On Friday, 8 July 2011 16:05:54 UTC+2, Anthony wrote: > > On Friday, July 8, 2011 3:25:45 AM UTC-4, cjrh wrote: >> >> On Monday, January 10, 2011 6:36:18 AM UTC+2, Anthony wrote: >>> >>> On Sunday, January 9, 2011 1:24:02 AM UTC-5, Graham Dumpleton wrote: >>>> >>>> You guys really just got to learn to do your own thing and not >>>> treating it like a crusade where you have to convert the world. >>>> >>> >>> But that's exactly the problem -- web2py is trying to do its own thing, >>> >> >> ...so far so good... >> >> >>> and there is a vocal clique of "Pythonistas" who don't like that thing >>> and want to stop it. >>> >> >> ...and here we get it wrong. Why should we *care* about this vocal >> clique? >> > > Note, the unfounded criticisms are effectively impugning both the technical > and personal integrity of web2py's developers and users, in very public > forums. This can have negative professional (and personal) consequences. If > you have chosen to build an app with web2py and your client, manager, or > investor reads bad things about web2py, you may lose their confidence and > favor. >
Haters gonna hate :) > > >> *Why* should we care how many users we have? >> > > Again, this is not the most important thing, but the number of users is not > entirely without consequence either. Generally, more users will translate > into more expert contributors and volunteers, which will contribute to the > development of the framework and its ecosystem and to its long-term > sustainability (i.e., more features, better testing and performance, better > documentation, more plugins and applications, better support, more > third-party hosting and development tool support, etc.). > This is almost definitely not true. Or rather, it certainly hasn't been my experience anyway. The number of people in a project or community appears to have no bearing whatsoever on the quality of the code or the abilities of contributors. > In many cases, when you select a framework, you want some confidence that > it will still be actively maintained several years hence, and that > confidence will be bolstered if there is a sizable and active community > around it. > I still don't see why this is my problem, or indeed even yours, or anyone else's for that matter. I do not see why I need to care about whether some pointy-hair boss thinks web2py will be actively maintained in the future. I have selected web2py on technical merit. I do not care how active the community is, for I have the source code. In truth, I have selected web2py because my value system around coding has a large intersection with Massimo's, IMO. I value the conveniences that he built into web2py early on; conveniences that other frameworks left "as an exercise to the reader". I think that matters. I think that remains a selling point for web2py. I think it is unfortunate that he uses the word "Enterprise" to indicate that those conveniences exist, and I think that that causes a lot more confusion than it should. But our PR face is way, way too defensive. I understand that *we *might not see it like that, but if someone like Graham happens point out that that is how it looks from the outside, then we should take note of that. IMO there is very little merit in just about anything that goes through reddit. So why bother wasting time on it? I am not sure I even want to attract too many coders that spend time reading reddit anyway. Apologies upfront if that offends anyone.
