All is good if the market can support it. But in my case the tower I mentioned 
don't even have close to 200 house holds within sight of it. 100 at best that 
we could service and assuming 50% sign up rate of all households within reach I 
think we would do very good. So 500 for 50 or so customers means 10 tower cost. 
Not factoring engineering cost or cost of rent on backhaul tower "upstream" to 
feed this remote tower. 

At 500/mo and 2k engineering fee in this area was just not economically 
feasible. 
/Eje
Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

-----Original Message-----
From: "Chuck Hogg" <ch...@avolutia.com>

Date: Mon, 12 Jan 2009 08:14:34 
To: WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers


We do this as well, however some of these commercial towers that we are
serving off of, have over 200 customers.  $500/mth is worth it for a
tower producing $10k/mth is it not?  Some of these locations we also
have grain legs that are in the same vicinity, and we have about 70
customers already on them.

We recently applied for our CLEC/PSC license within the state.  My goal
is to now build out a "mesh" type of network (not really) but we are
planning to put in telephone poles in our densely populated areas using
public easements.  Hand off customer locations from the telephone poles,
and backhaul it to our primary towers.  This does two things, increases
our density/availability in the market, but it also increases the number
of customers per actual tower.  10 customers per pole, 20 poles per
sector, in theory 600 customers per tower location.  The poles are going
to cost about $500 a pole (new), and $300 to get it set.  $300 in
electrician work, and 700 in equipment to serve off of it. So around $2k
to put in a new pole, and we plan on doing about 40 of them over the
year.  Then we only pay $7/mth for electricity per pole.

We are also adding Vecima WiMax to the mix this week, we'll see how it
goes.

My point was just to see if WISPA as an organization had a go to person
at any of these companies.  It might be worth it if WISPA went to the
companies to get someone as a go to person.

Regards,
Chuck Hogg
Avolutia, LLC
(502) 722-9292
www.avolutia.com
www.shelbybb.com


-----Original Message-----
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of e...@wisp-router.com
Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 11:37 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers

True. I tried to explain that for what we did and the type of market and
the location of the tower we couldn't afford paying that much but also
tried to explain that later on we might want to add some antennas to
relay signals elsewhere. Ended up giving up on the since they wouldn't
budge and I did make an arrangement with a farmer with a 120ft grain bin
that was actually at a better location and a much better deal. The local
farmer is very happy we are happy and the none local tower company is
oblivious and lost their chance. I can reach anywhere I want to with
this tower that I would on their tower. 

/Eje
Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile

-----Original Message-----
From: "Tom DeReggi" <wirelessn...@rapiddsl.net>

Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 23:31:50 
To: WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org>
Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers


I gotta agree with Blake. Many of the big tower companies are good to
WISPs, 
once they know you, and understand your business. Its just a long road, 
getting to that stage.  Just like any business, sales reps want to feel
out 
the opportunity with a client, and start out high, with the add-on 
fees,without discounting. What I find is that, there is a minimum dollar

amount to make it worth their time to talk to you. Think about it, if
they 
take ATT's call, they have the potential to sell 100s of towers and
antennas 
colos. They take your call, and they have limited potential to measilly
few 
hundred bucks, and its the same amount of work to write up the
contracts. I 
believe Eje' situation was a side effect of not asking to colocate
enough 
antennas in teh transaction. $300/1 antenna is a lot, but its feasible
that 
the same tower company might have given him 5-8 antennas for $500, if he

pushed for it.  Most tower's have free empty space, and the candidates
to 
buy it are shrinking.
ONce they understand you business model, and understand its not cost 
justified for you to pay carrier price, they'll usually come down to 
something fair.

But I think the same way... Its a hassle dealing wit htower companies,
jsut 
because of all the legal details and time involved. I'd hardly justify 
spending the negotiating time myself, for just an Omni install.

If you want a pack of gum, you don't go to the Hechts at the mall. Its
to 
time consuming to get in and out of there. Instead, you go to the local
7 
eleven. When you want to scale an operation and install a lot of
antennas, 
you NEED the tower companys. And its worth paying them for the benefits
it 
offers.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Blake Bowers" <bbow...@mozarks.com>
To: <e...@wisp-router.com>; "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 10:40 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers


> Hmmm
>
> I know LOTS of tower companies that although their main
> emphasis is cellular, they are very good to WISPS and others.
>
> I have WISPS paying anywhere between $25.00 a month
> to 500 a month, depending on location, height, etc.
>
> And yes, my MAIN emphasis is on Cellular.  I have towers
> in 18 states.
>
> I guess I am ripping of those WISPS.
>
>
> Don't take your organs to heaven,
> heaven knows we need them down here!
> Be an organ donor, sign your donor card today.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: <e...@wisp-router.com>
> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
> Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 1:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers
>
>
>> Most tower companies that deal with cell carrier are rip offs. One 
>> company
>> I talked with wanted a minimum 500/mo and a 2k engineering fee. All I
>> wanted was a omni around 150ft up in their 180ft tower and a small
>> backhaul panel that could be at 80ft (18"x18" panel).
>>
>> I offered $300 a month that is more then $1/ft per antenna and asked
for 
>> a
>> waiver or reduction of the engineering fee. No go. Other companies
same
>> thing. So don't even bother with those companies any longer rather
deal
>> with farmers and private tower owners.
>>
>> /Eje
>> Sent via BlackBerry from T-Mobile
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: "Eric Rogers" <ecrog...@precisionds.com>
>>
>> Date: Sun, 11 Jan 2009 14:04:31
>> To: WISPA General List<wireless@wispa.org>
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers
>>
>>
>> I priced space for 3 sectors and 2 backhauls.  They wanted $1600/mo.
I
>> built my own tower next to it... ;)
>>
>> Eric
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On
>> Behalf Of Mike Hammett
>> Sent: Sunday, January 11, 2009 10:34 AM
>> To: WISPA General List
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers
>>
>> I would only assume they are, but has anyone worked with them before?
>>
>>
>> -----
>> Mike Hammett
>> Intelligent Computing Solutions
>> http://www.ics-il.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------
>> From: "Jerry Richardson" <jrichard...@aircloud.com>
>> Sent: Thursday, January 08, 2009 12:23 AM
>> To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org>
>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers
>>
>>> No,
>>> I just thought it was interesting that all of their tower locations
>> are
>>> listed.
>>>
>>> I did not know they are as bad or worse than American Tower.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________________________________
>>> Jerry Richardson
>>> airCloud Communications
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
>> On
>>> Behalf Of RickG
>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 07, 2009 9:26 PM
>>> To: WISPA General List
>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] www.att.com/towers
>>>
>>> Ever price them?
>>> -RickG
>>>
>>> On Wed, Jan 7, 2009 at 8:54 PM, Jerry Richardson
>>> <jrichard...@aircloud.com> wrote:
>>>> FYI <http://www.att.com/towers>
>>>>
>>>> www.att.com/towers
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Jerry Richardson
>>>> VP Operations
>>>> 925-260-4119
>>>> P Please consider the environment before printing this email
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>
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