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James On Thu, Feb 1, 2024 at 3:32 AM Paulo Santos Perneta <paulospern...@gmail.com> wrote: > WMF is doing it wrong, not we. > Many people in the movement have been alerting to this situation over the > years, apparently to deaf ears. > > Paulo > > Felipe Schenone <scheno...@gmail.com> escreveu (quinta, 1/02/2024 à(s) > 07:09): > >> Well, perhaps you'll be elated to know then that the grants for tech seem >> to have been removed >> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=Grants:Start&diff=prev&oldid=26136082> >> after >> many months of waiting for them >> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants_talk:Start#Timeline_for_%22Wikimedia_Technology_Fund%22> >> . >> We're doing it wrong, indeed. >> >> El mié., 31 de ene. de 2024 11:02 p. m., Gnangarra <gnanga...@gmail.com> >> escribió: >> >>> Before the WMF starts hiring, we need to be very clear exactly what >>> pathways and objectives we want to pursue, along with what functions should >>> be internally maintained. With that what happens with community built tools >>> that cross over from great tools to essential community infrastructure that >>> needs continued updates. Perhaps part of the "hiring" option is rewarding >>> volunteers who create them to help transition the tool to the internal >>> system. >>> >>> On Thu, 1 Feb 2024 at 01:35, Felipe Schenone <scheno...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> I also think the WMF should prioritize hiring more developers over >>>> other roles and expenditures. The WMF has only a few hundred developers >>>> while other top sites have many thousands. While this efficiency is >>>> something to be proud of, it evidently comes at a cost. >>>> >>>> El mié., 31 de ene. de 2024 4:08 a. m., rupert THURNER < >>>> rupert.thur...@gmail.com> escribió: >>>> >>>>> On Wed, Jan 31, 2024 at 1:27 AM Gergő Tisza <gti...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, Jan 30, 2024 at 1:57 PM Ori Livneh <ori.liv...@gmail.com> >>>>>> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> If we're collecting exemplars, I'd like to add Bartosz >>>>>>> Ciechanowski's superlative articles >>>>>>> <https://ciechanow.ski/archives/>, like the ones on bicycles >>>>>>> <https://ciechanow.ski/bicycle/> and sound >>>>>>> <https://ciechanow.ski/sound/>. His articles are the best examples >>>>>>> I know of interactive content that complements long-form text content. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> This concept was popularized by Bret Victor under the name "explorable >>>>>> explanations <http://worrydream.com/ExplorableExplanations/>". There >>>>>> is a whole Wikipedia article >>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explorable_explanation> on it. There >>>>>> are some great examples on his website, and there are some websites for >>>>>> collecting similar content, such as explorabl.es and an awesome list >>>>>> <https://github.com/blob42/awesome-explorables>. I agree they are >>>>>> really cool but... >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> The critical issue is *security*. Security is the reason the graph >>>>>>> extension is not enabled. Security is the reason why interactive SVGs >>>>>>> are >>>>>>> not enabled. Interactive visualizations have a programmatic element that >>>>>>> consists of code that executes in the user's browser. Such code needs >>>>>>> to be >>>>>>> carefully sandboxed to ensure it cannot be used to exfiltrate user data >>>>>>> or >>>>>>> surreptitiously perform actions on wiki. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> I think it's fundamentally a human scaling problem. Being able to >>>>>> create good interactive content is just a much more niche skill than >>>>>> being >>>>>> able to create good text content. Interactive animations were very much >>>>>> part of Yuri's vision >>>>>> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Yurik/I_Dream_of_Content> for >>>>>> the Graph extension, but during the decade Graph was deployed in >>>>>> production >>>>>> the number of such animations made was approximately zero. Granted Vega >>>>>> is >>>>>> probably not the easiest framework for creating animations, but I don't >>>>>> think there are other tools which would make it much easier. You could >>>>>> just >>>>>> write arbitrary Javascript and package it as a gadget; but no one did >>>>>> that >>>>>> either. Instead, both gadgets and Graph usage are mostly focused on very >>>>>> basic things like showing a chess board or showing bar charts, because >>>>>> those are the things that can be reused across a large number of articles >>>>>> without manually tailoring the code to each, so the economics of creating >>>>>> them work out. >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> Security is a challenge but could be worked around via iframes. But >>>>>> it's hard to justify the effort required for doing that when there is no >>>>>> community of animation makers interested in it - there are plenty of >>>>>> volunteers who want to *have* animations, but it's not very clear >>>>>> that there are any who want to *make* animations. This is the same >>>>>> problem geni mentioned for videos - a lot of people say "we should have >>>>>> more videos", but it's not very clear who would make them. If platform >>>>>> support were the bottleneck here, I think the platform support would >>>>>> happen. But as things look now, it would just be a poor investment of >>>>>> resources IMO (compared to e.g. the Gadgets extension or Toolforge or >>>>>> Scribunto which do sustain vibrant volunteer ecosystems which are >>>>>> significantly held back by the limitations of these platforms). >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> thank you for sharing ori and gergo. coming from i opened the page >>>>> "how to tune a guitar": >>>>> https://mathisonian.github.io/idyll/how-to-tune-a-guitar/, and the >>>>> readings about "reinventing human explanations" and so on: >>>>> https://explorabl.es/reading/. the sheer number of examples is saw >>>>> out of these links does not sound like there is a lack of persons who love >>>>> to do that. >>>>> >>>>> rupert >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, >>>>> guidelines at: >>>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and >>>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >>>>> Public archives at >>>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/7A6223FVC4SRJQSPZQLO5EILX7N7HZEG/ >>>>> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, >>>> guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines >>>> and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >>>> Public archives at >>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/WJHXZMUH7QRMYU5SR5HU5OZNN7SD7M5D/ >>>> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> Boodarwun >>> Gnangarra >>> 'ngany dabakarn koorliny arn boodjera dardon nlangan Nyungar >>> koortabodjar' >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines >>> at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and >>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >>> Public archives at >>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/HV2RWC7NFJTBXDHXIT44R3QMYNRRBD4P/ >>> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines >> at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l >> Public archives at >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/J56AX26WUDYQUMTHIMN7RYEQEGSQRWY6/ >> To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org > > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list -- wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org, guidelines > at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l > Public archives at > https://lists.wikimedia.org/hyperkitty/list/wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org/message/S4XRA7OLTYFBZWXFEAGP5Q4E5BPDQCKZ/ > To unsubscribe send an email to wikimedia-l-le...@lists.wikimedia.org -- James Heilman MD, CCFP-EM, Wikipedian
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