I agree with George on this... I'm a year into a 3-year contract with Sprint for multi-T1 service and I wish I wasn't. Now I've got to make the most of it and go with a different provider for cheaper bandwidth while still maintaining the Sprint feed (which is arguably not a bad thing).

I also agree with the equipment advice. Start out where you are...on a budget and hopefully not in debt on the project. Don't be afraid to grow the quality of equipment with your business. Listen, get advice, try, fail, adapt, learn, etc. Decide on your route and go that way. If you want to be sure, it's going to cost you.

I'm currently using Trango backhauls, switching to Mikrotik backhauls to see how it goes. So far, so good. Star-OS and Mikrotik are feature-rich and are made for your business without breaking the bank. Pay attention to those words ... "without breaking the bank."

If you're not going to have this be a hobby, you'd better keep your costs down, because your quality of life is about to change. The quicker you get over the hump financially, the quicker it can be rewarding, but there is a ton of work ahead to get there.

Mark Nash
Network Engineer
UnwiredOnline.Net
350 Holly Street
Junction City, OR 97448
http://www.uwol.net
541-998-5555
541-998-5599 fax
----- Original Message ----- From: "George Rogato" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Sunday, January 28, 2007 11:04 AM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Wireless Backhaul - Where Do I Begin?


Jim, One bit of advice I can give you that most will not disagree with, is try not to do long term contracts with the telephone companies. 5 years is a very long time, lots can happen in 5 years, it's like an eternity.

Usually the telephone companies enforce their early termination fees and it can be quite a burden to carry.

So be carefull on with the telephone companies and try to do shorter term contracts.

Also try to get a provision that lowers your rate if the telephone company lowers it's rate during the contract.

George


Jim Stout wrote:
Thanks to all who replied to my initial question. It might help to understand what I'm doing now and want to do in the future.

My wife and I live in rural Cass County Missouri. We're too far out for Cable or DSL and Satellite is out of the question due to the havoc that huge amounts of latency wreaks upon VPN clients So in order to get a high-speed connection out in the country, we dragged a T1 line to the house, stood up a 30' tower and began selling bandwidth to our neighbors. I learned all I know about this "stuff" at last Fall's ISPCON in Santa Clara so I'm feeling a little bit wind-burned right now. This is also where I met John Scrivner who convinced me that joining WISPA was a great way to gain access to this community and continue to have the support group that I need. Well, a few months have flown by and once word leaks out that there is an affordable high-speed Internet connection available, they truly beat down your door wanting to know when they can be installed. I'm having a great time, enjoy the people and am considering making this more than just a "Hobby WISP."

We are about 30 or so miles from downtown Kansas City as the radio waves fly, and are relatively high up. I spoke to my provider (AT&T) about additional bandwidth and out here they can continue to bring me T1 lines across copper, but I have to believe there's a more cost-effective solution available. This is why I posed the original question.

I feel that I could serve about 500 clients in this rural area and would like the option of scaling up to 45Mbps to support them. Obviously bandwidth distrubution comes into play along with detailed planning and design, but at this point, I'm just looking for ideas to help me formulate my plans.

As always, thanks to all who have responded and continue to assist met!

Waremest regards, Jim....

Jim Stout
LTO Communications, LLC
15701 Henry Andrews Dr
Pleasant Hill, MO 64080
(816) 305-1076 - Mobile
(816) 497-0033 - Pager

----- Original Message ----- From: "John Rock" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; "'WISPA General List'" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Monday, January 22, 2007 1:14 PM
Subject: RE: [WISPA] Wireless Backhaul - Where Do I Begin?


We look at three primary things when addressing backhaul needs...
They are in order:
1. Path Analysis and Distance, Without LOS between the two desired sites
usually you can kiss the link goodbye. If there is LOS then how far we are
shooting helps determine antenna sizes.

2. Frequency Usage on site - Again helps determine the radio type.

3. Capacity - Helps determine radio type.

So.....
Figure out where you are shooting from and to.
If that is OK then find out what frequencies are in use at those sites.
Then know how much Bandwidth you will need or want.

To address your specific questions.
I would check with your current provider and ask them upgrade questions.
They may be able to provide you with a fractional DS3 at really attractive rates. If they can't provide that then ask them if they recommend a carrier in your area. I would then need to look further at your network to determine
best backhaul to the different legs of the network.

Transport of choose is 5.8Ghz radios and then probably licensed.

Distances are form 0-40+ miles. The farther you shoot the better the
planning and budgeting needs to be. Typical links seem to be between 5-20
miles...

Bandwidth - Licensed can be out of this world fast but you are probably
looking at unlicensed, 18-54Mbs over the air which translates to about 10-35 actual throughputs max. We would base that need on planned growth over a one
to two year period.

Cost = Cheap - very expensive. All based on need. How much do you want to
spend???

John Rock
ACC, Inc., Wireless Connections Division
ACCessing the Future Today!!
ph. 419.668.4080 x2234
fax 419-668-4077
Mon-Fri 8am-5pm
http://www.accnorwalk.com
http://www.windcastbroadband.com
http://www.wirelessconnections.net


-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Sunday, January 21, 2007 10:09 AM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: [WISPA] Wireless Backhaul - Where Do I Begin?

Folks,



I'm looking out about 6 months and expect to run out of bandwidth with my
current T1 line.  That's the good news because it means that I have more
demand than supply.  My niche is that I serve the rural community and
getting bandwidth out here is a challenge. I would like to begin planning for an expanded service area but the first problem I need to solve is the
acquisition of more bandwidth.



I think the most likely solution would be for a wireless backhaul but I have no idea where to begin. Since you all have helped so much in the past, I figured this forum would at least set me on the correct path. Questions I have include: Who are the cost-effective providers? What's the transport medium of choice? What kinds of distances are available? What is the unit
of bandwidth - 45Mbps? And what costs are to be expected?



  As usual, thanks in advance for any and all responses!



Regards, Jim in Kansas City..



Jim Stout

LTO Communications, LLC

15701 Henry Andrew Dr

Pleasant Hill, MO 64080

(816) 987-6329 - Home

(816) 305-1076 - Mobile



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