Hi Davy, In fact I think it is completely appropriate that if somebody thinks they have noticed a bug or behaviour which seems to not be what it should to ask on the list first. The fact is that in quite a few cases something which appears to be a bug may not be one, I have seen so many instances where you have reported a so-called "major bug" or "deal breaker" and nobody else could reproduce it. I am not saying that there can't be issues which affect just a very few number of people or devices, that does happen in iOS as well as with Windows 10 PC's, but I have equally often seen people report what they thought was a bug and in the end a reboot of their device cleared up the strange behaviour or maybe something was changed which made people think it was a bug where in fact it was what Apple intended. Reporting issues which are known bugs to Apple is absolutely a good thing and I have myself encouraged people to do this and to do so in large numbers and not to rely on 3 active users to do this, but there is such a thing as the middle ground and going crazy in either direction is not always good.
Take care, Sieghard -----Original Message----- From: viphone@googlegroups.com <viphone@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of Davy Cuppens Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 4:59 AM To: viphone@googlegroups.com Subject: Re: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app lost focus issue? Dear Christopher and others The only thing that frustrates me is the resigned lazyness of almost the whole blind community. I've been dealing with Apple products now for 6 years and have had contact with many devs and people in the accessibility team and they all report the same. Very few reports are made by voiceover users about bugs or proposals to make things better. Indeed it is good here on the list to report bugs, as long as you did so before with Apple and 90% of us won't do this. I am on a social whatsapp citizens network to prevent our neighbourhood for burglary and there it is just the same, yes it is good to report suspicious things but please at first, do inform the police emergency number and really 90% of the folks won't do that. That's the same for our bugs to report to Apple. First report to Apple then report us. Davy -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- From: chalt...@gmail.com Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 1:54 PM To: viphone@googlegroups.com Subject: RE: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app lost focus issue? Wow, I'm not sure where this is coming from. Talking about a bug on this list doesn't mean that people aren't doing anything. People can talk about an issue on this list and report it to Apple as well. I also can't remember the last time I saw someone complaining about a bug in IOS and threatening to go to Android, but it's very likely that I just missed such a post since it just doesn't bother me which device people are using and why they move from one to another. I hope a post like this doesn't discourage people from talking about bugs on this list. As important as it is to report bugs to Apple, it's also good for the community to talk about bugs and learn from each other how to work around such bugs while waiting for Apple to address these bugs. It's also perfectly OK for people to get frustrated with Apple when a bug is reported and yet still hangs around without being addressed release after release. As important as smart phones are to everyone these days, and given how much we pay for our iPhones, we have the right to ask for long standing bugs to be addressed. We're no different then our sighted peers in this respect. -- Christopher (AKA CJ) Chaltain at Gmail > -----Original Message----- > From: viphone@googlegroups.com <viphone@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of > Davy Cuppens > Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 4:38 AM > To: viphone@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app > lost focus issue? > > Sieghard you got the point indeed I am not gona send them A10s > fighters planes > (grin) to bomb the company but I am simply reporting them every > remaining bug every 2 weeks if they like it or not but for all those > that are only moaning and complaining here, then do nothing and stay > with your bugs that you are all liking so much. And please stop > moaning and complaining about them simply live with it or go to > android. I'm so fed up with that extremely lefty and resigning > attitude of 90% of the vips on earth. > Davy > > -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- > From: Sieghard Weitzel > Sent: Saturday, May 23, 2020 5:59 AM > To: viphone@googlegroups.com > Subject: RE: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app > lost focus issue? > > I think Davy is simply saying in a slightly dramatic way that > everybody should write to Apple Accessibility about this and other > bugs. > > > -----Original Message----- > From: viphone@googlegroups.com <viphone@googlegroups.com> On Behalf Of > Carolyn > Sent: Friday, May 22, 2020 11:48 AM > To: viphone@googlegroups.com > Subject: RE: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app > lost focus issue? > > I'm