Noob question: what does it take to get it to graduate?
On 3/16/2015 12:35 AM, Christian Grobmeier wrote:
I would like to highlight that retirement does not mean end of life.
There is a chance thing will get easier once on GitHub. Don't forget,
Apache is not only a great community, it's also a set of rules,
frameworks, restrictions and so on. It's do-able for a bigger community.
But the Wave community hardly is able to allocate time to do that final
step with the release. No offense, I know for myself how hard it is to
allocate time.
In a GitHub environment, Wave would have done that release already (or
most likely).
I agree, that protocols may have a good place at Apache. But just
because retirement is not successful this time does not mean it's not
successful another time. If Wave can build up a community, it can always
come back to incubation.
However my feeling says, you need to make access easier to Wave. This
means also the full power of pull requests, which we only offer
partially.
On Sun, Mar 15, 2015, at 18:41, Zachary Yaro wrote:
I think it is helpful that the wave standard be maintained by an
established organization like the Apache. Yes, other tools with wave-y
features, such as Google Docs, Rizzoma, and Slack, exist, but one of the
most exciting promises of Wave was the open protocol for real-time
communication and collaboration, and I really want to see that kept
alive.
Zachary Yaro
On 15 March 2015 at 11:46, Thomas Wrobel <darkfl...@gmail.com> wrote:
Thanks for that I'll look into both your Javascript API and your Android
one.
Is your communication between client and server just between your forked
one or the "standard" wave server as well?
If your approach is functional and everyone could agree to use it I feel a
lot of progress could be made.
~~~
Thomas & Bertines online review show:
http://randomreviewshow.com/index.html
Try it! You might even feel ambivalent about it :)
On 15 March 2015 at 16:31, Pablo Ojanguren <pablo...@gmail.com> wrote:
I’d like to clarify a bit more my work during the last year and a half,
as
I think it can respond to the needs that are being raised in this thread:
- Wave storage based on Database
- Server-Client separation
- Reduce code complexity or cover it up
- No dependency to GWT / Ability to build clients in modern frontend
frameworks
- Mobile support
I’ve addressed basically all that:
- Provided MongoDB storage for Waves
- Discarded GWT client and replaced by a JavaScript API. Anyone can
build Web apps in new frontend frameworks like AngularJS…
- Extended Wave model to support general collaborative content: maps,
lists and strings. You can use the Wave to store your own data.
- The API is being adapted to work for Android and Java, although
still
experimental
Some of them have been added to the original Wave project, but others are
available in my forked version of Wave:
The Wave platform including the general JavaScript API:
https://github.com/P2Pvalue/incubator-wave
Experimental port of the Wave API to Android:
https://github.com/Zorbel/swell-android
I will keep contributing to Wave...
2015-03-15 16:24 GMT+01:00 Thomas Wrobel <darkfl...@gmail.com>:
"Splash is an old client but looked like it was quite split from the
server
architecture.
What am I missing?"
That its almost certainly not compatible with the current Wave sever
code.
Back when it was Google wave there was 4-5 clients, including prototype
mobile ones.
All died pretty soon after the transfer to Apache.
I admit I havnt checked on Splash recently though, if its had a update
in
the past year to make it compatible again I wouldn't know.
On 15 March 2015 at 12:09, Francesco Rossi <f...@schermaontc.com>
wrote:
Yuri suggested me in PVT some interesting open alternatives although
I
think they would still lack the options that Wave has.
Just to name 2 of them:
share.js
rizzoma
of course they have different functions, but at least they would
share
some Wave dna.
the point is that coding on top of those solutions seemed a lot of
work
just to catch up with the features Wave has.
but I'd be glad to be disputed at this point.
Still, I'm a bit perplexed about the client/server conversation. I
looked
around and just for example, Splash is an old client but looked like
it
was
quite split from the server architecture.
What am I missing?
On 3/15/2015 3:51 AM, Bruce Hellstrom wrote:
The problem is technology keeps marching on while the wave project
has
remained mostly stagnant. I wanted to setup an internal wave server
at
our
company and try to get it adopted as the company standard for our
communications. I hate trying to manage email threads that get so
long
and
disjointed. Wave was such a good solution. I wanted to wait until
the
db
storage of waves support was put in, which is there now I believe.
