Ahh the typical Izzy can attack anyone else's character but she is given free reign? Won't work with me David. Izzy needs to stand up and be responsible for the words she puts out on this forum. I have made it clear many times I am sick of her maligning liberals (both politicians and theologians) in nearly every one of her posts. There is never any substance behind her attacks. Her slight to Lance today, while ignored by him, was uncalled for. Her holier, more scriptural than thou attitude is just plain tiring. Reprove me all you want but at least reprove her first.
In regards to the rest of your comments I believe you must deal with the words 'keep' before you deal with the words 'lost/perished' and 'son of perdition.' Basic syntax. Starting with your 'hot' words before dealing with what Jesus says leading up to them will result in improper exegesis. Starting with just the words instead of starting with who Jesus is will also lead to improper exegesis. You and I exegete differently. If you already think that your position is a 'slam dunk' than I doubt you are willing to consider any other position. Case in point: you were proven dead wrong in your exegesis of the Abraham/sin issue. Did you change your mind once the truth was out? Of course not. In reality I don't think you are here to discuss truth. Rather you are here to discuss your opinion (something you equate with the truth). Then again I just may be in a bad mood. I am sad to see that my plea for you to remove your trite 'peace be with you' went unheeded. At least change it up a bit every now and again. There is a reason Hallmark cards fail to move the spirit. Jonathan -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of David Miller Sent: Monday, December 13, 2004 9:31 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Intentional sin -- the Judas factor Jonathan, I'm glad to see you posting again. I would be interested in discussing this Judas thing if you are, but I'm a little bit intimidated that I might be maligned for having a different opinion. You really did not need to be so hard on attacking Izzy's character. Are you interested in discussing the idea of Judas being lost or not? In regards to your comments on the passage that Izzy brought up (John 17:12), all that Greek analysis of the words translated keep are not really relevant. That whole discussion seems like a big smoke screen to trick those who don't study Greek. The important word is "lost" / "perished" (Greek = "apollumi") and also the phrase, "son of perdition" (a distinctly apocolyptic phrase important in the study of prophecy). These are the hot words in the passage. Do you want to talk about it? There are some other passages that have important bearing on this concept also. Let me know if you have any interest. As far as I am concerned, the idea that Judas is damned to hell fire is a slam dunk. Peace be with you. David Miller. --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.797 / Virus Database: 541 - Release Date: 11/15/2004 ---------- "Let your speech be always with grace, seasoned with salt, that you may know how you ought to answer every man." (Colossians 4:6) http://www.InnGlory.org If you do not want to receive posts from this list, send an email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and you will be unsubscribed. If you have a friend who wants to join, tell him to send an e-mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED] and he will be subscribed.
