On Sat, 2014-05-03 at 22:36 +1000, Tim wrote: > On 03/05/14 22:16, Paul wrote: > > I am very aware that the code base is maintained by volunteers I > > contribute to two open source projects. On both we freeze any > > development on future for 8 weeks after a release to allow all our > > resources to be used on fixing bugs. > Trusty freeze started on 20th Feb, I doubt much changed since then apart from > bug fixes and the odd FFe.
Clearly Not > > > > The whole purpose of the original post was to ask very simple question > > "Is the balance right between developing future releases and making the > > current LTS stable? > Its not about balance?!?! Development doesnt stop because you want to use the > LTS. As it is 99% of fixes in the LTS release are backported from > the current dev release > > > > But the response that was given "I can guarantee you no one on the > > Ubuntu GNOME team is familiar with that codebase". From that should I > > understand that the Ubuntu Gnome development team have no knowledge of a > > key Gnome component ? > GNOME is huge! we have a small team that are mostly focussed on the desktop. > As I consider it that is more a niche component. I certainly don't > have time to track down corner-case bugs that might take me half a day, when > I could fix half-a-dozen far more important bugs in that time. > Consider Priorities ;) As it stands GNOME (Desktop) on Ubuntu in general is > probably 1000x better than it was in 12.04. IF there is something > you care about, then *you* should make the effort, to get the info to the > right people, in this case, we are not the right people! > > clearly a better name would be gnome-desktop and not gnome .... Then we would not have to be mind readers and take abuse when a quite simple and courteous " We only do gnome desktop is better that you ask here" would suffice. Way better than trying to belittle other users. > > > > On Sat, 2014-05-03 at 21:29 +1000, Tim wrote: > >> On 03/05/14 20:31, Paul wrote: > >>> An example > >>> > >>> Network-manager-openvpn (Ubuntu) Tags Trusy > >>> > >>> Bug raised 20-03-2014 > >>> > >>> Confirmed 27-03-2014 Affecting multiple users > >>> > >>> > >>> Status now 03-05-14 10:25 GMT Confirmed Importance High Unassigned > >> I wasn't really asking for just one example. If you have issues you should > >> provide links to all the bugs! Maybe we can't help with that bug, but > >> could probably tell you if its better filed with debian or upstream! > >> > >> You do realise that *everything* in universe is maintained by volunteers > >> right? You honestly can't expect instant fixes for these things, we > >> have real lives, real jobs and just spend our spare time doing this! > >> Besides, that bug is not a regression since the betas since it was there in > >> the beta's according to comments (which is what you were actually > >> complaining about?). Probably that is an upstream bug introduced by the new > >> version. I can guarantee you no one on the Ubuntu GNOME team is familiar > >> with that codebase, so you won't find anyone here that can fix it! > >>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/network-manager-openvpn/+bug/1294899 > >>> > >>> > >>> > >>> On Sat, 2014-05-03 at 07:48 +1000, Tim wrote: > >>>> On 03/05/14 02:31, Paul wrote: > >>>>> The version error I agree is not a big thing. I only discovered it when > >>>>> I was trying to discover why the gnome-network-manager that worked (yes > >>>>> I tested it) on the beta and release candidates of gnome 14.04 worked > >>>>> but on the released version don't. Actually there is a long list of > >>>>> things that worked on candidates of genome 14.04 but don't in the full > >>>>> release. What I find most is that the bugs that are confirmed and marked > >>>>> as high priority affecting multiple users have no developer assigned to > >>>>> look at them after 2 weeks. > >>>> Complaining about generic bugs on a mailing list is not going to help > >>>> anyone, atleast provide specific examples *with* launchpad links! It is > >>>> fairly normal for some bugs to slip through release, especially when the > >>>> last few weeks of the release cycle is spent stabilising the images and > >>>> installer. > >>>>> Given that gnome 13.10 updates end in the next few weeks it does cause > >>>>> some concern. > >>>> 13.10 support will end around the time 14.04.1 is released, if you are > >>>> really worried about stability then just wait for that before upgrading! > >>>>> On Sat, 2014-05-03 at 01:25 +1000, Martin Kelly wrote: > >>>>>> Hey, > >>>>>> The PPA your talking about isn't just solely Ubuntu GNOME's > >>>>>> developers. It is a general ppa for all Ubuntu based OS's. It is the > >>>>>> upstream repository they (Ubuntu GNOME) use before including it in the > >>>>>> mainline repository. This means it is maintained independently of > >>>>>> Ubuntu GNOME. So the bugs you are referring too are inherent from > >>>>>> GNOME developers not the developers here. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Aside from the version error, which I don't see as that big of a deal. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Regards, > >>>>>> Martin > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Sent from my Windows Phone > >>>>>> > >>>>>> ______________________________________________________________________ > >>>>>> From:Paul > >>>>>> Sent:3/05/2014 12:12 AM > >>>>>> To:[email protected] > >>>>>> Cc:ubuntu-gnome > >>>>>> Subject:Re: ubuntu-gnome14.04 > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Thanks for your reply > >>>>>> > >>>>>> The big question is how did so many major bugs appear in the final > >>>>>> release that were not present in the beta testing releases ? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> I accept the point about nothing being perfect and I would not expect > >>>>>> that. The point I was trying to make was this. Bugs that have been > >>>>>> marked high priority have no developers assigned in 3.10 the release > >>>>>> version of gnome yet we get gnome 3.12 in the staging ppa and > >>>>>> developers > >>>>>> working on that. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> So just simple question is the priority getting the bugs fixed in the > >>>>>> new release or moving on to the next release ? