I am reading all of these posts and I see one thing here. Marketing! There is little sense to this but a great deal of marketing being done for Mesh, 4.9, and Muni WiFi. I see out of town guys chime in all the time and express how well they can deploy and integrate networks. I am very curious about the actual implementations they have done that involved a large mountain ranges with customers spaced every 5 miles who are behind trees, or has some obstruction to any towers. Better yet a neighborhood with devices on the same frequencies that you cannot control. My guess is that their lab and specs of their devices looks great but the actual deployment is a different story. We all know that 2.4Ghz, 900Mhz, and 5.8Ghz, all have their limitations, and will perform perhaps 10% to 20% worst than advertised. Do these guys know that?
As for the marketing bit, I have a 2.4Ghz wireless device that can communicate at 100 mph, at distances of 100mi from the tower using 60foot dishes, giving a throughput of 200Mbps. It sells for $50,000.00 per Clieint bridge and $600,000.00 per AP. Who wants to buy? Quoting Carl A Jeptha <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: > Well to one-up you, > Our local Utility has been offered Wimax Radios to be used in a Mesh > Network on a licensed Freq, so that they can read meters. > What really gets me is that these people with a few carefully chosen > words appear to know more than all of us put together. The gift of the GAB. > > You have a Good Day now, > > > Carl A Jeptha > http://www.airnet.ca > office 905 349-2084 > Emergency only Pager 905 377-6900 > skype cajeptha > > > > Brad Larson wrote: > > I'm biting my tongue on this topic....I have been on enough of these > > projects, well over 50 in the last 12 months alone, and I have to say > there > > are a pile of people that don't know what they're getting into and many > will > > get hurt. For instance, I have a unnamed mesh vendor quoting 14 nodes per > > square mile for 100% coverage in a decent sized community in MA. They'll > > need at least 40ish... And please keep in mind that different parts of the > > Country where tree lines/foliage, noise floors, and topology are different > > create their own separate challenges. Throw in voice as some of the > > "wireless network experts" have advised and a whole new overlay of > problems > > surface. > > > > There is a place for mesh just like other tools in your kit but covering > > whole counties or even trying to cover a whole City is quite a stretch > IMHO. > > How did we get to this point of mesh first being considered a "convenience > > or hotspot extension" to what it has become today where it is seen as the > > 4th solution to the last mile or a cost effective roaming solution for > > public safety or city workers? > > > > I have seen designs in the NE US where 40 to 69 2.4 Ghz nodes per square > > mile are needed when a simple implement of 900 Mhz mobility with two base > > stations (redundant) per square mile can do the trick and save 90% of the > > cost of a mesh network. Use mesh in the parks, at the pool, in the > > restaurant district, or anywhere else people may want public access. And > > I'll add that opening up my notebook on a sunny day outside is pretty much > a > > waste of battery power. I'm afraid Tempe AZ and St Cloud are just the > start > > of some of the bad press we're going to see related to our wireless > > industry. > > > > But then again, I'm a show me guy so if one of these major networks > actually > > works, has an ROI and doesn't become a boondoggle for tax payers, and > serves > > the public well then I'll be impressed. Brad > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: John J. Thomas [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > Sent: Tuesday, April 25, 2006 10:03 AM > > To: WISPA General List > > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Pioneering Wi-Fi City Sees Startup Woes > > > > > > > >> -----Original Message----- > >> From: George [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > >> Sent: Monday, April 24, 2006 09:02 AM > >> To: 'WISPA General List' > >> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Pioneering Wi-Fi City Sees Startup Woes > >> > >> John J. Thomas wrote: > >> > >>> inline... > >>> > >>> First off, the WISPs have to have the guts to talk to the city. Many > >>> > > simply refuse to do so, and are probably going to get the Muni WiFi shoved > > down their throats. > > > >> I don't want to turn this into a battle of ideals. > >> > > > > George, you are welcome to believe anything that you want. Here are some > > facts; > > 1. I work for Clare Computer Solutions and we are a Cisco Mesh certified > > network Integrator. > > 2. Cities have approached US to install their networks > > 3. These cities are not San Francisco sized, they are probably populations > > 100,000 and smaller. > > 4. They are spending the money to put in infrastructure for City workers, > > first. Many are looking at providing Internet access second. > > > > > > > >> But how many local wisps have been chosen to date? > >> I bet Joe laura in NO got passed over without much consideration to him. > >> Joe is on this list, let him chime in here. > >> > >> > >>> Second, the cities are mostly going to use 2.4 GHz for access and > 5.7-5.8 > >>> > > GHz for backhauls. WISP's will need to use 5.25-5.25 GHz and 900 MHz. > > > >> Almost every wisp today is using 2.4 to reach the customer and 5 gig for > >> infrastructure and high end customers. Are you saying that wisps have to > >> move off the existing spectrum and replace their equipment? > >> > > > > I am not saying that WISPS have to move off of 2.4. I am saying that if > > WISPs want to provide top quality service, then they may need to move off > of > > 2.4 as it is getting crowded in lots of areas. > > > >>> In a word, service. The city will only be offering WiFi access-period. > >>> > > They won't be going out to peoples houses and doing installs, fixing > virii, > > doing firewalls, etc. > > > >> Here is a scenario, if a potential customer who is on the fence while > >> deciding to go to broadband was to hear that a new muni free wifi system > >> is going to come on line or he can buy now with his local wisp, which > >> choice is the average consumer going to make? > >> > > > > Most are going to try the muni first. Some are going to be unsatisfied and > > will look for a better deal. I'll give you an example. I had 384k SDSL to > my > > house and it was costing me $152 per month. In order to save money, I > > dropped the SDSL in favor of a cable modem. The cable modem can do 6 meg > > down and about 384k up for $43 per month and has been verified by > > DSLreports. Even my wife thinks the SDSL was better, I just couldn't > afford > > it anymore. If someone in Antioch CA were even offering wireless service > at > > $42 per month, I would be there. There is a subset of people that want > > quality, and are willing to pay for it. Two questions come up-can you > > deliver and are there enough to keep you from starving? > > > > > > > > > >> The support scenario happens long after the fact. > >> > >> George > >> -- > >> WISPA Wireless List: email@example.com > >> > >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > >> > >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > >> > >> > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ -- WISPA Wireless List: firstname.lastname@example.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/