Been following this post. Fascinating stuff. Sull, Jay, Mike H, Enric... and everyone who's posted you all rock!
I'm so glad we're getting beyond the knee jerk reaction and into the nitty gritty. I read every single comment in both threads... something like 140 comments. Riveting. One thing regarding the most recent posts about blip's role. While I like the idea of giving the users on blip the ability to manage a blacklist / white lists I think it's rather over the top at this early stage in the game. I encourage patience. I encourage one step at a time. First I would counsel Mike Hudack to ask what's the LEAST we can do to prevent this in the future. The second question being... what's the SIMPLEST thing we can do. The reason why is such a granular user level blacklist white list for refferrers could get extremely complex. Not just costing blip time and development... but also leading to an overly complex product for the end user. It's quite likely 99% of users will never edit such configuration... in which case it might be sheer noise. But this is not the only reason. There is an equally important reason I recommend patience. The reason WHY I don't believe in it... it I think we need to acknowlege that all problems do NOT have technical solutions. DRM... is such a folly... an attempt to codify fair use into the actual application and even hardware layer of technology and the net. User level refferer blacklisting might seem like a great idea... right now... but give it time... I would however recommend blip.tv take a step toward it in the near term and just create a global whitelist / blacklist. Ideally it'd just be used in case of emergencies... like this. Blip may find they never need a user level whitelist / blacklist control. The reason is this sort of "messiness" is actually a GOOD thing, a very good thing, because this discussion is absolutely necissary. It is actually IMPORTANT that you send emails to people requesting take down... just as it is important that Mike H go meet with these Myheavy.com people and talk about the issue. The point is blacklisting is jumping right over steps 1, 2, 3, and 4... and jumping right to step six. While I think in this case MyHeavy was an extreme... and extremely bad offender, the larger issue is not one of black and white. It's an issue of netiquette... specifically re-vlogging netiquette. While you could create massive blacklists and white lists on blip this won't evolvolve the debate over re-vlogging netiquette.... indeed it won't do ANYTHING for the 100's of independant vloggers who host their own media... or any other service like vimeo... or anyone. I actually suggest taking a look at how youtube solved the problem. I'm not saying it's right, but they put in a simple preference that allows users to determine wether their youtube videos are viewable on different webservices.... And then there's flickr... they allow you to turn on and off the "blog it" feature... or the "view larger" feature... and all sorts of stuff. The point is.. when you start looking around... perhaps refferer blacklisting is not the best solution... perhaps it is a little over the top... like hitting a nail with a twenty pound sledge hammer. I have a lot more to say on the issue. In fact this isn't the first time I've discussed it at length. My primer on revlogging ettiquette still sits on my website... It's still a pretty damn good primer on the issue and perhaps it's time I brought it up to date. http://mmeiser.com/wiki/index.php/Mike%27s_guide_to_re-vlogging_ettiquette#A_call_for_re-vlogging_etiquette Alt URL: http://tinyurl.com/cjcz7 Needless to say, now is the time fore everyone who cares to collaboratively throw in on a discussion or re-vlogging nettiquette and figure out what they think is important. Hopefully just by kicking it around in discussion Mike will have some great consensus when he goes to meet with MyHeavy.com Personally, I'm sort of glad this happened... I don't think any long term harm was done... (atleast not yet) And though MyHeavy.com was playing russin roullete, a dangerous game of potentially getting their pants sued off for copyright infringement... I don't think they're completely evil. I just think they were extremely foolish... especially with their recent 12 or 14 million (or whatever it was Jay Dedman said) in VC funding. There is an adage in copyright infringment. It's all "fair use" until money changes hands... then everything is suspect. Indeed there is a inverse relation between money and fair use. The more money one has the more likely to get their pants sued off for copyright infringement. Need I say anything more then "youtube"... or "google news and image search" to illustrate my point. Indeed google is at the VERY forefront of this issue of fair use preciesely because they're a HUGE monetary target. But I'm getting of topic. Now is the time to hash out some ideas on what is and what is not considered proper re-vlogging etiquette in the vlogosphere. I'd reccommend starting another post called "a call for discussion on re-vlogging ettiquette" or some such and tackling this issue. I think we all have a pretty good idea 1) clear attribution - the vlog name at a minimum, and the original post title if possible. 2) clear permalink back to the original blog post 3) no commercial usage, and no ads in the proximity of any embeded video unless permission is otherwise granted... i.e. no advertising on any page with an embeded video without explicit permission. 4) no transcoding or rehosting the video without permission 5) the licensce should be displayed if declared 7) "sharing" features such as "email this", "post to your blog", and others... must follow the share-a-like principal. In other words they MUST at a minimum contain a direct link to the original post (permalink)... and the original video. No bouncing or redirecting or obscuring of these urls should be allowed. Anyway, That's my start. As mentioned above, I have a whole article on this. From back in the day when Delicious started supporting media. It was at the time perhaps the first platform besides mefeedia where users could widely re-blog media. http://mmeiser.com/wiki/index.php/Mike%27s_guide_to_re-vlogging_ettiquette Looking back now the thing is still as on point as when I wrote it... about a year and a half ago... maybe more. Perhaps it is time for an update. Anyone want to collaborate on a whole new article? Feel free to use my article, and my wiki if you like. That's what it's there fore. Even better if there is some other community vlogging wiki space people are using now? Peace, -Mike mefeedia.com mmeiser.com/blog On 1/4/07, Mike Hudack <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > We're embedding two types of control metadata in our RSS right now. > > First up is Creative Commons metadata using the "creativeCommons" > namespace: > > <creativeCommons:license>http://address.of.license/foo/bar/</creativeCom > mons:license> > > Second is MediaRSS aggregation restriction: > > <media:restriction relationship="deny" > type="uri">urn:yahoo</media:restriction> > > One of the things we'll be working with MyHeavy on is their respect for > media:restriction. > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: [email protected] > > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of WWWhatsup > > Sent: Thursday, January 04, 2007 2:28 PM > > To: [email protected] > > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Subject: RE: [videoblogging] Re: MyHeavy.com Disregarding > > Vlogger CC Licenses > > > > Mike Hudack wrote: > > >They have disabled their aggregation functionality entirely for the > > >time being. I just got off the phone with their CEO, who > > was very contrite. > > >We'll be meeting with them next week to figure out how to do this > > >right, and allow people to opt in and out from blip using MediaRSS. > > > > > > Presumably this will be a tag anyone can use? > > > > There is no licence tag in MediaRSS at present right? > > > > joly > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > > WWWhatsup NYC > > http://pinstand.com - http://punkcast.com > > --------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > > > > > > > > > > Yahoo! Groups Links > > > >
