not really any "fabricating" the stuff (aspen kind) comes in mats and the United Nuclear is a pourable "grain". It work well. D2 Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 16:12:15 -0600 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miley Arpa-E startup project reloaded! vote for for 10 days.. hurry up From: [email protected] To: [email protected]
The insulated water containers boxes must all be identical. Fabricating from aerogel seems like asking for trouble if off-the-shelf Styrofoam is adequate and it looks like it may be. On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 4:05 PM, DJ Cravens <[email protected]> wrote: You may want to look at aerogel insulation Search ebay for aspen aerogel insulation or the pourable kind from United Nuclear if you just want to have a hot sample without the water heating. D2 Date: Wed, 6 Mar 2013 15:50:52 -0600 Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miley Arpa-E startup project reloaded! vote for for 10 days.. hurry up From: [email protected] To: [email protected] OK that quick guess arithmetic was interesting enough to motivate me to look into the real numbers: http://www.mrboxonline.com/8x6x7-styrofoam-coolers-p-6787.html 10 of those cost $55.50They're 1.5in thickThey're 8"x6"x7" insideThey're 9.5"x7.5"x8.5" outsideSurface area 2*(9.5*7.5+9.5*8.5+7.5*8.5)in^2 = 431.5 in^2 Redoing the arithmetic: 431.5in^2*.033W/(m*deltaK)*2deltaK/1.5in?W ([{(431.5 * [inch^2]) * (0.033 * watt)} / {meter * deltaK}] * [2 * deltaK]) / (1.5 * inch) ? watt = 0.4822444 WThat looks good.A distribution with 9 control data points and 1 experimental data point providing 2 degrees C signal for only a half watt.On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 2:31 PM, James Bowery <[email protected]> wrote: Quick arithmetic: 1m^2*.033W/(m*deltaK)*2deltaK/2in?W ([{(1 * [meter^2]) * (0.033 * watt)} / {meter * deltaK}] * [2 * deltaK]) / (2 * inch) ? watt = 1.2992126 W That's for styrofoam 2 inches thick and a cooler with total surface area of 1m^2 and a 2 degree Kelvin temperature difference with ambient. On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 2:23 PM, James Bowery <[email protected]> wrote: Hmm.... perhaps but one would think that if the water containers were covered Styrofoam coolers, the temperature differences might accumulate sufficiently to render the signal -- particularly given the distribution represented by the numerous control containers -- quite significant. Admittedly, I haven't done the arithmetic. On Wed, Mar 6, 2013 at 2:18 PM, Jed Rothwell <[email protected]> wrote: James Bowery <[email protected]> wrote: A properly designed Seebeck is a lot more than that. With an infinite COP all that's necessary is a room with a bunch of similar pots of water, one of which has the infinite COP device in it. With only one watt I do not think that would work well. Background changes in temperature would swamp the effect of the 1 W heat source. That was the problem with the open-air Arata demonstration and others like it I have seen. I am not saying it wouldn't work at all, but the data would be noisy and people would wonder if it wasn't the effect of the HVAC currents of air blowing on one dish and not the other, or what-have-you. With ~10 W in a small device your method would work. - Jed
