So, I'm right? Unlimited BW....You are lucky. Chuck Profito 209-988-7388 CV-ACCESS, INC [EMAIL PROTECTED] Providing High Speed Broadband to Rural Central California
-----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Rogato Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 7:24 PM To: WISPA General List Subject: Re: [WISPA] Vuze / Comcast / Peer to Peer / FCC Chuck I am connected to fiber. It's right next to my water tank with a lot of sectors on it to ditribute out to the vrious repeaters, I sectorized the hell out of my network with tight beam widths and reuse frequency without interfering with myself. A good portion of my network is 5gig and I have almost 1000 radios. I could double my customer base and not too heavily impact my network. I believe in high capacity systems, so thats the way I build it. CHUCK PROFITO wrote: > You are nuts or spoiled on 5 gig or have fiber stuffed up every tower. > 1 P2P on a 2.4 rural ap opening 100+ connections will packet flood an > ap in about 1 minute. 2.4 will only realistically deliver 5 megs per > radio. 1 P2P uploading to 60 plus users will be slowed enough to bring > the bits per packet way down, then the packet flood ensues. Now put > six sectors on a tower, with 300+ subs, 10 megs of back haul, then add > 6 P2P and on top of that add three or four bit torrent users with 50 > or 60 connections each down loading the best movie ever from Netflix, > and now your backhaul starts the flood too.. And you are 30 miles from > the fiber head in. Yeah, right... Don't tell me not to shape the > traffic. > > Chuck Profito > 209-988-7388 > CV-ACCESS, INC > [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Providing High Speed Broadband > to Rural Central California > > > -----Original Message----- > From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > On Behalf Of George Rogato > Sent: Wednesday, November 21, 2007 6:42 PM > To: WISPA General List > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Vuze / Comcast / Peer to Peer / FCC > > > Come on, you guys that sell "slow" broadband generaly don't have too > much to worry about. It's not like if you got an ap that does 10 megs > and you sell 50 512k subs that the one or three out of 20 running p2p is > going to be very noticable. > Try giving those 50 equal access to the full 10 megs and see what > happens then, if you don't throttle the p2p. > > > > > > Travis Johnson wrote: >> Hi, >> > If your network can't handle a small amount of p2p >> traffic, you have bigger issues. :) >> >> Travis >> Microserv >> > > > >> George Rogato wrote: >>> How do you cap the encrypted stuff? >>> >>> >>> Travis Johnson wrote: >>>> Hi, >>>> >>>> First let me say that we cap p2p traffic during the business day, >>>> but >>>> otherwise we let it run wide open. However, we sell our connections >>>> based on speed. Whatever they pay for is what they get... none of >>>> this burstable stuff, etc. If they want 512k, they pay for 512k. If >>>> they want 1meg, they pay for 1meg. >>>> >>>> The problem with bandwidth caps of xx gigs per month is that NOBODY >>>> else is doing it... not DSL, not Cable, not any of my wireless >>>> competitors, etc. Once you start putting that limitation on their >>>> connection, they will start switching to something that does not >>>> have caps. If you have bandwidth limits in place already, there is >>>> no need for the monthly limits. (This does not mean we allow 24x7 >>>> bandwidth usage, but we allow "reasonable" usage). >>>> >>>> Travis >>>> Microserv >>>> >>>> George Rogato wrote: >>>>> I think the way to go is to be able to identify the various types >>>>> of >>>>> traffic and rate limit them. >>>>> And once we can do this, then it's time to pull out the menu of >>>>> various offerings we can provide. >>>>> Want a 3 meg x 3 meg burstable connection with a sustained traffic >>>>> rate of 1meg x 256k and bandwidth cap of x gigs, it's price "a", >>>>> want a higher something in your package, it's price "b". Want >>>>> something different, then it's price "c". >>>>> >>>>> The sub can choose. Once they choose they know what they bought. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Mark Nash wrote: >>>>>> This is a good debate. >>>>>> >>>>>> What you mention here, George, is something that's been on my >>>>>> mind for the last year or so. As >>>>>> Lingo/Slingbox/Netflix/Vonage/etc/etc/etc make $$$ off >>>>>> of our connections, where's our cut? The customer is paying for a >>>>>> connection, yes, but at what point do we start charging more as >>>>>> this content >>>>>> proliferates through our networks? Bandwidth is getting cheaper >>>>>> per meg, >>>>>> you can get a bigger pipe for less per meg, you can do things to >>>>>> lower the >>>>>> cost of bandwidth. >>>>>> >>>>>> However, that should give US a better cash flow model, so we're >>>>>> not so squeezed out that we feel like not providing service >>>>>> anymore to folks who desperately want it. With more and more apps >>>>>> providing high-throughput >>>>>> content, it could easily offset the savings that can be realized by >>>>>> going >>>>>> with a bigger/cheaper pipe. IF IT IS UNCHECKED. >>>>>> >>>>>> My whole part in this discussion has been focused on not letting >>>>>> our customers cost us more than they are paying us, and I still >>>>>> say that deploying a system that allows us to be compensated for >>>>>> heavy usage is a valuable consideration in any business plan for >>>>>> an ISP. Bandwidth shaping, >>>>>> bandwidth caps, bill for overages, dedicated bandwidth option. If >>>>>> you have >>>>>> this in place, you really need not worry about anything else with >>>>>> respect to >>>>>> high bandwidth usage. >>>>>> >>>>>> IMHO. >>>>>> >>>>>> Thanks everyone for listening to my half-rant. I'm going to get >>>>>> something done now. ;) >>>>>> >>>>>> Mark Nash >>>>>> UnwiredOnline.Net >>>>>> 350 Holly Street >>>>>> Junction City, OR 97448 >>>>>> http://www.uwol.net >>>>>> 541-998-5555 >>>>>> 541-998-5599 fax >>>>>> >>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "George Rogato" >>>>>> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> >>>>>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> >>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 20, 2007 8:51 AM >>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Vuze / Comcast / Peer to Peer / FCC >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> Another thought is >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Why wouldn't Vuze have to pay Comcast for using the Comcast >>>>>>> network to support it's business plan. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> If they are relying on Comcasts network to store and send files >>>>>>> to >>>>>>> it's >>>>>>> customer base, why should they be treated for a free ride instead of >>>>>>> using a hosting provider like Akamia. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Guess that is just as a significant point as any other, the fair >>>>>>> compensation for services? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------- >>>>>>> - >>>>>>> --------- >>>>>>> >>>>>> ------ >>>>>>> WISPA Wants You! 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