On Nov 14, 2023, at 11:22 AM, CJ & AA MAY <[email protected]> wrote:
You may have a point here as I am interested to know what people look like and
amsurprised when they turn out not to be at all like I'd imagined.
It troubles me a little to realise, as I write this, that I have no idea what
my husband now looks like. If he went missing, there is very little I could say
to help find him.
Alison
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Carolyn
Arnold
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2023 4:20 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
I agree with Sieghard. My guess, and this is only a guess is that the ones of
us who have had some or full sight are more willing to hear what Be My A I
might say about our expression.
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
Christopher Chaltain
Sent: Tuesday, November 14, 2023 9:05 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
I would agree with Sieghard, but I suspect what Mary and others are getting at
is not what they choose to use or not but what others are using and how that
might affect how they interpret the world based on those AI generated
descriptions. As Mary says though, anytime you're getting a description from
another source, even if it's a sighted person, it isn't going to be free of
interpretation.
Reminds me of a friend of mine in college who was helping me pick out a greeting card.
She told me she would just describe the card to me and wouldn't be subjective at all.
Later on she described a card as "yucky yellow." We had a good laugh over that,
but I didn't get that card.
For those who don't want any kind of interpretation of a description coming
from an AI, I wonder what they would consider an acceptable description. I'd
find it interesting if someone took a response from Be My AI and then
sterilized it into what they would find acceptable. I'm guessing that the more
sterile descriptions wouldn't be nearly as popular and most people find the
interpretation of the image as one of the more interesting parts of the
description.
--
Christopher (AKA CJ) =>÷
Chaltain at Outlook, USA
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Sieghard
Weitzel
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2023 10:13 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
Anybody who does not like or agree with some of the interpretations of the AI
is free not to use the service.
Just as you may not appreciate it, I have so far felt that even descriptions
which included descriptions of facial expressions were actually amazingly
correct when I asked sighted people to tell me what they thought of the
desdcription and whether they agtreed that the interpretation was good or not.
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Mary
Otten
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2023 7:37 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
I do not want to know what some artificial intelligence thinks somebody’s
expression means. Cultural stuff hugely influences that sort of thing. And as a
totally blind person from birth, I can’t tell you how many times people have
asked me why are you angry? Because I’m not smiling. Apparently you’re supposed
to go around smiling all the time especially if you’re a woman. So I don’t
trust AI male centric and Eurocentric as it must obviously be, based on who is
making these glorious language models and facial expression models etc.I don’t
want it. I want human to human interaction, and never mind somebody else
assuming they know what I’m thinking because of how my face looks. I sure don’t
want to inflict that misunderstanding on somebody else.
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 13, 2023, at 6:49 PM, realman02 via VIPhone <[email protected]>
wrote:
Good points, Kelly. The reason it bothers me is that it's not human-to-human
interaction; it's a large language model that's making those judgements.
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of Kellie
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2023 9:21 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
I think the other thing that people need to keep in mind, it’s just because an
artificial intelligence says that’s your expression doesn’t mean you have to
believe it. You can ask follow-up questions. The beauty is we have deductive
reasoning and can make that determination with further input. Also, if you’re
totally blind, every input of an expression is going to be through hearsay
whether it’s artificial intelligence or another human being. You’re still going
by their interpretation of the expression, not your own judgment. Every single
thing that is described to us is through someone else’s eyes or interpretation
of what they visually perceive it to be. That means, every description is
suspect since no two people are going to take away the same thing. That’s why
it doesn’t really bother me if the artificial intelligence Gives an answer that
isn’t maybe how I’m feeling or etc. because I can use my reasoning to figure it
out.
Kellie and my lovable Lady J
Sent from my iPhone
On Nov 13, 2023, at 7:26 PM, Carolyn Arnold <[email protected]> wrote:
I agree with that. The Be my A I is just telling us what we'd see, if we could
- hairy arm; stern expression. I would want it to tell me what it sees.
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of
Robert Doc Wright
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2023 4:50 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
What is wrong with the truth?
----- Original Message -----
From: Cristóbal Muñoz <mailto:[email protected]>
To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2023 2:09 PM
Subject: RE: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
This topic reminds me of these two articles.
Blind Olympic athletes show the universal nature of pride and shame
<https://www.nationalgeographic.com/science/article/blind-olympic-athletes-show-the-universal-nature-of-pride-and-shame>
The role of visual experience in the production of emotional facial expressions by
blind people: <https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5902524/>
Sometimes, BeMyEyes descriptions aren’t appreciated. The other day, I used it
to snap a photo of a bag of green coffee beans that I wanted to roast. I held
the bag of beans in my left hand and snapped the picture with my iPhone in my
right hand. BeMyEyes came back with a description of the type of bean, region
where they were grown, altitude and a whole bunch of other info I wouldn’t
gotten if I tried using SeeingAI. Cool cool…
At the end of the very detailed description, BeMyEyes also wrote that the bag
was being held by someone with a harry arm. WTH! What’s up with the
editorializing?
Cristóbal
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <[email protected]> On Behalf Of
Sieghard Weitzel
Sent: Monday, November 13, 2023 12:31 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
What did your friend say about your expression? I assume it described you as
"serious" because you weren't smiling.
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
<[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]> > On Behalf Of Malcolm
Parfitt
Sent: Sunday, November 12, 2023 4:52 PM
To: [email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Be My AI and what it may teach us?
Hello friends.
I appreciate that none of you know me personally and like me have no idea
what I look like.
However, at my request a friend of mine took a picture of me recently when we
were in what we call in the UK a pub. I was very interested in the results I
obtained when asking Be My AI to describe the photo. It’s description was:
The man in the picture has a fair complexion and a sturdy build. His hair is
short and appears to be a mix of gray and black, and he has a full head of
hair. His eyes are partially closed, and he has a somewhat stern or serious
expression on his face. His nose is prominent and he has full lips. He is
clean-shaven.
He is wearing a dark-colored polo shirt with a collar. The shirt has a small embroidery
on the right side of his chest that reads "Samuel Smith" in a cursive font with
gold thread. The shirt appears to be of a comfortable fit.
The lighting in the picture is focused on him, making him the central element
of the image. There is no additional information provided about the man, such
as his name or what he is doing in the pub.
What interested me most is that this is the closest we can get to a sighted
person looking in a mirror.
The other thing that struck me was the description of my expression. I had
never really thought about expressions but I suddenly thought are expressions
learned or natural. How far do our expressions mirror those of sighted people.
I didn’t feel serious at the time, and if Be My AI’s description of my
expression was accurate then why would I look serious?
Do our expressions really express our mood as sighted people’s do?
Not really an Apple question admittedly but an interesting subject.
Apologies in advance for the off-topic post but I would be most interested in
your opinions.
Malcolm Parfitt
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