I think if you decide to rewrite an existing application with wicket, the
names will be your least problem
(http://chadfowler.com/2006/12/27/the-big-rewrite). Even though you can use
the configuration part of CoC...
igor.vaynberg wrote:
>
> right, so i should rename concepts from code that was written before
> wicket just because we are using wicket now...
>
> -igor
>
> On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 3:32 PM, Ricardo Mayerhofer
> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi Igor,
>> "User feedback" is different from "Feedback Panel", and I think is this
>> difference is good, otherwise you will use one word with two meanings
>> under
>> the same project (I think I just defined ambiguity :)).
>>
>> Think about a project that uses a API that has a name for a concept and
>> the
>> application has the same name for another concept:
>>
>> String getB() {
>> return externalApi.getA(...);
>> }
>>
>> String getA() {
>> return externalApi.getB(...);
>> }
>>
>>
>> or
>>
>> add( new FeedBackPanel( "userFormResponse" ) )
>> add( new TextArea( "feedBackPanel" ) )
>>
>> I've seen the first in a project, it confuses people.
>>
>> And of course. frameworks doesn't dictateds application domain, because
>> technical things and domain things are different. Your user will never
>> ask,
>> "hey creates a send to server clickable here for me" (user name for
>> submit
>> link).
>>
>> CoC doesn't mean Convention Only or Convention Instead Configuration. Its
>> purpose is to speed up development in most cases and keep the same
>> effort,
>> as if it was not there, on the other cases. If someone wants to extend
>> submit link, no problem just do it and add it on the java page.
>>
>>
>> igor.vaynberg wrote:
>>>
>>> On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 1:57 PM, Ricardo Mayerhofer
>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Perhaps the name could be userFeedBackPanel :)
>>>> "One Word per Concept" (Clean Code, Bob Martin, p. 26)
>>>
>>> why should conventions of a framework we use dictate our names in the
>>> application domain? within our application "user feedback" is a well
>>> known term. so just because we are using wicket we should change it?
>>> this is why stuff like that doesnt go into core :)
>>>
>>>> I'm just talking about code duplication, add( new SubmitLink(
>>>> "submitLink" )
>>>> ) and similars many times in a code doenst makes a programmer happier.
>>>> OOP (object oriented programming) isn't always the best tools to solve
>>>> code
>>>> duplication. So sometimes AOP (aspect oriented programming) comes to
>>>> mind,
>>>> other times CoC (convention over configuration). (I hope Martijn is
>>>> happy
>>>> by
>>>> the acronyms explanations :)).
>>>>
>>>> I'm not saying that it should be in wicket core (as you guys keep it
>>>> thin
>>>> as
>>>> you can) and I'm glad wicket core makes me able to extend it, in a way
>>>> I
>>>> can
>>>> implement this (thats a huge plus)
>>>
>>> this kind of stuff adds ambiguity - that is mostly why it doesnt make
>>> it into core. you say "submitLink" creates a component, fine, but in
>>> our app we have our own subclass of SubmitLink we use that includes
>>> our css styles, indicators, etc - which again breaks with your
>>> suggestion.
>>>
>>>> I'm just saying that this is not a bad idea, mainly when you care about
>>>> saving programming efforts and clean code.
>>>
>>> you are saving a few lines of code by adding a lot of ambiguity. imho,
>>> the trade off is not worth it. but we still make it possible for you
>>> to shoot yourself in the foot if you choose to do so :)
>>>
>>> -igor
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> igor.vaynberg wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> in our app components with id feedbackPanel are often used to present
>>>>> a user with a user-feedback panel they can use to submit
>>>>> suggestions...
>>>>>
>>>>> -igor
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Nov 26, 2008 at 12:51 PM, Ricardo Mayerhofer
>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi Martijin,
>>>>>> First of all thank you for your response.
>>>>>> I guess automation != magic. Automation means that computers or
>>>>>> frameworks
>>>>>> helps humans accomplishing repetitive tasks, so developers can better
>>>>>> focus
>>>>>> on the problem being solved, rather than having to copy and paste
>>>>>> same
>>>>>> code
>>>>>> over and over (boilerplate).
>>>>>> If one add a markup named feedbackPanel, what is he intent, to make a
>>>>>> combo
>>>>>> box? Or he have to tell it again, in a different way? IMO it's better
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> tell one time what I'm willing to do rather than 2, 3, 5...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Martijn Dashorst wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -1000,000,000,000
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> First please don't assume someone understands your acronym du jour.
>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>> had to think really hard to understand that CoC means convention
>>>>>>> over
>>>>>>> configuration instead of the Dutch meaning "gay rights group".
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Second this is not a task for wicket. You can think up any
>>>>>>> CoCamania
>>>>>>> you want in your own addon framework and publish it on 'stuff or
>>>>>>> google code, but I won't be using it ever nor including it in core.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The biggest plus point of wicket is that it doesn't perform magic. I
>>>>>>> don't need nor want to have to wave a dead chicken in front of my
>>>>>>> monitor and spend the bigger part of the day wondering which
>>>>>>> incantation I did wrong.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Martijn
>>>>>>> On 11/26/08, Ricardo Mayerhofer <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I started to use wicket some time ago, and I'm really enjoying it.
>>>>>>>> Best
>>>>>>>> framework ever.
>>>>>>>> But I've some suggestions.
>>>>>>>> I think wicket could be better if it had less boiler plate code.
>>>>>>>> This
>>>>>>>> could
>>>>>>>> be reduced by using CoC.
>>>>>>>> Take the FeedBackPanel for example, you always have to add the
>>>>>>>> component
>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>> the web page, even if no special handling is requires (which is
>>>>>>>> almost
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> case).
>>>>>>>> Wicket could have some reserved ids, so if I add a markup with id
>>>>>>>> feedbackPanel, a feedbackpanel component is automatically added to
>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>> page.
>>>>>>>> Another example is SubmitLink component. No special handling
>>>>>>>> required,
>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>> for wicket sake the developer must add it on the java the page.
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> View this message in context:
>>>>>>>> http://www.nabble.com/Wicket-and-CoC-tp20706881p20706881.html
>>>>>>>> Sent from the Wicket - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Become a Wicket expert, learn from the best:
>>>>>>> http://wicketinaction.com
>>>>>>> Apache Wicket 1.3.4 is released
>>>>>>> Get it now: http://www.apache.org/dyn/closer.cgi/wicket/1.3.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> View this message in context:
>>>>>> http://www.nabble.com/Wicket-and-CoC-tp20706881p20708778.html
>>>>>> Sent from the Wicket - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> View this message in context:
>>>> http://www.nabble.com/Wicket-and-CoC-tp20706881p20709706.html
>>>> Sent from the Wicket - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>> --
>> View this message in context:
>> http://www.nabble.com/Wicket-and-CoC-tp20706881p20711124.html
>> Sent from the Wicket - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
>>
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
>>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>
>
>
--
View this message in context:
http://www.nabble.com/Wicket-and-CoC-tp20706881p20711626.html
Sent from the Wicket - User mailing list archive at Nabble.com.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
