As usual, your emotions get the better of logic. First of all, not all Muslims are suicide bombers nor is this an action that is supported by the general region. Also, how do you separate this action from when we operate when we bomb from the air? Of course, you can say that we are trying to hit bad people, which we miss on occasion, but we are sorry when innocent people are killed. We killed thousands and destroyed a society in an attempt to kill a few people who might try to hurt us in the future. But this is ok with you because we are acting in self defense, but the suicide bombers are not. In fact, this is he only way they have to fight us and the better armed countries that take their goods and pride.

As for my acrimonious feelings about this country, you seem not to understand the difference in feeling acrimonious about the actions of the Bush administration and a love of country. Apparently you approve of everything the administration has done. I hope you do not have a mortgage and have a good job that stays in this country. I will wait to see how you feel in the future if past actions are not personal enough to get your acrimony.

Ed

On Nov 2, 2008, at 4:55 PM, Mark Iverson wrote:

Gee Ed, I don't know any christians, buddists, scientologists or any other belief systems that want to wipe out other belief systems; that would strap bombs on their children and handicapped, let
alone 'sane' adults, all in the name of their religion/god.

With all the acrimonious feelings you have about this country, sounds like you'd be much happier in
Iraq or Iran!  I'll buy your ticket...

-Mark


-----Original Message-----
From: Edmund Storms [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, November 02, 2008 2:38 PM
To: [email protected]
Cc: Edmund Storms
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Colin Powell and Kareem Rashad Sultan Khan

How do you tell the good Christians from the bad Christians, Richard?
Surely you know that bad Christians exist. I suggest you use the same method you would apply to
Christians.

Ed


On Nov 2, 2008, at 3:29 PM, Jed Rothwell wrote:

R C Macaulay wrote:

These people have their religious mandate to kill us. You try
separating the good muslims from the bad ones because I can't see the
difference.

Not a problem! Not long ago, by historical standards, most Japanese
people had it in for us, and were determined to kill Americans. It was
more or less a religious thing -- Emperor worship, in their case. I
knew a good many of them, although they are mostly dead by now. They
fell into two groups, easily recognizable:

1. People who were formerly committed to killing Americans, but who no
longer felt that way. This was the vast majority.

2. People who still have it in for us, and/or the Russians, Chinese,
Koreans, and anyone else they went to war with in the 1930s and 40s.
They are mostly tattooed gangsters (yakuza) who drive around in large
trucks playing military music at high volume, to cause trouble and
bother the neighborhood. You can't miss 'em. In 1990, one of them shot the mayor of Nagasaki, because he said the Emperor was not god and was
partly responsible for the war.

I never have had any difficulty telling peaceful Japanese people from
war-mongerers, and I am sure I would have no difficulty identifying
Muslims who want to kill us.

Such people exist in every country, and every society, including our
own. But the numbers are usually small. There are many in the Muslim
societies at present because these societies are undergoing a crisis.
There is a civil war going on in Saudi Arabia, and in Afghanistan. It
is a fight between modernity (science, rationality and technology) and a fanatical version of religion. Those wars spilled over into the U.S.
in the 9/11 attack. Fundamentally, they have little to do with us. We
just happen to be in the line of fire, you might say.

There were many brutal fanatics in Japan in the 1930s because they
were undergoing a similar crisis, and in the U.S. in the 1860s for the
same reason. Such crises never last long. Either the society recovers
and acts civilized again, or it goes too far and destroys itself.
Pre-war Japanese society destroyed itself in 1941 at Pearl Harbor, and
the Confederacy died at Gettysburg in 1863. Sooner or later, Saudi
Arabia will either recover or destroy itself. It cannot go on in a war
with modernity for decades. When it recovers, the threat to us will
recede. That will happen a lot sooner if we stop using oil and
bankrupt them.

I think the notion that we are in a second cold war that will last for
decades is absurd, and without foundation.

- Jed


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