However, the company has started using Slack and I have to say it's
hard
to argue against that with a beta of Wave in it's current state.
Slack
has
a lot of the features I was looking for in wave as well as clients
that
work on almost all mobile devices now. The downside is, the data
storage
resides with Slack and not on our own internal company servers, but
that
doesn't seem to be an issue.
I think Wave is still an awesome product that was ahead of it's
time,
but
now it would just take too much effort to bring it up-to-date. It
needs to
support all the latest incarnations of the browsers, which is a
moving
target now that almost all are on fast release cycles. It needs
full
mobile support apps. I just don't think there's enough people who
have
enough time to devote to all that needs to be done.
On 03/15/2015 03:23 AM, Francesco Rossi wrote:
Guys,
I'm a newbie too and we are thinking of building an entire app over
wave.
It sounds really bat that the community is willing to give up.
On 3/15/2015 3:14 AM, ujadatron wrote:
It sounds bad.
I'm a "few days newbee" in this mailing list. (I'm looking for a
flexible open source collaboration framework).
Do you suggest any of them? (if the Wave will retire)
thanks in advance
adatron
2015.03.14. 22:28 keltezéssel, James Keener írta:
I was going to write almost exactly the same email and decided
not
to.
I found wave and wanted to use it, but it's dependence on the GWT
and
how intertwined the Client and Server were made it very difficult
for
me
to understand and I moved to share.js because I could more easily
comprehend it's inner workings and could build my client around
it.
Ideally two projects and a documented protocol would have been
best.
Much
like how email severs and clients can be developed separately,
and
standards like pop3 and imap used to talk between them.
This would have been ideal I feel. I've seen multiple people on
this
mailing list asking how to integrate with the server and there is
never
a good response.
Jim
On 03/14/2015 05:18 PM, Thomas Wrobel wrote:
I'll just sadly from my little lurker corner repeat what I have
been
saying
for 3 years or so now;
I wanted to work on a client, despite trying, I lacked the
ability
to
understand the server side code.
There was never a clear separation of client and sever that I
feel
would
have allowed less skilled coders like me to contribute. I was
frustrated
when I saw GWT/ GUI issues on the web client being posted at
times
to
fix...and I could have helped with that. But I couldn't, because
the
bureaucracy of having the sever and client tied together made
(for
me)
trivial things rather hard.
My half-developed phone client remained dead since Googles time
as
well
because I couldn't figure out how to interface with the changes
made
to how
you should talk to the sever. I had at one point 3 people
helping
me
on
that project, and with a client/sever protocol we could have all
contributed.
Ideally two projects and a documented protocol would have been
best.
Much
like how email severs and clients can be developed separately,
and
standards like pop3 and imap used to talk between them.
I fully acknowledge much of this is my own lack of skills, and
with
everyone unpaid volunteers I cant expect anything.
But this is my hypothesis as to why Wave development wasn't as
active
as it
could have been.
-Thomas Wrobel
arwave.org
~~~
Thomas & Bertines online review show:
http://randomreviewshow.com/index.html
Try it! You might even feel ambivalent about it :)
On 14 March 2015 at 21:52, Upayavira <u...@odoko.co.uk> wrote:
Wave has been incubating for some years now, and, unfortunately,
has
not
shown a level of growth that, in my opinion, would suggest that
it
is
likely to reach graduation from the Incubator.
Unfortunately, I think it is time we accept that Wave is
unlikely
to
reach graduation, and should retire.
To explain what this means - as I understand it, the ASF repo
would
be
marked read-only, and after a period of time, the lists
disabled.
The code would, however, remain open-source, and any person, or
group of
people would be free to fork the code and continue with it
elsewhere,
e.g. Github/Sourceforge/etc.
In the end, this is a decision of the Incubator PMC, however
I’d
like to
see whether anyone here has any thoughts to add before I put
this
to
the
wider Incubator community.
Upayavira
P.S. This came up on the incubator-general list as a part of a
discussion on the Wave report
