If the system does restart what will happen to weewx? Will it still run for a while and then just stop?
On Friday, 17 July 2026 at 08:52:29 UTC+10 Greg from Oz wrote: > Thanks John. I have read all of that on the link you gave me but it makes > no sense to me at all as I am no programmer. I just use the software. I > guess I will wait for the fix to appear. > > On Friday, 17 July 2026 at 03:20:24 UTC+10 Vince Skahan wrote: > >> I know John strongly disagrees but this is another reason why I do not >> do ‘any’ package updates on my LAN-only weewx system. I get it working and >> leave it alone. Granted my risk profile permits this for me. I permit ‘no’ >> incoming traffic to my LAN that the weewx system is on, >> >> Running in docker is another way to avoid these kinds of ‘sand shifted >> under your feet’ problems, making it easier to revert to a previously >> stable setup. >> >> (but wow quite the elaborate investigation figuring out all the gory >> internals things for this case) >> >> On Thursday, July 16, 2026 at 8:13:32 AM UTC-7 John Kline wrote: >> >>> Hi Greg, >>> >>> I pinged the maintainer (Stefano) on the bug. Stefano already has a >>> test build of 3.13.5-2+deb13u4. See his reply here: >>> https://bugs.debian.org/cgi-bin/bugreport.cgi?bug=1141977 for a link to >>> it (if you want to install it). I have it running on 7 machines and will >>> do the rest after the first weewx gc run in about 2 and 1/2 hours. >>> >>> John >>> >>> On Jul 15, 2026, at 6:48 PM, John Kline <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Well, you can from a Debian snapshot, but I think if I listed >>> instructions on how to do that, I dig myself quite a hole in having to >>> support the process; and, I suspect, some will never undo putting the >>> packages on hold, thus, never get a python upgrade again. >>> >>> On Jul 15, 2026, at 4:05 PM, Greg from Oz <[email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> apt-cache policy python3.13 >>> python3.13: >>> Installed: 3.13.5-2+deb13u3 >>> Candidate: 3.13.5-2+deb13u3 >>> Version table: >>> *** 3.13.5-2+deb13u3 500 >>> 500 http://deb.debian.org/debian trixie/main amd64 Packages >>> 100 /var/lib/dpkg/status >>> >>> Looks like I cannot downgrade...I will just have to now restart the >>> weewx. >>> I do have weewx set up in monit and if it does crash in theory it should >>> restart again. >>> >>> >>> On Wednesday, 15 July 2026 at 23:05:03 UTC+10 John Kline wrote: >>> >>>> I believe the maintainers have what they need to push a fix. I’m >>>> hoping that will happen in a week or two. >>>> >>>> >> At least if it doesn't start I will know what to do >>>> >>>> It will start just fine. The issue is, each time weewx requests >>>> garbage collection (which, by default, weewx does every 3 hours), there is >>>> a small chance of a segment violation soon after. As such, the symptom >>>> will be that weewx stops running for no obvious reason (and nothing in the >>>> log after a garbage collection message). >>>> >>>> It is hard to say how often this might happen for a single instance of >>>> weewx running. The frequency may depend on what extensions you are >>>> running >>>> (and how many of them). It is conceivable that some won’t see the issue >>>> at >>>> all before the fix arrives. >>>> >>>> I was seeing the issue too often (as I run quite a few weewx >>>> instances); so I resorted to downgrading the python packages and put them >>>> on hold while waiting for the update. >>>> >>>> John >>>> >>>> On Jul 15, 2026, at 2:53 AM, Greg from Oz <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> So when does the new fix arrive? >>>> I upgraded the python 2 days ago and weewx has been running for 4 >>>> days....I better not restart weewx. >>>> At least if it doesn't start I will know what to do...Thanks for the >>>> heads up. >>>> >>>> On Tuesday, 14 July 2026 at 08:17:42 UTC+10 Tom Keffer wrote: >>>> >>>>> Thanks, John, for your detailed report. >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Jul 13, 2026 at 8:09 AM 'John Kline' via weewx-user < >>>>> [email protected]> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> If you run WeeWX on Debian 13 (trixie) and your system installed the >>>>>> python3.13 update from the 13.6 point release (version >>>>>> 3.13.5-2+deb13u3, >>>>>> rolling out via unattended-upgrades since July 11), be aware that it >>>>>> can >>>>>> crash weewxd with a segmentation fault. >>>>>> >>>>>> What it looks like >>>>>> ------------------ >>>>>> weewxd dies with SIGSEGV -- no Python traceback in the log, the >>>>>> process >>>>>> just exits. systemd shows "Main process exited, code=dumped, >>>>>> status=11/SEGV". If you look closely at the timing, the crash comes >>>>>> milliseconds after WeeWX's periodic garbage collection pass (the >>>>>> "Garbage collected N objects" INFO line, every 3 hours by default). >>>>>> weewxd is unusually good at tripping this bug precisely because it >>>>>> calls >>>>>> gc.collect() on that schedule while its other threads keep working. >>>>>> >>>>>> I run seven WeeWX machines (Raspberry Pi 5, all on trixie). Four >>>>>> crashes >>>>>> in the ~48 hours after the update reached them; the crash takes down >>>>>> maybe >>>>>> 1 in 25 GC passes, so it looks random and can hit anywhere from hours >>>>>> to >>>>>> days after a restart. The crashing thread differs every time (sqlite >>>>>> reads, report generation, image generation), so don't chase whatever >>>>>> happens to be in your traceback if you have faulthandler enabled -- >>>>>> it's >>>>>> the victim, not the cause. >>>>>> >>>>>> The cause >>>>>> --------- >>>>>> It is not WeeWX and not any extension. Debian's deb13u3 update >>>>>> backported >>>>>> a garbage-collector fix into Python 3.13.5 but omitted a second >>>>>> upstream >>>>>> commit that the fix depends on, so a GC pass can free memory that is >>>>>> still >>>>>> in use. It's tracked as Debian bug #1141977, the missing commit has >>>>>> been >>>>>> identified by bisection, and the maintainer is engaged, so I'd expect >>>>>> a >>>>>> fixed package (deb13u4) reasonably soon: >>>>>> >>>>>> https://bugs.debian.org/1141977 >>>>>> >>>>>> Am I affected? >>>>>> -------------- >>>>>> dpkg -l python3.13 | grep deb13u3 >>>>>> >>>>>> Two things must both be true: the deb13u3 package is installed AND >>>>>> weewxd >>>>>> was (re)started after it was installed. A weewxd that has been >>>>>> running >>>>>> since before the upgrade still uses the old library and is safe until >>>>>> its >>>>>> next restart. >>>>>> >>>>>> What to do >>>>>> ---------- >>>>>> 1. If your weewxd predates the upgrade, simply don't restart it until >>>>>> the >>>>>> fixed package arrives. >>>>>> 2. Otherwise, make crashes self-healing while you wait. A systemd >>>>>> drop-in (systemctl edit weewx) with: >>>>>> >>>>>> [Service] >>>>>> Restart=on-failure >>>>>> RestartSec=10 >>>>>> >>>>>> turns each crash into ~15 seconds of downtime. I also recommend >>>>>> Environment=PYTHONFAULTHANDLER=1 there -- it logs a full thread >>>>>> dump >>>>>> on any future native crash, which is invaluable for problems like >>>>>> this one. >>>>>> 3. Raising gc_interval in weewx.conf reduces exposure but does not >>>>>> eliminate it (Python's automatic collections use the same broken >>>>>> code path), so I wouldn't rely on it. >>>>>> 4. When the fixed python3.13 package arrives, remember that a running >>>>>> weewxd keeps the old library until it is restarted -- do a >>>>>> "systemctl restart weewx" after the upgrade to actually get off the >>>>>> broken version. >>>>>> >>>>>> Downgrading to deb13u2 also works but re-opens the security fixes that >>>>>> update carried; with the auto-restart in place I don't think it's >>>>>> worth >>>>>> it. >>>>>> >>>>>> John >>>>>> >>>>>> -- >>>>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>>>> Groups "weewx-user" group. >>>>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, >>>>>> send an email to [email protected]. >>>>>> To view this discussion visit >>>>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/weewx-user/92B83A5B-A968-4531-8DF2-223C1E9D1ED7%40johnkline.com >>>>>> >>>>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/weewx-user/92B83A5B-A968-4531-8DF2-223C1E9D1ED7%40johnkline.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>>>> . >>>>>> >>>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>>> Groups "weewx-user" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>>> an email to [email protected]. >>>> >>>> To view this discussion visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/weewx-user/ae5a994b-b4f0-4c6b-aa50-91baedd28a34n%40googlegroups.com >>>> >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/weewx-user/ae5a994b-b4f0-4c6b-aa50-91baedd28a34n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>>> . >>>> >>>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google >>> Groups "weewx-user" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send >>> an email to [email protected]. >>> To view this discussion visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/weewx-user/a03d6aaa-a55f-4120-83bd-d808c3eb80cfn%40googlegroups.com >>> >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/weewx-user/a03d6aaa-a55f-4120-83bd-d808c3eb80cfn%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> >>> -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "weewx-user" group. 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