If you aren't happy with the tool, then just don't use it. It's
that simple.
It is not very wise to say so. If all dissatisfied persons on this
list followed your advice, in the present context, this could cost
runrev very many clients. My personal view on this is that it is
better to express the reasons for dissatisfaction so that the
problems can be resolved.
What I have seen on this list is that you just want to get rid of the
persons who tell you there is a problem... and keep your problem. I
am interested in using the excellent product that revolution is. I am
not interested to have to accept to deal with problems like the
present ones for the months to come for the priviledge to use it.
For the record, Richmond was banished. He was brought back only
because I did intercede for him. The reason he ended up using cursed
language is because of his growing frustration at being asked to shut
it up on his discourse on open source. Honestly, your very biased and
overtly hostile email is an invitation for insults. A proof of this
is that you already received emails back when you wrote a similar
email to a user who had the very stupid idea to do the same thing as
me, express a criticism.
http://mail.runrev.com/pipermail/use-revolution/2005-December/
071769.html
Why isn't Rev more popular?
Jerry Saperstein runrev at civildiscovery.com
Mon Dec 5 20:30:16 CST 2005
Criticism of Revolution generally apparently is generally
disapproved of here. I've seen a number of valid criticisms
dismissed in the
same way as yours have been.
And what argument did you use to dismiss her claim... nothing but
Innuendo and defamation, something *far too frequent* on this list.
http://thread.gmane.org/gmane.comp.ide.revolution.user/71131
From: Chipp Walters <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: Why isn't Rev more popular?
Newsgroups: gmane.comp.ide.revolution.user
Date: 2005-12-06 04:59:20 GMT (14 weeks, 5 days, 16 hours and 35
minutes ago)
You wouldn't be the Jerry Saperstein of Font Bank fame who was
accussed
back in the 90's of stealing clipart intellectual property and
reselling
it...would you? If so, how'd that turn out?
The fact that you discredited her in this unacceptable ways probably
didn't help. She ended up insulting you. I won't insult you. But
being in the position Richmond was put or Jerry was put, I understand
their reaction. I don't approve it. But I understand how they came to
explode. They did it because some not so acceptable means were used
to discredit them and there was nothing they could say anymore to
have the truth restored. Fortunately for me, it is probably less easy
to discredit the person who contributed this to the community:
http://revolution.widged.com/wiki/tiki-index.php?
page=TutorialsTeacherManual
http://revolution.widged.com/stacks/
http://codes.widged.com/
I am a defender of runrev. And it is BECAUSE I am a defender of
runrev that I do take the time to speak out and denounce problems
that contribute to keep persons AWAY from this excellent product. I
don't know what game you play Chipp, Dan, Richard, but it really
looks like you are trying to prevent the members of the non profit
community to express their views and describe their needs on this
list. Anytime they do, they are discredited.
Richard said he was sorry to see freeGui not more popular.
Apparently, he was not sorry defaming the freeGui project leader on
the metacard list:
http://mail.runrev.com/pipermail/metacard/2006-February/009068.html
While it's hard to find a post from you regarding Rev in any forum
which
doesn't turn it into an opportunity to express your negative opinions
about the product, in this case it seems Kevin chose to finish a
thread
that was started here by writing to an entirely different list. My
apologies for thinking that this latest post from you was like the
dozens before it.
For the record, Richmond didn't hack to the RR website. I am
completely fed up to see the likes of you transform the truth on this
list and discredit persons who have been deprived from the right to
defend themselves. No hack was required to see the 2.7 announce, a
simple search on google was enough. Richmond lacked of judgement, I
agree. But he clearly didn't mean to do any harm. If he could access
to this page, the error was the one of runrev's not his (the page,
was NOT password protected and if you reached it via google, you had
no way to know you were accessing information you were not supposed
to access). The fact that he emailed a copy of the 2.7 announce on
the list didn't justify to see him banish. Anybody else would have
done so, there would have been no consequences (yes, I know, most
persons wouldn't have done so, but that's a different issue).
For the record, Xavier doesn't really have the opportunity to defend
himself on this list because Kevin recently sent him an email to tell
Xavier that if he tried to defend himself, he would be kicked out of
the list. He choose not to do so because this would simply have
prolonged the conflict for no positive outcome. He choose to leave
because he knew he had no chance to be treated in an honourful way.
