Clint, Thank you for the civil reply.
You are still making assumptions which are in fact un-founded. Nowhere in my post did I state the weights and dimensions of what I have secured to towers using magnets, the number and size of magnets, their placement on the towers, proximity to areas where there might be climbers attempting find anchor points, whether they were on vertical or horizontal planes of the tower, the leverage which might have been either in favor of or against the magnets due to stresses which might be placed on the mount by winds or objects striking the antennas/masts, the methods used to tie the magnets together, wind load factor of attached equipment, or really any other technical details which would have given you or anybody else a possible basis for determining whether or not the methods used were likely to be sufficient under all forseeable circumstances, or even possible catastophic conditions. Yet you still referred to "amateurs", your liklihood of dis-allowing any such mounts were you in the decision making role or in authority position, and other references that indicated that you believe that anybody that would use magnetic mounts in any circumstance (at 200 feet in the air) is doing it wrong. I believe you also referred to lack of understanding of magnet load carrying capacity and other references to the lack of ability of people (presumably including me) who might choose to use magnets to mount an antenna. I did say that I did not completely trust the mount, and immediately following that statement, stated that I had secured the mount/mast to the tower using a safety cable. I did not express surprise that the magnets had not moved, just stated that I could not detect any movement. I actually attached the safety cable because I am probably more cautious than most. I also don't completely trust most other mounting systems, and whenever possible and/or practical, take steps to add a redundant safety feature such as a safety cable, supporting braces, multiple mount points, etc... and I do this on towers that are in rural locations with no structures/and only authorized personnell being within 1/2 mile of the towers. (and only on rare occasions at that.)There is almost zero possibility of anybody or any thing being damaged or hurt should the mounts fail and the safety cable failing simultaneously. And by "almost zero" I mean approaching infinitesimally small odds that someone will get hurt. But then again, I am not a statistician either. :) My negative reaction to your post and those made by others was prompted by the unequivocal statements that magnet mounts are always a bad idea. I would propose that a properly designed and built mounting system secured by the proper quantity/size/power magnets strategically placed can be safer than many of the mounting systems I see in use that would not have elicited such a response had the suggestion been to use them, including some mounts I have seen that were bolted to the tower using capacitive stud welding. In fact, I believe that magnets could be used successfully to secure a mounting system that I WOULD trust my life to, and I take life very seriously. :) The original poster asked for alternative ideas for mounting some sector antennas to a tower. He did not as I recall specify the size or weight of those antennas. They likely are not very big or heavy if he is in the WISP industry. Most likely they weigh only a couple of pounds, with minimal wind loading characteristics. If that is the case, it might be entirely possible to design a mounting system that would hold them, with the mounting system exceeding the specifications of the antenna brackets themselves in terms of holding capacity and projected reliability. I did not propose to him the design of such a system, nor would I. Only a suggestion that such things can and are being done successfully, giving him another option to research. It is OK for you and others to disagree, but please, do so in a reasoned and civil manner, taking all care necessary to avoid giving the impression that you believe those with whom you are disagreeing are idiots, fools, or worse... unless of course they actually are. :) John Clint Ricker wrote: > > John Vogel, > Disagreeing with you does not make this a less-than-professional > discussion. There was nothing in my post that was unprofessional or > uncivil; I simply disagree with the use of magnet-mounting equipment onto > towers. If discussion on such stuff is unprofessional, then these lists > have no purpose. > > You stated in your earlier post regarding magnets "I don't completely > trust > them". I don't either, so we are in agreement on the matter :). Call it > unprofessional of me, but I tend to think that one should avoid using > mounting methods that one doesn't trust when one is dealing with big, > heavy > chunks of metal and what-all hundreds of feet in the air. > > As a general side note, any statement about mounting that involved some > statement of "I don't completely trust it" would get the same response > from > me. I don't like the idea of people mounting big heavy objects above my > head using methods they themselves have some doubt about. > > Best practices does not necessarily entail commercially available > solutions > or degreed engineering solutions. Best practices are simply that--the > optimal way(s) of achieving a particular task. "I don't completely > trust" > methods are a long-ways off from that. > > My point is not to increase regulation and such--quite the opposite. My > point is that using practices that aren't completely trusted will, in the > end, lead to regulation. As an industry, the wireless industry will > have to > learn to regulate itself to a moderate degree or it will be regulated > to a > heavy degree. There's a lot that goes by everyone on that is not > necessarily as well done as it could be--which is > understandable--business > may require concessions to some degree. Nevertheless, better practices > should be used in places that are highly visible or potentially impact > the > public community. > > Does it need to involve a degreed engineer? Of course not. But, > considering that even you had your doubts, 200 feet above everyone in > plain > sight of an entire town is a heck-of a place for a "we'll see" approach > which was the feeling I got from your original postings. > > I don't think that engineering needs to take into accounts stupid > misuse (ie > antennas being used as footholds). Still, I don't see how a mounting > solution that you were almost surprised that there hadn't been > slippage on a > year later is a good thing. > > -Clint Ricker > Kentnis Technologies > > ps. I'm not against magnets in general. Magnets on my fridge? > Guilty as > charged :) > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board > know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA > lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this > time. We want to know your thoughts. > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- John Vogel - [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.vogent.net 620-754-3907 Vogel Enterprises, LLC Information Services Provider serving S.E. Kansas -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Would you like to see your advertisement here? Let the WISPA Board know your feelings about allowing advertisements on the free WISPA lists. The current Board is taking this under consideration at this time. We want to know your thoughts. -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- WISPA Wireless List: [email protected] Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
