 59 years. None of those studies reflect either the Messianic positioning of your faith or the substantive theology (a Messianic positioning, as well) of those who are viewed as far removed from your thinking, yet full of faith and love for the Savior 40 years of putting together a theology (The Gospel According to John ------ Smithson) that is both personal and Divine, or so I like to think. And yet, here I am caught somewhere in the middle of your thinking and the others. What is wonderful about the Message and the God we serve is that He is able to cause growth in each of these disciplines. We have to be thinking right about precious little. A very important concept because in that fact (I Co 8:1-3) we can be assured that we have all the time in this world to get it right -- to make it work for us. In the end, because each of us began this Walk with God from very different perspectives, accompanied by the necessary and even frivolous baggage, we should not expect to find unity in exacting theologies. In accepting that notion, we should not, however, accept our differences without a struggle !!
For me to honestly consider what you have to offer, is not only a mark of respect but a resulting product of brotherhood. Ditto for Bill, Jon, Lance. The center of the theological universe is always where I stand in relation to the influences that surround me. My center will have several locations during my lifetime, depending upon my level of maturity.
If I were a Jew converted to the Messiah -- I could not imagine thinking differently from what I see in you and the writings of Slade Henson. I have sat where I now sit, thinking about that very thing. But I am not a converted Jew. I am a converted Gentile. Never have I studied Genesis 15 as I am about to do. Never have I given much theological credence to "before the Cross." Never have I used the word "Yeshua." I have viewed the Old Scriptures as a history of the Christian Church. And that view has given me excuse to know next to nothing about that "history." And, if I am "right" in my consideration of the Old Scriptures, I am still wrong in my ignorance of what they have to say. I have more to learn than I have time or life, I suppose.
Your words following, are specifically what I saw agreement in, especially the bold print but not limited to that print by any means:
My friends, simple faith is wonderful, but God has so much more for us when we understand why he says to do this and not do that. We should study and not allow the corrupting of scripture to rob us of the blessings we have been promised. When we think we understand a passage, then its time to get deeper, and see if that is what is really being said. If the "church and christian theologians" all agree I suggest studying the original texts for clues that show us dogmas and omisions to the truth. Hey, throw your questions to this forum, I'm sure we can figure out the meaning and proper response better than some of churchianity's current leading commentators. I've seen it right here!
Love ya all for putting up with my experiment,
jeff
How close will we become? Not as much as either of us would hope but much more than any of us can imagine. That is the way of God, is it not?
a brother and a friend
John
