I have found that the cheap 802.11b kit has some chance of working to a limited customer base outdoors over relatively short distances. But the newer 802.11g equipment does not deliver higher speeds unless you are really close to the main base station or have wildly powerful antennas.
Best regards Peter Bellew, CEO Visitor Based Networks Kerry Technology Park, Tralee. Co. Kerry. Ireland Tel: +353-66-7190089 http://www.vbnets.com ----- Original Message ----- From: "Allen Fear" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: "Peter Bellew" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "Patrick Leary" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'Ladjicke Diouf'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2003 5:41 PM Subject: Re: [BAWUG] 802.11b Long Range non line of sight > When you say that the cheap 802.11g stuff doesn't work well, are you saying > that the cheap 802.11b stuff works better? The claim that 802.11g doesn't > work well outdoors has been made a couple of times now on this list. Is > there any proof or at least substantiating evidence for this? Is OFDM a poor > choice for long distance links when compared to DSSS? If so, why? > > Allen > > On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 14:47:25 +0100, Peter Bellew wrote > > OFDM has drawbacks with the cheap 802.11g stuff which really does > > not work well outdoors. But Redline and Alvarion have really good > > OFDM products that work out of the box today. They do cost more > > but the development costs of the RF on these must be frightening. > > The quality of the components and construction is also excellent. I > > think it is fun rolling out WISP's for 30-100 users using off the > > shelf 802.11b, Karlnet does a great job for larger installs. For > > serious deployments the market has embraced Alvarion - and Redline > > is popular now for PtP. You get what you pay for. You really do. > > And margins are real tight. This is not really a big business > > today - but it will be. More money is spent on microwave ovens in a > > month than microwave radios in a year! > > > > Best regards > > > > Peter Bellew, CEO > > Visitor Based Networks > > Kerry Technology Park, Tralee. > > Co. Kerry. Ireland > > Tel: +353-66-7190089 > > http://www.vbnets.com > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Patrick Leary" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > To: "'Ladjicke Diouf'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2003 1:42 PM > > Subject: RE: [BAWUG] 802.11b Long Range non line of sight > > > > > Ladjicke, > > > There may be lots of money to be made in wireless LAN, but there is VERY > > > little margin to be made. For the record, the company I work for was one > > of > > > the original pioneers in WLAN, including donating major elements of the > > > first 802.11 standard. In the beginning, the 4 most recognized pioneers > > were > > > Symbol, Proxim, Aironet, and BreezeCOM. > > > > > > Symbol is still Symbol. > > > > > > Proxim was bought by Western Multiplex (keeping the Proxim name), > > > pre-aquisition, Proxim had bought Farallon. Pre-aquisition Western > > Multiplex > > > bought Wavespan. Proxim also bought Wireless Home, then most recently > they > > > bought Orinoco from Agere. > > > > > > Aironet, which itself was related to Telxon, was purchased by Cisco > > > > > > LANair was BreezeCOM pre-US days (running back to 1992), then in 1995 > > became > > > BreezeCOM. BreezeCOM merged with Floware to become Alvarion. Then > Alvarion > > > bought Innowave from ECI. > > > > > > When times got hard these past few years, we did not dump lines likes > many > > > others. We stuck in there. > > > > > > BreezeCOM back in 1995 had 5 employees in the U.S. That hardly qualified > > it > > > as a "big company." When I got here in mid-1999, we hade under 30 people > > in > > > the U.S. Now we are about 70 in the U.S. and almost 700 worldwide. We > have > > > grown with this business and, in fact, we have been a major catalyst in > > its > > > growth. It was BreezeCOM, with a few pioneering customers, that created > > the > > > unlicensed wireless broadband business. Any qualified expert will tell > you > > > the same. > > > > > > In other words, we are hardly opportunists jumping into the game late. We > > > are, of course, in business to earn profit, and I understand the concept > > of > > > making money is somehow offense and unpure to some. > > > > > > - Patrick > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Ladjicke Diouf [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2003 2:13 AM > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Subject: Re: [BAWUG] 802.11b Long Range non line of sight > > > > > > > > > Judd, > > > > > > You're right, big companies are realizing that there's a lot of money to > > be > > > made on Wireless LANS and they're trying to cash on it. I hope we can > keep > > > this mailing list clean and not a marketing tool for company X or Z > > > > > > Ladjicke > > > > > > >From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > >To: "'[EMAIL PROTECTED]'" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > >Subject: Re: [BAWUG] 802.11b Long Range non line of sight > > > >Date: Wed, 30 Jul 2003 21:07:38 -0600 > > > > > > > >With DSSS and FHSS, you don't need LOS either. But there are extreme > > > >limits on > > > >distance and when it comes to getting links on a sectored or omni > > > >directional > > > >ptmp system, your going to be hit-and-miss. > > > > > > > >From what I've heard, the 900Mhz stuff works well, very well, NLOS like > > we > > > >see > > > >on our cell phones, where a general wall or building isn't going to kill > > > >your > > > >signal to an unusable amount. But at 2.4Ghz and 5.8Ghz, even with OFDM > > and > > > > > > >AP's > > > >that co2500+ each and $600-1000 CPE, your not going to only battle > > > >hit-and-miss coverage, but then you begin the battle price vs widespread > > > >acceptance of the technology. > > > > > > > >UWB might be the next big step, where, instead of a complete loss of a > > > >connection, you only lose part of the connection that is blocked and the > > > >throughput may fall, but may still be usable at 100Mbit of sustained > > > >throughput, > > > >even with error rates. > > > > > > > >Personally, I think that OFDM is useless unless it becomes affordable. > > > >Alvarion > > > >has never brought equipment down to a generally affordable level, in > > > >contrast to > > > >other existing equipment solutions. So I don't have much faith in > > anything > > > > > > >that > > > >Alvarion claims, even if it is true and does work, cuz we don't want to > > go > > > >broke > > > >implementing proprietary solutions that give no consideration to current > > > >market > > > >demands, including price requirements for acceptance. > > > > > > > >By widespread acceptance, I mean that at some point, the equipment would > > > >become > > > >fairly "standard" for the industry. > > > > > > > >Judd > > > > > > > >Jeff King wrote: > > > > > > > > > Thanks Patrick. What I am looking for is the "white paper" that will > > > >qualify > > > > > your statement: "With OFDM, you DON'T need LOS." in the context of > the > > > >title > > > > > of this thread (or at least the frequency domain). > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Jeff King, [EMAIL PROTECTED] on 07/29/2003 > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, 29 Jul 2003 17:15:04 -0700, Patrick Leary wrote: > > > > > >Until I can link to our paper, here are some resources to study > > > > > >OFDM. > > > > > > > > > > > >http://www.palowireless.com/ofdm/tutorials.asp > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > general wireless list, a bawug thing <http://www.bawug.org/> > > > > > [un]subscribe: http://lists.bawug.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >-- > > > >general wireless list, a bawug thing <http://www.bawug.org/> > > > >[un]subscribe: http://lists.bawug.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > > Help STOP SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* > > > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail > > > > > > -- > > > general wireless list, a bawug thing <http://www.bawug.org/> > > > [un]subscribe: http://lists.bawug.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > > > > > > This mail passed through mail.alvarion.com > > > > > > > > > **************************************************************************** > > > ******** > > > This footnote confirms that this email message has been scanned by > > > PineApp Mail-SeCure for the presence of malicious code, vandals & > computer > > > viruses. > > > > > > **************************************************************************** > > > ******** > > > -- > > > general wireless list, a bawug thing <http://www.bawug.org/> > > > [un]subscribe: http://lists.bawug.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > > > > > -- > > general wireless list, a bawug thing <http://www.bawug.org/> > > [un]subscribe: http://lists.bawug.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > > -- > general wireless list, a bawug thing <http://www.bawug.org/> > [un]subscribe: http://lists.bawug.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > -- general wireless list, a bawug thing <http://www.bawug.org/> [un]subscribe: http://lists.bawug.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
