On 8/26/2010 2:45 PM, Carlo Strata wrote:
Il 26/08/2010 18:59, RA Brown ha scritto:
Barbara Duprey wrote:
On 8/26/2010 3:55 AM, Carlo Strata wrote:
Hi Everyone!
in my head:
- the term "moderated" means that someone/a software appliance reads
the mail and change something in it to make message more "soft for
human eyes" (moderate it!) *before* send it to the list; this is a
behavior that *all* posts (sub and unsub) may be subjected (!!!);
this happen in the lists all over the world;
On this list, and the others for OOo, it means only that the sender is
not subscribed and that a human is deciding whether to pass the
message along to the list. There is no team that reviews all messages
prior to their going to the list, and no message text is ever changed;
AFAIK, the moderators could not do so, they can only pass or reject
the message in its entirety. It may be possible to set up a structure
and a team that allows the kind of activity you are referring to
(though almost certainly not while we're using CollabNet/ezmlm), but
so far there have been very few people who will do the current
moderation, and increasing their responsibilities at this point seems
unlikely to help with that.
One other thing that needs to be pointed out, when you start
"moderating" text you become responsible for the content of the
messages. Removing complete message because of spam is one thing
changing text is a whole different legal problem.
The list is either a "carrier" or a "Content Provider". The legal
aspects are different.
Andy
I think here we were discussing two things:
- how to avoid list lost (!), thread lost or thread break, when subscriber answer to a non
subscriber post; I think all of us agree to avoid this (if you accept the non subscriber post, for
the thread content richness and usefulness, it is also convenient to grant thread integrity); how
to change things to reach this is a list admin and moderator technical task;
- solving or not the first thing, if the term [moderated] is appropriate/suitable to suggest
people what the mailing system does related to a non subscriber post so that they can choose what
they want to do answering that post. My previous mail was meant to say no: the term is not
suitable, is not appropriate! Barbara explain that the term is used to indicate that "the mailing
system knows the sender is not a subscriber but for some reasons/rules decides to forward in the
same way the 'external' message to the list". Perfect, ok, but this doesn't help people (non
technical people: the most ones!) to best behave and avoid first point trouble. Does it? My
suggest were made only to address this trouble, improving the tag/term clearness.
Finally, none want here to modify the message content, I was only speaking
about (my) moderated mean.
Il 26/08/2010 17:07, RA Brown ha scritto:
> There is one item added by the software for moderated message and that
> is a header line "Delivered-To: moderator for [email protected]".
> That is what I and others use to "tag" the message as from an
> unsubscribed poster.
>
> HTH
> Andy
I understand this, it's ok, but the clearness for normal (non technical people), always addressing
the first thing above (!), is still loosen: there isn't.
Imho.
Carlo
Carlo, I would estimate that of a hundred posts from unsubscribed users, at most five would have the
[moderated] tag. With the scarcity of resources to deal with problems, as well as the other points I
made earlier, how can effort to fix this be justified -- if it is even feasible under the current
CollabNet/ezmlm structure? And please realize that *any* change to the tag, no matter how
technically justifiable, introduces confusion for the many people who are used to the way it works
now. I've been following this list for years, and this is the first time I've seen a complaint about
the wording of the tag. Its presence or absence, yes, but not the actual word being used. And the
other 95 posts would still have the problem of people not getting the responses to their questions.
As a stopgap measure, I think if those of us who notice such things would dig up the old.nabble.com
thread link, send it to the user, and let the list know that's been done (whether the [moderated]
tag is there or not) so nobody else needs to do anything, it would help far more than any changing
of the tag, and without requiring any changes in list administration. When the changeover from
CollabNet is done, there hopefully will be a cleaner solution that neither requires subscription
(list traffic is overwhelming to many) nor sparks discussions like this one.
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