Tom, Sounds like a great approach.
Mark On 12/20/09 7:30 PM, "Tom Sharples" <[email protected]> wrote: > At the risk of boring people - we use both. We have a fairly sophisticated > software watchdog routine that checks all threads and the integrity of the > various network devices like eth, ath, tun, tap, ppp, etc. etc, every few > minutes. If it sees anything wrong it takes corrective action, which can > include a number of steps short of a system reboot. It also logs any errors > plus corrective actions in a local log file for later analysis, and uploads > the entire system status file to our back-end servers every 15 minutes. > That same software routine pings the hardware watchdog every minute. That > way, if the entire system hangs, the hardware timer reboots the board, but > if only one or more of the threads or I/O devices hangs, the software > watchdog takes care of it. > After several years of tweaking, this approach has been working very well > for us. > > Tom S. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Mark Stephenson" <[email protected]> > To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> > Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 2:10 PM > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? > > >> Tom, >> >> Watchdog timers like you describe are useful, but they tend to be less >> valuable than they used to be because newer software tends to be >> multi-threaded instead of single threaded and also the interfaces are >> smarter and do more processing on their own. This means there are more >> paths >> that the software is taking that may not be part of the watchdog timer. It >> is nice to have a watchdog timer to catch some things, but I think not >> having one is less of a show stopper than it used to be. We use external >> power controllers that can ping devices and can power cycle them if they >> do >> not respond. So far, I like that better because more of the system is >> probably tested by an external ping than by an internal watchdog timer. At >> least that is the theory. :) >> >> Thanks, Mark >> >> >> On 12/20/09 12:30 PM, "Tom Sharples" <[email protected]> wrote: >> >>> A hardware watchdog timer, typically, watches only one thing - is the >>> software and/or CPU still alive? If a software pinger fails to reset a >>> hardware counter or timer every few seconds or so, the timer reaches the >>> end >>> of its count and resets the motherboard. It is a failsafe if everything >>> else >>> goes wrong - something that happens more often than one would like when >>> you're using developmental drivers. Software watchdogs are a poor >>> substitute >>> for obvious reasons - if the software or CPU is completely hung, the >>> software watchdog won't work either! >>> >>> Tom S. >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Mark Stephenson" <[email protected]> >>> To: "WISPA General List" <[email protected]> >>> Sent: Sunday, December 20, 2009 4:12 AM >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? >>> >>> >>>> Tom, >>>> >>>> Do you happen to know what a hardware watchdog timer watches? Perhaps >>>> there >>>> is something it can watch like whether or not the device is sending on >>>> the >>>> Ethernet port or the program counter. But, it seems that as embedded >>>> systems >>>> add more software, a useful hardware watchdog timer becomes less >>>> possible >>>> because there are more things that can go wrong and it is >>>> difficult/expensive to make the hardware capable of checking those >>>> things. >>>> >>>> Thanks, Mark >>>> >>>> >>>> On 12/20/09 2:01 AM, "Tom Sharples" <[email protected]> wrote: >>>> >>>>> A software watchdog timer is not the same thing as a hardware watchdog >>>>> timer. >>>>> And SNMP has nothing to do with either. >>>>> >>>>> Tom S. >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: [email protected] >>>>> To: Tom Sharples ; WISPA General List >>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 9:03 PM >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> Please don't take me wrong on this but your statement (b) bothers me. >>>>> You >>>>> are either running a very old version of Air OS or you have no clue >>>>> what >>>>> your >>>>> talking about. UBNT has support for SNMP which I use to monitor not >>>>> only >>>>> uptime but signal strength and a few other key items check out ZenOss >>>>> if >>>>> you >>>>> need to watch these devices or any other network device for that >>>>> matter. >>>>> AirOS >>>>> also has a "Watchdog timer" in the software that will automatically >>>>> reboot a >>>>> device that fails a ping time you set. I have never had to power cycle >>>>> a >>>>> UBNT >>>>> device. In fact I had to reboot a Mikrotik router because it had a >>>>> locked >>>>> process in the packet sniffer application that drove the CPU to 100% so >>>>> the >>>>> UBNT gear has a higher uptime than the core router. >>>>> >>>>> Jaimie >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On Sat 12/19/09 12:24 PM , "Tom Sharples" [email protected] sent: >>>>> >>>>> My biggest concern with these units is (a) lack of mechanical >>>>> robustness - >>>>> little plastic bits leak or break off quite easily and (b) lack of >>>>> a >>>>> hardware watchdog timer which personally I think is essential esp. >>>>> when >>>>> you're using "development stage" firmware. We did most of the work >>>>> to >>>>> port >>>>> our Qcode to run on the ubnt platform, but have decided to shelf >>>>> that >>>>> project for another year, waiting for things to really settle down. >>>>> In the >>>>> CCTV business, there's no-one around to power-cycle the equipment >>>>> and >>>>> unrecoverable device hangs are really a disaster. I realize that >>>>> the >>>>> ISP >>>>> business is a little different because the customer can always >>>>> reboot >>>>> the >>>>> CPE! >>>>> >>>>> Tom S. >>>>> >>>>> ----- Original Message ----- >>>>> From: "Robert West" <[email protected]> >>>>> To: <[email protected]>; "'WISPA General List'" >>>>> <[email protected]> >>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 7:55 AM >>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? >>>>> >>>>> >>>>>> I'm with ya on all that, Jamie. We've had minor issues but I expected >>>>>> things to not be perfect, they never are with version 1.0! The trade >>>>>> off >>>>>> is >>>>>> worth it, for me anyhow. >>>>>> >>>>>> Bob- >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>>> From: [email protected] [[email protected]] On >>>>>> Behalf Of [email protected] >>>>>> Sent: Saturday, December 19, 2009 10:26 AM >>>>>> To: WISPA General List >>>>>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ubiquiti ready for prime time? >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> We use all UBNT and I have been very happy with the equipment. >>>>>> Tower has 2 Rocket M5s With 120 sectors, backhaul is Rocket M5s with >>>>>> the Rocket Dish. CPEs are Nano M5. Durring testing at 4 Miles with >>>>>> CPE to AP I was able to sustain symmetrical speeds of 75M to our >>>>>> test server on the other end of the backhaul. I was really amazed at >>>>>> how well they preformed for the price. I have read all the horror >>>>>> stories in the UBNT forums but have yet to have one problem. Probably >>>>>> just cursed myself and should of kept my mouth shut. But so far so >>>>>> good. >>>>>> On Sat 12/19/09 6:35 AM , Mike [email protected] sent: >>>>>> I was almost ready to pull the trigger on some Ubiquiti equipment >>>>>> for >>>>>> a new project. The scent of low price is alluring. Then I start >>>>>> reading about connectors pulling out, connectors not soldered on >>>>>> properly, and the wrong boot code on boards. >>>>>> Is it too early? Should I wait a bit before I dive in? Has the >>>>>> haste to get product into the distribution stream compromised >>>>>> quality >>>>>> control? Is the low price just too good to be true? I'd be >>>>>> interested in some constructive thoughts and analysis. >>>>>> Thanks mg >>>>>> >>>>>> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------------->> >> >> >> - >>>>>> ---- >>>>>> WISPA Wants You! 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