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>>>> On Fri, 2014-05-02 at 17:00 +0400, Ali/amjjawad wrote: > >>>>>>> Hi and thanks for your reply but please make sure to hit Reply To > >>>>>> All > >>>>>>> so that everyone read your email as this is a mailing list not an > >>>>>>> communication between two people only :) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 4:31 PM, Paul <[email protected]> > >>>>>>> wrote: > >>>>>>> Obviously not. But I did notice that it was added 2 days > >>>>>> after > >>>>>>> I > >>>>>>> downloaded 14.04 !!. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> We don't release any version unless we finish the release notes and > >>>>>>> publish that at the same time we publish the announcement :) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> This is the release notes: > >>>>>>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/TrustyTahr/ReleaseNotes/UbuntuGNOME > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> This is the known bug: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/gnome-control-center/+bug/1299912 > >>>>>>> It has been reported in: > >>>>>>> 2014-03-30 > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Why we couldn't fix it on time before the release? > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> We couldn't for many reasons that I will leave it to the developers > >>>>>>> and/or packaging team to comment on :) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> I do appreciate that a lot of work went into 14.04 but I > >>>>>> must > >>>>>>> say that > >>>>>>> there is a awful lot of bugs in it. Two weeks on from the > >>>>>>> release still > >>>>>>> a lot of the network-manager addons are not working to > >>>>>> mention > >>>>>>> just one. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> 1- Nothing is prefect :) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> 2- Expecting something to work perfectly is a story and 'getting > >>>>>>> involved' and 'do' something to help Ubuntu GNOME and deal with a > >>>>>>> 'huge burden' is something totally different and another story. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> 3- Lack of manpower + tight Ubuntu Schedule is another story. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> That said, you can't really expect something to work with zero bugs. > >>>>>>> That is just not logical and will never happen. There will be always > >>>>>>> bugs ;) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Maybe my understanding of an LTS release is wrong but I > >>>>>>> understood this > >>>>>>> was aimed at the enterprise. Hence the release date being in > >>>>>>> the middle > >>>>>>> of the Redhat/CentOS conference. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> https://wiki.ubuntu.com/LTS > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> I think when you review the 14.04 LTS release you need to > >>>>>> ask > >>>>>>> who your > >>>>>>> target user is because quite clearly being in the middle and > >>>>>>> trying to > >>>>>>> satisfy both solid and stable as well as bleeding edge is > >>>>>> not > >>>>>>> working. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> "I don't know the key to success, but the key to failure is trying > >>>>>> to > >>>>>>> please everybody." > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> This is what I personally believe in :) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> We know nothing is perfect. We know there are some mistakes and > >>>>>> bugs. > >>>>>>> We haven't said Ubuntu GNOME is No.1 as there is no such thing as > >>>>>>> No.1 .. however, we haven't given up and with the so limited > >>>>>> manpower, > >>>>>>> we got the LTS Status: > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> http://ubuntugnome.org/lts-status/ > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> IMHO, that was our huge achievement despite all the bad and down > >>>>>>> things we have. > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> And, as always, we promise to do our best and learn from the past > >>>>>> for > >>>>>>> a better future :) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Thank you for your feedback, we highly appreciate that :) > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> On Fri, 2014-05-02 at 16:09 +0400, Ali/amjjawad wrote: > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > On Fri, May 2, 2014 at 4:05 PM, Paul > >>>>>>> <[email protected]> > >>>>>>> > wrote: > >>>>>>> > Has anyone else noticed that if you go into > >>>>>>> > settings->details->overview > >>>>>>> > it report ubuntu 13.10. > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > The system was a clean install of gnome 14.04 from > >>>>>>> the install > >>>>>>> > DVD have > >>>>>>> > attached the source.list and cant see anything > >>>>>>> wrong. > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Hi, > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Kindly have a read at: > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > >>>>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/archives/ubuntu-gnome/2014-April/001897.html > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Anyone else get the same thing > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > -- > >>>>>>> > Ubuntu-GNOME mailing list > >>>>>>> > [email protected] > >>>>>>> > Modify settings or unsubscribe at: > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-gnome > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Thank you! > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > -- > >>>>>>> > Best Regards, > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > amjjawad > >>>>>>> > Remember: "All of us are smarter than any one of us." > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Ubuntu GNOME OneStopPage > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Join Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Test Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Contact Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>>> > > >>>>>>> > Download Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> -- > >>>>>>> Best Regards, > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> amjjawad > >>>>>>> Remember: "All of us are smarter than any one of us." > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Ubuntu GNOME OneStopPage > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Join Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Test Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Contact Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Download Ubuntu GNOME > >>>>>> > > > > > -- Ubuntu-GNOME mailing list [email protected] Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-gnome