For the record, I have seen some of you write on the improve list
(where Xavier has no access) that Xavier *knowingly* cheated
revolution. For the record, runrev doesn't even as a proof that
Xavier cheated them at all. If you check up the emails posted on the
list you will see that the first For the record, here are Xavier's
post on the list:
xavier.bury at clearstream.com at Thu Feb 16 01:16:11 CST 2006 wrote
on the metacard list:
As an enterprise user, i never got a wiff of a test cycle or beta
release...
Xavier Bury
xavier.bury at clearstream.com at Thu Feb 16 01:39:16 CST 2006 wrote
on the metacard list:
For some reason, and after lots of asking my studio license was
inserted in the list.
Then it was removed by Heather - and she never looked if i wasn't
also an enterprise user.
[...]
im seriously displeased at this level....
---------------------=---------------------
Xavier Bury
It is possible that Xavier used the revolution engine to update his
metacard version. But what the facts are is (1) Xavier has a valid
paid license (I don't know for what version, possibly runrev 2.5),
(2) it couldn't be proven he cheated at all, and (3) if communication
with runrev had been better, Xavier wouldn't have *UNKNOWINGLY* used
his copy beyond license terms.
So, runrev, is it possible to reassure your very many non profit
clients here that when such problems arise, they can be expected to
receive a *FAIR* treatment and not be expelled from the list with for
only argument "we cannot prove that you have cheated us, but we are
sure you cheated us and therefore we will act accordingly". I don't
know if you realise that such methods are *morally unacceptable*.
Either you have no proof either you have one. You cannot act as if
you had a proof when you have none. I don't know what the laws are in
your country but in mine (Belgium) a person is innocent unless you
can prove him guilty.
If you aren't happy with the tool, then just don't use it. It's
that simple.
And yes, Chipp, that's the problem. I have recently come to the
conclusion that I should better not use it, despite the fact I have a
full enterprise license. Because too many things happen in this
community that I find *VERY* difficult to accept. I find *VERY*
difficult to accept the very unpleasant feeling to be right in
Orwell's fiction, where what is called the ministry of truth is in
fact the ministry of lies.
Dan's email on Ruby was WOW. Very kindly, as usual, he went to check
up some very popular resource out there, and came back to tell us
that it was not worth checking up. Ruby was *far too complex*,
*nothing useful could be done with it*, *revolution could be used the
same way Ruby is*. But know that I am *very* uncomfortable with your
practices within *this* community, where you too often take advantage
of the credulity of the users.
Richard's email was similarly full of zealotry. For the foreigners on
this list:
'Zealotry denotes zeal in excess, referring to cases where activism
and ambition in relation to an ideology have become excessive to the
point of being harmful to others, oneself, and one's own cause.'
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zealot. For the record if you read what
he declared to be his favorite book, McConnell, you will see page
139-142 that an element seen important to produce efficient libraries
is good encapsulation. What his tutorial recommend is *EXACTLY* the
opposite. There are ways to achieve good encapsulation with
revolution, which could be used to design a very powerful library of
reusable widgets, but I have *NEVER* seen them mentioned by Richard.
I am personally NOT interested in this kind of zealotry and one-sided
discourse.
I do like revolution, this is an incredible tool, but like many other
users I am aware of the fact that it presents strengths as well as
weaknesses and that a few things could be improved. I am not
interested in not using a product I paid for. What I am interested is
in becoming a more satisfied customer. My understanding is that
runrev doesn't want me to stop using their product (at least their
attitude suggested they wanted me to continue to use them). They are
themselves aware of a few flaws associated with the choices made over
the years and claim to have every intention to progressively address
these flaws in the future. At least, I very much hope so and I very
much need to be reassured on this pretty soon.... I take the time to
write this email because the two last emails from the runrev
executives gave me hope.
If I am right, then the information in this email will be used to act
in an honourful way. If I am wrong, then, other users deserve to know
what to expect. I sincerely hope to be right.
Marielle
------------------------------------------------------------------------
--------
Marielle Lange (PhD), Psycholinguist
Alternative emails: [EMAIL PROTECTED],
Homepage
http://homepages.widged.com/mlange/
Easy access to lexical databases http://
lexicall.widged.com/
Supporting Education Technologists http://
revolution.widged.com/wiki/
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