Who’s this Art everyone keeps talking about? I always wanted to be entrawalled, but never knew who to talk to about it. I was extrawalled once, but that’s a story for a different list.
J From: vfb-mail@googlegroups.com [mailto:vfb-m...@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of jim phillips Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2009 10:18 AM To: vfb-mail@googlegroups.com Subject: FW: [VFB] Re: Artistic Fly Swap Clarification FOR MARK _____ From: markflie...@hotmail.com To: vfb-mail@googlegroups.com; desert-tr...@hotmail.com Subject: RE: [VFB] Re: Artistic Fly Swap Clarification Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 08:15:37 -0600 Point well taken Jimmy..........."it's all in the eye of the beholder." ............so-to-speak............my very simple point is that there's a place in this world for flies that don't nessessarily have anything to do with fishing, and that they have an equal ability to teach, entrawall, excite, challange, Piss0ff, and or install any other highly motivating emotional value to a person or people. That is, equal to any other form of art. Artistic flies can (as "some" fishin' flies can), tell a story, just as a painting can, or a dance can, or a movie can, or a book can. It's up to the viewer to give of his or herself and invest in the subject matter, if they want to reep the rewards of such effort. The tyer and the viewer both have to make an equal effort. As with any artform. <http://gfx2.hotmail.com/mail/w3/ltr/emoticons/smile_wink.gif> mark..... _____ Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 08:51:56 -0500 From: ray...@earthlink.net To: vfb-mail@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: FW: [VFB] Re: Artistic Fly Swap Clarification Well now there, then. The list isn't dead after all. All we needed was a good controversy going. I planted the seed, and Boy did it grow ! :-P Not trying to offend anyone, nor make anyone mad, just a few Tid Bits to kick start the list. Like Mark said, "Art is something you KNOW when you see it." Each of us can decide what is art to us. My point was that ART comes in many forms and genre. Have a Good Un. JIMMY D P.S. My apologies for my sporadic posts of the Quote For The Day. Had a lot on my plate lately. jim phillips wrote: For Mark _____ From: markflie...@hotmail.com To: vfb-mail@googlegroups.com; desert-tr...@hotmail.com Subject: RE: [VFB] Re: Artistic Fly Swap Clarification Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 21:08:40 -0600 for the list........... Jimmy, NEVER, EVER speak for me..........you have no idea what your doing. And obviously you do not keep track of current emails. I have recently told Don that i absolutely DO consider his work ART. Guess you missed that. You obviously also missed where i have VERY recently clarified Jim Phillips mistakes in my original clarification, (he had inserted some words of his own, including that bit bout "using exotic materials, fancy beads, and silk thread".....HIS words, NOT mine), so keep up to date if your gonna challange, or cause controversey. Bottom line, ART is something you "Know" when you see it. Just ask Stevie Wonder. <http://gfx2.hotmail.com/mail/w3/ltr/emoticons/smile_wink.gif> mark..... _____ Date: Sat, 6 Jun 2009 21:10:32 -0500 From: ray...@earthlink.net To: vfb-mail@googlegroups.com Subject: [VFB] Re: Artistic Fly Swap Clarification Who's to say what's art/artistic and what's not. Even though Mark doesn't feel that way, Dono's monster/Super sized flies are definitely ART in my book. I don't feel that using exotic materials, fancy beads and silk thread make a fly a work of art. What is art ? what qualifies as art. To muddy the ART water somewhat, I offer the following that I gleaned from Google. "The definition of art is controversial in contemporary philosophy. Whether art can be defined has also been a matter of controversy. The philosophical usefulness of a definition of art has also been debated. Contemporary definitions are of two main sorts. One distinctively modern, conventionalist, sort of definition focuses on art's institutional features, emphasizing the way art changes over time, modern works that appear to break radically with all traditional art, and the relational properties of artworks that depend on works' relations to art history, art genres, etc. The less conventionalist sort of contemporary definition makes use of a broader, more traditional concept of aesthetic properties that includes more than art-relational ones, and focuses on art's pan-cultural and trans-historical characteristics. From the Standard Encyclopedia of Philosophy. “It is not at all clear that these words – ‘What is art?’ – express anything like a single question, to which competing answers are given, or whether philosophers proposing answers are even engaged in the same debate…. The sheer variety of proposed definitions should give us pause. One cannot help wondering whether there is any sense in which they are attempts to … clarify the same cultural practices, or address the same issue.” >From the Standard Encyclopedia of Philosophy. In other words, what I classify as art, when compared to what you classify as art can be totally different, while both can still be classified as ART ! We had a thread about this some years back with several VFB members joining the discussion. Is fly tying an art or simply a craft. Below are some of the comments. Re: [VFB] new <http://www.mail-archive.com/v...@troutnet.com/msg06706.html> super realistic fly 2002/04/07 I would urge all fly tyers to take a look at what can be achieved. Vlad has demonstrated that fly tying (as shown on his mosquito web page) can transcend craft and achieve the status of fine art. Thank you Vlad for sharing your art with us. Ed At 01:50 PM 4/6/02, you wrote: Hi -- Ed <http://www.mail-archive.com/search.py?l=...@troutnet.com&q=from:> Engelman/Sue Atkinson RE: [VFB] new <http://www.mail-archive.com/v...@troutnet.com/msg06713.html> super realistic fly 2002/04/07 Dear Listers I want to say thanks for your kind words and interest to this my fly. Super realistic flies have no the practical purpose like almost all kinds of fine art, they only can give few minutes of pleasure looking at them (or many week while tying them) and I very proud that you like -- Vlad <http://www.mail-archive.com/search.py?l=...@troutnet.com&q=from:> Markov Have A Good Day. JIMMY D Jim Phillips wrote: _____ From: markflie...@hotmail.com To: desert-tr...@hotmail.com Subject: for the list..... Date: Wed, 3 Jun 2009 23:26:01 -0600 Guys, just so we're clear..........the "NO recipes Fly Swap" is NOT something that is about flies for fishing............i got one reply already from someone who seems to think that flies, "that work for me" is what i'm looking for.......usually that is what we swap...........but this time that is NOT what i'm looking for. This swap is STRICKTLY for "Artistic" flies that would be tyed for the wall as ART. Flies "should" be tyed on rather large blind eye hooks using gut eyes. Materials are exotic feathers, fancy beads and usually silk thread. I know that many of my fellow tyers are able to tie "mountable" fishing flys but these super flys are not what is called Artistic (although they are beautiful). Please check my website for hints and also the web for artistic flys for some more ideas. Remember - only six tyers - first come first in. Thankx! mark <http://gfx2.hotmail.com/mail/w3/ltr/emoticons/smile_wink.gif> _____ Windows Live™ SkyDrive™: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get <http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009> it on your BlackBerry or iPhone. **************** ><((((((((º> ************** JIMMY D. MOORE jdmo...@fishgame.com North Zone Fishing Editor - Texas Fish & Game Mag, Author - Moon Holler Misfits Fishing & Hunting Club, Humorist, Past VP Guadalupe River Trout Unlimited, Member TOWA, Retired Scout Exec. BSA. Website - http://bigtroutman.tripod.com/index.html ***************** <º))))))))>< ************* _____ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail®. See <http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutor ial_QuickAdd_062009> how. --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the "VFB Mail" group. 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