with you though, Lynn. > > -----Original Message----- > From: viphone@googlegroups.com [mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com] On > Behalf Of Lynn White > Sent: Friday, May 22, 2020 2:32 PM > To: viphone@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app > lost focus issue? > > No. Bombing any server is a rotten idea. That is a very negative > action and is likely not to receive a positive reaction. > > I hope that the moderator will not mind me saying this. But whenever > I hear that someone wants to “bomb” a company, it sounds like spoiled > brats wanting their way using any means necessary. Not casting > personal attacks on anyone whatsoever. > > There are probably several useful methods that we can use to point out > problems witha service or app. The one that comes to mind in this > situation is to send a detailed description of the problem to the > Apple Accessible team each time a new major update happens. > > It would probably be quite helpful to thank the team for any > improvements that are made and point those improvements out. > > I’m just thinking of how I would receive such a helpful message if I > was on such a team. > > I hope that this is helpful and trust me, I am not at all downing > people who might disagree with me. > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On May 22, 2020, at 1:15 PM, Davy Cuppens <davycupp...@gmail.com> wrote: > > > > > BOMB do bomb their servers every day on and on and on! > You are all saying of course we do, but maybe when 2000 read this just 2 > or > 3 will do so because I feel blinds are often so uncomplained resigned > people > others will do that in my place me I do not have the writing skills to do > so > and other bad reasons not to write to Apple. > > So, now, this evening, everybody involved with this tramendous bug DO > report > it now and let’s say every week again and again! > > Davy > > From: Lynn White <mailto:lynnwhite...@gmail.com> > Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2020 9:29 PM > To: viphone@googlegroups.com <mailto:viphone@googlegroups.com> > Subject: Re: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app lost > focus issue? > > Hi Allen, > > This is so refreshing to hear. I have a friend who, every time there is > an > update, he refers to Apple engineers and beta testers in all kinds of ways > other than children of God. > > I encourage him to either write to Accessibility and/or become a beta > tester > which he would be great at. To this day, he has done neither. > > And you’re right. It will take beating that drum patiently and > courteously > until this issue is fixed. It probably won’t be until maybe IOS 14 comes > out. > > > Sent from my iPhone > > > On May 21, 2020, at 2:24 PM, 'Kimberly Samco' via VIPhone > <viphone@googlegroups.com> wrote: > > > > > Thank you for making it so easy to write to Apple. I’ve sent them an > e-mail. > > Kim > > > On May 21, 2020, at 10:59 AM, Richard Turner <richardturne...@outlook.com> > wrote: > > > > > > Yes, anyone experiencing this should write accessibil...@apple.com > <mailto:accessibil...@apple.com> > > > > > > > > Richard > > "There's a nap for that." - an anonymous cat in a window in Portland, > Oregon. > > > > > > From: 'Kimberly Samco' via VIPhone <viphone@googlegroups.com> > Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2020 10:41 AM > To: viphone@googlegroups.com > Subject: Re: Experience of others with iOS 13.5 and native Mail app lost > focus issue? > > > > Yes. This is irritating. I planned to ask this group about this but didn’t > know the word for it which is “focus”, so thank you for that. > > > > So now what? Do we just wait for the next update? Write to Apple > accessibility? > > > > Thanks for any direction. > > > > Kim > > > > > > > > > > On May 21, 2020, at 9:10 AM, Alan Lemly <wale...@gmail.com > <mailto:wale...@gmail.com> > wrote: > > > > Hi List, > > > > I'm still disappointed that the native Mail app loses focus when I've > reviewing emails with it in iOS 13.5. I have a gmail account and review > emails in threads and the Mail app has been unable to retain focus on the > message on which I'm located ever since iOS 13 came out. It doesn't seem > to > do any better with iOS 13.5 than it has with other iterations. If a new > email comes in while focus is at the bottom of the screen on a much older > message, focus is jumping to this new email. It also isn't keeping focus > correctly when I expand a thread containing multiple messages. > > > > Are others still experiencing this behavior? Has anyone come up with > procedures to work with this focus issue because I find going through my > new > emails each morning to be a major pain and time waster. > > > > Thanks in advance for your comments. > > > > Alan Lemly > > -- > The following information is important for all members of the V iPhone > list. > > If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or > if > you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners > or > moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself. > > Your V iPhone list moderator is Mark Taylor. Mark can be reached at: > mk...@ucla.edu <mailto:mk...@ucla.edu> . 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