Charles Perry Locke wrote:
Kay,
Kay (to DaveH): Why not? Aren't you Mormon? Who better to ask than a Mormon. I would think
you would know what you believe or don't believe, etc. way better than I
would.
Kay, there is a dynamic at play when Mormons speak, of which you might not be aware, and that is that Mormons have redifined many of the words Christians popularly use.
DAVEH: Have I not always tried to make that distinction? That is why I have asked for other TTers definitions, and also given my own. It seems that some TTers have been a bit critical for that.
The net effect is, you can talk to a Mormon for many hours and, unless you understand the argot, you think you are in agreement with them. One example was pointed out recently, and that is the use of the word "Godhead". When most Christians use it (at least those who hold to the Trinity) they mean one God, three persons, of course. But when LDS use it, they mean 2 gods and a spirit.
DAVEH: That is a bit misleading, Perry. We also consider the HS to be a God, though one without a physical body.
They can talk a long time about the godhead before we realize we are talking about two separate concepts. Did you know that to a Mormon they do not consider themselves Gentiles? So when they say "gentile", they are not referring to themselves or to Jews...only non-Jews non-Mormon. For example, I am a gentile, but DaveH is not (and, he is not a Jew, either).
Many words are this way, and unless you make an effort to understand the words that are redefined before you converse with them, you will never really know what they believe.
DAVEH: I've tried to point out the differences in our definitions so that it would be easy for TTers to understand. But when doing so, I think some see it as evangelizing on my part, or perhaps they believe I am trying to introduce confusion into the discussion....I don't know.
Otherwise you have to ask for the definition of key words as you go. If you are interested in having a real conversation with a Mormon, here is a link to get you going: http://www.carm.org/lds/definitions.htm.
Then, add to the fact that much of the Mormon religion takes place inside the "temple", which is strictly secret (they say "sacred, not secret", can't tell you what goes on inside). However, when the inner ceremonies are revealed, they practically align with the rites of Freemasonry, usiong tokens, signs, grips, and penalties. By the way, they also claim that the temple ceremonies are a restoration of the original Jewish temple ceremonies. Do you think that is so?
So one can only effctively converse with a Mormon when one knows the language differences, then, they are only told the palatable "non-secret" parts. That is why the LDS missionaries are at times effective...unaware people think they are Christians, taking the words they use to be the same as standard Christian denotation.
Then, you don't get to know the juicy secrets until you are baptized into the church, and jump through several other hoops, then a Bishop (see the lexicon in the link above for the LDS meaning of Bishop) determines that you are worthy to enter the Temple, then you get to participate in the pagan rites, learning secret handshakes, passwords, signs, and grips (handshakes). You will need to know these to get into heaven. And, if you are a woman, you do not get to be resurrected unless a Mormon male to whom you have been sealed in the temple calls you forth from the grave.
DAVEH: ??? Where did you get that, Perry!
Blaine, DavidH, please correct anything that I have stated that is incorrect. I have gotten this stuff primarily from reading the works of ex-Mormons that have become Christians, so they could be a little off, or perhaps I have erred in my understanding.
DAVEH: Guess I should have read further.... I appreciate you recognizing that.
But, if you declare that I have stated something that is not correct, please supply the correct details.
DAVEH: Some is blatantly false (such as women not being able to be resurrected), while others are skewed to make it sound bad. Why can't you recognize some things are sacred to us, and do not appreciate other's attempts at denigrating them? And....Why do you call them secret, when they are available on the web? You have repeatedly tried to paint Mormonism with a negative brush of knowledge you've learned from ex-Mormons and anti-LDS websites. As I've said before, if you want to know what I believe, ask me. If you want to smear Mormonism.....nothing I tell you will make any difference in what you believe or post.
Perry
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