On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 11:36 AM, Scott Kitterman <[email protected]> wrote: > On Thursday, August 12, 2010 11:19:05 am Dustin Kirkland wrote: >> On Thu, Aug 12, 2010 at 11:13 AM, Scott Kitterman <[email protected]> > wrote: >> > On Wednesday, August 11, 2010 11:02:05 pm Dustin Kirkland wrote: >> >> On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 4:49 PM, Scott Kitterman <[email protected]> >> > >> > wrote: >> >> > On Wednesday, August 11, 2010 04:21:36 pm Dustin Kirkland wrote: >> >> >> On Wed, Aug 11, 2010 at 11:35 AM, Scott Kitterman >> >> >> <[email protected]> >> >> > >> >> > wrote: >> >> >> > On Wednesday, August 11, 2010 11:28:28 am Mathias Gug wrote: >> >> >> >> Hi, >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Excerpts from Dan Sheffner's message of Wed Aug 11 11:14:04 -0400 > 2010: >> >> >> >> > I guess the only question I have is where do I ask questions >> >> >> >> > about the KVM hypervisor, virsh, and vmbuilder commands? >> >> >> >> > #ubuntu-server or #ubuntu-cloud? it would nice to have one room >> >> >> >> > like #ubuntu-vm for virtual machines that would include xen, >> >> >> >> > kvm, virsh, virtualbox, eucalyptus, etc. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> As outlined in the proposal: >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 1) Development discussion happens in #ubuntu-devel >> >> >> >> * e.g. packaging, patching, debugging, development, etc. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 2) Traditional server discussion happens in #ubuntu-server >> >> >> >> * e.g. running Ubuntu on your server hardware or in a * >> >> >> >> virtual machine, getting it installed, configuration/management >> >> >> >> of services, virtualization, etc. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> 3) New-age cloud server discussion happens in #ubuntu-cloud >> >> >> >> * e.g. running UEC private clouds, running Ubuntu * in EC2, >> >> >> >> cloud work loads, ensemble cloud magic, etc. >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> #ubuntu-server seems the appropriate place to ask questions about >> >> >> >> KVM, virsh and vmbuilder. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I missed in the original proposal that development is now off topic >> >> >> > in #ubuntu- server. I object to this change. #ubuntu-server has >> >> >> > been a joint developer/user channel for a very long time now. >> >> >> > It's the one place in the Ubuntu project where users and >> >> >> > developers are on the same channels (yes, some developers are on >> >> >> > user channels, to help, but that's different). We discussed this >> >> >> > very change not very long ago and the consensus was not to change >> >> >> > it. >> >> >> > >> >> >> > I feel like this change was slipped in with other changes about IRC >> >> >> > channel consolidation and should have been (re) discussed >> >> >> > separately (although honestly I don't see the need to revisit the >> >> >> > discussion so soon). >> >> >> >> >> >> Scott, >> >> >> >> >> >> I don't think anything really changes in #ubuntu-server, from a >> >> >> development discussion perspective. There's plenty of >> >> >> development-related conversations that will continue in >> >> >> #ubuntu-server, perfectly on-topic. No one is getting kicked/banned >> >> >> from there, and no one should get slapped on the wrist for talking >> >> >> devel (in my opinion). >> >> >> >> >> >> I read Ahmed's proposition to really be about consolidating >> >> >> cloud/virt/ensemble/ec2 channels into one -- simplifying the >> >> >> landscape for those of us subscribed to all 4 and unraveling the >> >> >> maze for our users seeking cloud-related support. >> >> >> >> >> >> The previous recent discussion you refer to, I think, was about >> >> >> splitting #ubuntu-server and #ubuntu-server-devel. As I remember it, >> >> >> we, as a community, n'acked the creation/separation to >> >> >> #ubuntu-server-devel, as we didn't want to divorce ourselves from our >> >> >> user support channel. I still agree with that sentiment, and I think >> >> >> that's unchanged even in Ahmed's IRC realignment suggestion. >> >> > >> >> > Then I'm a little unclear what Mathiaz' point #1 is about then. >> >> > "Development discussion happens in #ubuntu-devel" seems pretty clear >> >> > to me. >> >> >> >> I think it's pretty clear, and 100% true. Development discussion >> >> does, in fact, happen in #ubuntu-devel. >> >> >> >> I haven't seen anything forbidding development discussion happening in >> >> #ubuntu-server. >> >> >> >> Have you gotten that impression? Does the above policy deserve some >> >> clarification? Perhaps that "general" Ubuntu development discussion >> >> should land in #ubuntu-devel, while Server-specific development >> >> discussion is encouraged (or belongs) in #ubuntu-server. That's just >> >> status quo, as far as I'm concerned, though. >> > >> > I did get that impression based on the complete lack of mention of >> > development discussion in the #ubuntu-server description and it being >> > mentioned in #ubuntu-devel. >> > >> > When discussing Ubuntu Server development, I don't think #ubuntu-devel >> > even needs a mention as that's not where Ubuntu Server development >> > discussions are supposed (as I (and apparently you) understand it). >> > >> > I'm not sure if it was intended to change the status quo or not, but as >> > written it certainly appears to me that it does. >> >> Okay, shall we ask Ahmed to update his proposal to note that "sever" >> specific development discussion should continue in #ubuntu-devel? >> Would that assuage your concerns, Scott? >> > I'd propose this as a revision: > > 1) Traditional server development and discussion happens in #ubuntu-server > * e.g. running Ubuntu on your server hardware or in a virtual machine, > getting it installed, configuration/management of services, > virtualization, etc. > * e.g. server package packaging, patching, debugging, development, etc. > > 2) New-age cloud server discussion happens in #ubuntu-cloud > * e.g. running UEC private clouds, running Ubuntu * in EC2, cloud work loads, > ensemble cloud magic, etc.
No objections here. Thanks, Scott. :-Dustin -- ubuntu-server mailing list [email protected] https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-server More info: https://wiki.ubuntu.com/ServerTeam
