Hi Thad, Thanks for asking the questions, and thanks Tobi for the pointers. Man, what a lengthy post it was.
I understand that the post answered most of your questions. I think that it is entirely possible to layer a prototype semantics over Wikidata, just as the DL semantics have been layered over it. I don't remember if such work has been done before. Regarding ISO 5964, I think I probably have looked through it at some point, but I don't remember it anymore. SKOS has certainly been a stronger influence, and obviously OWL. I hope that helps with the historical deep dive :) Lydia and I really should write that book! Cheers, Denny On Sat, Jul 10, 2021 at 3:00 PM Thad Guidry <thadgui...@gmail.com> wrote: > *Tobi - *That blog post 3 is very helpful. It shows that Denny and I > think alike and agree on everything. :-) His dislike for strong > classification. > Which is part of my basis, to allow weak relations much more. And use > them. But how to allow them, and I think the only way is through > properties based on the Data Model currently. > There are many ways, and SKOS is one way to allow expressing weak > relations and we already have some good support with existing properties > like P4390 mapping relation type <https://www.wikidata.org/entity/P4390> > and a host of others. > > Denny and I also fear the same things, like not having a flexible enough > system to describe our complex world that doesn't always fit into strict > rules. Which is kinda why I've always liked > https://www.w3.org/TR/skos-primer/#secassociative > because of it's non-transitivity which allows much flexibility and as he > and I would say... avoid "Barbara". :-) > Which is pretty much summarized in > https://www.w3.org/TR/skos-primer/#secadvanced > > Sorry for all the SKOS links but semantic relations helps to describe > human knowledge. How a system represents or portrays semantic relations is > where choices are made or have been made. *And I think the right choices > were definitely made.* > Overlaying SKOS and the Wikidata properties that sprinkle it into the data > model is useful, but I've always been kind of reluctant to do > that...probably for the same reasons Denny might give? Choices between > allowing "semantic accuracy" versus "semantic flexibility". But I think > systems like SKOS provide both. Perhaps it could be argued that OWL > provides much less. :-) Still all KOSs provide great use when they fit > well. How they can fit over Wikidata, as I said, is probably only through > properties at this late stage of design and that's fine with me! > > Still, my main focus is and always will be trying to add human knowledge > about concept relations into Wikidata to help machines, to help us. (the > "edges" that humans quickly can deduce in seconds, but still to this day > can sometimes take machines days or weeks to figure out). > > My usage and help to Abstract Wikipedia and Wikidata later on will > primarily be around the mapping of relations ... where a lot of the > possibilities have already been described years and years ago at the very > bottom of this long page: > *inter-KOS mapping relationships <-- *very last row, 3rd column > https://www.w3.org/TR/skos-primer/#seccorrespondencesISO > > > *Denny - * were you part of or lightly influenced by ISO 5964 through > Germany ISO DIN or not .. that also would be good to know. > > Thad > https://www.linkedin.com/in/thadguidry/ > https://calendly.com/thadguidry/ > > > On Sat, Jul 10, 2021 at 3:17 PM Tobi Gritschacher < > tobias.gritschac...@wikimedia.de> wrote: > >> Hi, >> >> It would be nice to have a place to look with a link to a page in the >>> Community portal that says "History of Wikidata's design and early >>> collected meetings, notes, design documents, recordings" >>> >> >> Might not answer your concrete question, but here are some (very) early >> blog posts by Denny. They are still a nice read. :) >> >> 1/3 >> https://blog.wikimedia.de/2013/02/22/restricting-the-world/ >> >> 2/3 >> https://newwwblog.wikimedia.de/2013/06/04/on-truths-and-lies/ >> >> 3/3 >> https://blog.wikimedia.de/2013/09/12/a-categorical-imperative/ >> >> Cheers, Tobi >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikidata mailing list -- wikidata@lists.wikimedia.org >> To unsubscribe send an email to wikidata-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >> > _______________________________________________ > Wikidata mailing list -- wikidata@lists.wikimedia.org > To unsubscribe send an email to wikidata-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >
_______________________________________________ Wikidata mailing list -- wikidata@lists.wikimedia.org To unsubscribe send an email to wikidata-le...@lists.wikimedia.org
