No, you're not out of line. I've given up suggesting these topics get moved to WISPA Chat. I usually try to refrain from weighing in myself ;-).
Chuck On Feb 5, 2010, at 11:06 PM, jason bailey wrote: > As a very small,but growing operator I have been following this list for > quite some time.I rarely poke my nose in as I enjoy the VERY intelligent > conversation that this list generates.I sometimes have to read 80 or more > messages when I get through putting in 110% and picking up my Three kids > after school as a single Dad and learn an unimaginable amount every day .I am > saddened by the level that some will take a conversation to.I hope to see a > political conversation as intense as this move elsewhere,But hey,I'm just a > single person,not the whole group.I can't learn anything about the technical > aspect of a WISP filtering the massive amount of email this topic has > generated.If i'm out of line,someone tell me. Regards ,Jason > > > Sent From My PrimeCo Phone > > --- On Fri, 2/5/10, MDK <rea...@muddyfrogwater.us> wrote: > > > From: MDK <rea...@muddyfrogwater.us> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation of > net-neutrality > To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> > Date: Friday, February 5, 2010, 10:44 PM > > > > There's never a NEED to accumulate power... ever. But, the greed and lust > for more power is as old as politics itself. > > > -------------------------------------------------- > From: "Jack Unger" <jun...@ask-wi.com> > Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 1:21 PM > To: "WISPA General List" <wireless@wispa.org> > Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation > ofnet-neutrality> C'mon Jeff. There is NO NEED to accumulate power if you > don't have >> excess people. >> >> jack >> >> >> Jeff Broadwick wrote: >>> C'mon Jack, war is about trying to accumulate power, not get rid of >>> excess >>> people. >>> >>> >>> Regards, >>> >>> Jeff >>> >>> >>> Jeff Broadwick >>> ImageStream >>> 800-813-5123 x106 (US/Can) >>> +1 574-935-8484 x106 (Int'l) >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _____ >>> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> Behalf Of Jack Unger >>> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 3:35 PM >>> To: WISPA General List >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation >>> of >>> net-neutrality >>> >>> >>> Your statement is true when there is NOT enough food, clothing or shelter >>> for everybody. >>> >>> But when there IS enough food, clothing and shelter for everybody, there >>> is >>> no need for war in order to achieve temporary "peace". >>> >>> This is why overpopulation is so bad - it creates war and makes real >>> peace >>> impossible. >>> >>> jack >>> >>> >>> Brad Belton wrote: >>> >>> I would hope everyone would choose peace over war, but history has proven >>> >>> since the beginning of time that peace is achieved through war. >>> >>> >>> >>> Without a clearly defined "Winner" and "Loser" of war there will never be >>> >>> peace. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> >>> Behalf Of Jack Unger >>> >>> Sent: Friday, February 05, 2010 11:28 AM >>> >>> To: WISPA General List >>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation >>> of >>> >>> net-neutrality >>> >>> >>> >>> Good points. >>> >>> >>> >>> When I have to choose between guns (war) or butter (peace), I'll choose >>> >>> the butter. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Robert West wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Life, Liberty, Property. >>> >>> >>> >>> Those were the basics that our government was formed to protect for us. >>> >>> >>> >>> For the common defense. >>> >>> >>> >>> It's now morphed from the government For the people into people For the >>> >>> government. As long as there are greedy people and the "what about mine?" >>> >>> thinkers, it won't get any better. >>> >>> >>> >>> As far as the current situation I think we should bring back the war tax >>> >>> >>> >>> and >>> >>> >>> >>> the draft. Now hear me out on this.... >>> >>> >>> >>> Are we at war? Where? I dunno, I'm not involved in any way, shape or >>> >>> >>> >>> form. >>> >>> >>> >>> Not directly anyhow. So it continues to zap the life out of this >>> country. >>> >>> We've sanitized the citizenry out of war thus it can go on forever >>> without >>> >>> much thought from those of us out here trying to live our lives and put >>> >>> >>> >>> food >>> >>> >>> >>> on the table and pay for the folly of it all. >>> >>> >>> >>> If we had a war tax and kids were being drafted, we'd all be involved, >>> >>> >>> >>> more >>> >>> >>> >>> commonly polarized and I guarantee you we wouldn't be pouring billions >>> >>> >>> >>> every >>> >>> >>> >>> month down useless well. >>> >>> >>> >>> Just my crazy thoughts. >>> >>> >>> >>> Bob- >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> >>> Behalf Of Brad Belton >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 10:38 PM >>> >>> To: 'WISPA General List' >>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation >>> >>> >>> >>> of >>> >>> >>> >>> net-neutrality >>> >>> >>> >>> Jack, >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Your police analogy is flawed. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> While it may take a larger police force to serve and insure the safety of >>> >>> >>> >>> a >>> >>> >>> >>> larger population it does not take a larger government body with >>> increased >>> >>> invasion of those people's lives to govern effectively. A larger >>> >>> >>> >>> population >>> >>> >>> >>> requires no more or fewer laws than a small population as the laws are >>> >>> applied to all regardless of the size of population. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Agreed, the more people that "give up" and begin to simply depend on the >>> >>> government to provide for them the worse our country (or any country) >>> >>> becomes. This is exactly what big government wants; the people to become >>> >>> more dependent on them. The more dependent the people become on big >>> >>> government the more power they have over your life and the fewer freedoms >>> >>> you enjoy. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Why is it that so many small businesses exist? They exist partly because >>> >>> they can provide a better service/price than the "big guys". Wireless >>> >>> providers (other than those looking for a handout to keep their doors >>> >>> >>> >>> open) >>> >>> >>> >>> exist because the ILECs created an opportunity that we identified and >>> >>> >>> >>> acted >>> >>> >>> >>> upon. Capitalism and the market works well as long as big government >>> >>> >>> >>> stays >>> >>> >>> >>> out of it. I don't know about the rest here, but the more the big >>> Telco's >>> >>> charge the better my business does! >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> What does America have to show for all the ridiculous recent spending? >>> GM >>> >>> is still losing Billions of dollars, the big banks that were forced to >>> >>> >>> >>> take >>> >>> >>> >>> TARP haven't changed and many have repaid TARP to get the government out >>> >>> >>> >>> of >>> >>> >>> >>> their business. Is it such a bad thing to own and operate a small >>> >>> >>> >>> business >>> >>> >>> >>> with no long term debt? Sure, it makes getting the company off the >>> ground >>> >>> that much harder, but it also creates a personal investment and >>> commitment >>> >>> by the proprietor beyond any cash infusion. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Unemployment is nearing record highs as those (evil guys) that employ >>> >>> >>> >>> people >>> >>> >>> >>> weather the storm of uncertainty. People are losing their homes.many of >>> >>> which never should have been afforded the privilege of home ownership if >>> >>> >>> >>> it >>> >>> >>> >>> were not for big government forcing lenders to lend to unqualified >>> buyers. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> I can go on, but I get the feeling none of this makes any sense to you, >>> >>> Jack. That's fine with me.there are those that do and those that.I don't >>> >>> know.just coast along I guess? >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> >>> Behalf Of Jack Unger >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 7:55 PM >>> >>> To: WISPA General List >>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation >>> >>> >>> >>> of >>> >>> >>> >>> net-neutrality >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad, >>> >>> >>> >>> You are misunderstanding or ignoring what I've been saying so let's try >>> it >>> >>> again. >>> >>> >>> >>> When you have more people crowded into the same space your are going to >>> >>> >>> >>> have >>> >>> >>> >>> more frequent and more complex problems, including more fighting over the >>> >>> available amount of resources. Like it or not, attempting to maintain >>> >>> >>> >>> order >>> >>> >>> >>> is expected of government, be it large or small government. A two-person >>> >>> police force is expected to be able to maintain order in a tiny community >>> >>> and a 10,000 person police force is expected to be able to maintain order >>> >>> >>> >>> in >>> >>> >>> >>> a large city. A two-person (small government) police force will not be >>> >>> >>> >>> able >>> >>> >>> >>> to maintain order in New York or Los Angeles. "Socialism" (however that >>> is >>> >>> defined or mis-defined) has nothing to do with this basic dynamic. >>> >>> >>> >>> America was built by hard-working people who thrived within the limited >>> >>> government framework that the founding fathers provided. Unfortunately >>> >>> today, 99% of the working people have lost or given up their power to >>> >>> >>> >>> govern >>> >>> >>> >>> their own lives. That power now resides in the hands of large >>> corporations >>> >>> (banks, factory farms, seed companies, meat processors, insurance >>> >>> >>> >>> companies, >>> >>> >>> >>> news networks, incumbent telecom companies, etc.). Government has >>> >>> unfortunately become complicit in this dynamic. Today, big money >>> >>> corporations control government by "buying off" politicians through large >>> >>> campaign contributions. It doesn't matter if the politicians are >>> Democrats >>> >>> or Republicans. Our big-money political system has corrupted virtually >>> all >>> >>> of them. Until we fix our broken political system by removing the >>> >>> corrupting effect of big money, none of us will regain the freedoms that >>> >>> were fought for and won by our ancestors. >>> >>> >>> >>> jack >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad Belton wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> Jack, >>> >>> >>> >>> I completely disagree with the notion that America has to become smaller >>> >>> >>> >>> to >>> >>> >>> >>> have a smaller less invasive government! It is a socialist mentality to >>> >>> think that only government can grow America or help Americans. >>> >>> >>> >>> America achieved its success by people utilizing their abilities to >>> better >>> >>> themselves and their lives free of an overly burdening government. >>> >>> >>> >>> America >>> >>> >>> >>> was not built by grants, entitlements or anything big government can >>> >>> possibly provide. Instead our constitution provides a framework >>> outlining >>> >>> government limitations, so as to prevent government to ever be able to >>> >>> control the people it governs. The people of the republic govern not the >>> >>> other way around. >>> >>> >>> >>> Countless Americans have given their lives to protect the very freedom >>> big >>> >>> government takes away. Government run health care just happens to be the >>> >>> straw that broke the camel's back and Americans are saying enough is >>> >>> >>> >>> enough >>> >>> >>> >>> in overwhelming numbers. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> >>> Behalf Of Jack Unger >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 4:48 PM >>> >>> To: WISPA General List >>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation >>> >>> >>> >>> of >>> >>> >>> >>> net-neutrality >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad, >>> >>> >>> >>> There is really only one way to get a smaller government without >>> >>> throwing society into total disarray. That method is to have a smaller >>> >>> country, in other words, a lower level of population. With an exploding >>> >>> population there is just no way that I can see to get a smaller >>> >>> >>> >>> government. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> If only reclaiming our country for working people was as easy as voting >>> >>> the incumbents out that would be GREAT but unfortunately it's not that >>> >>> simple. Voting the incumbents out won't result in government doing a >>> >>> better job for working people because the real influence is the >>> >>> big-corporation money that finances the election campaigns for each new >>> >>> crop of political nominees. The big-money lobbyists remain when each old >>> >>> group of politicians is voted out so the big-money corporation's power >>> >>> actually becomes greater and greater as time goes on. >>> >>> >>> >>> The solution that I propose is equal public financing for ALL political >>> >>> campaigns. Each nominee (and incumbent) would receive an equal number of >>> >>> taxpayer dollars to run their campaign. This will help ALL candidates >>> >>> remember who they are supposed to be working for (working-class >>> >>> taxpayers, not large corporations). >>> >>> >>> >>> As to regaining some influence for working people with regard to banks, >>> >>> I'd recommend that everyone put their money in a local credit union or >>> >>> small local community bank. My money has been kept in a local community >>> >>> credit union for over 20 years and I feel good about it being there. >>> >>> It's contributing to the community instead of being used in an >>> >>> irresponsible fashion and/or used against the best interests of the >>> >>> community. >>> >>> >>> >>> Best, >>> >>> jack >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad Belton wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> The fundamental difference that Jack fails to recognize is if a bank (or >>> >>> organization other than the government) does treat you unfairly you have >>> >>> recourse. If your own government treats you unfairly, you have little to >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> no >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> recourse. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Yes, we can all only hope the majority of Americans will continue to >>> stand >>> >>> up and say no more to big government. A smaller less intrusive >>> government >>> >>> is what America needs. In order to achieve this we have to remove the >>> >>> career politicians from office that have clearly lost touch with the >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> people >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> that elected them. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Brad >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On >>> >>> Behalf Of Jack Unger >>> >>> Sent: Thursday, February 04, 2010 3:01 PM >>> >>> To: WISPA General List >>> >>> Subject: Re: [WISPA] Common Carrier or what: The FCC's role in regulation >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> of >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> net-neutrality >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> So, now that government has been drowned, the huge banks, insurance >>> >>> companies, telecoms can do whatever they want to you whenever they want >>> to >>> >>> do it. >>> >>> >>> >>> BWaaaah, haaa, haaaa, haaa, haaaaggggh.... >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Frank Crawford wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> YES >>> >>> >>> >>> Jack Unger wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> I trust that government will be able to keep up just fine. Do you >>> >>> support the alternative of making government so small that you can drown >>> >>> it in a bathtub? >>> >>> >>> >>> Glenn Kelley wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Title II of the Communications Act-the section that regulates >>> >>> telecommunications common carriers is now being considered by the FCC to >>> >>> oversee broadband. FCC Commissioner Robert M. McDowell during a talk he >>> >>> gave to the Free State Foundation asked: (see First Do No Harm: A >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> broadband >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> plan for Amercia) >>> >>> "Exactly what kind of companies might get tangled up into this regulatory >>> >>> Rubik's Cube?.Any Internet company that offers a voice application?" . >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> "With >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> this newfound authority, why stop at voice apps? Isn't voice just another >>> >>> type of data app? As the distinction between network operators and >>> >>> application providers continues to blur at an eye-popping rate, how will >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> the >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> government be able to keep up?" >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Much more on the blog: www.HostMedic.com --> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ____________________________________________________________________________ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> _________ >>> >>> Glenn Kelley | Principle | HostMedic |www.HostMedic.com >>> >>> Email: gl...@hostmedic.com >>> >>> Pplease don't print this e-mail unless you really need to. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---- >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---- >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---- >>> >>> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >>> >>> http://signup.wispa.org/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> ---- >>> >>> >>> >>> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >>> >>> >>> >>> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >>> >>> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >>> >>> >>> >>> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >> >> -- >> Jack Unger - President, Ask-Wi.Com, Inc. >> Network Design - Technical Training - Technical Writing >> Serving the Broadband Wireless, Networking and Telecom Communities since >> 1993 >> www.ask-wi.com 818-227-4220 jun...@ask-wi.com >> >> >> >> >> >> >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> WISPA Wants You! Join today! >> http://signup.wispa.org/ >> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org >> >> Subscribe/Unsubscribe: >> http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless >> >> Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ > > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > WISPA Wants You! Join today! > http://signup.wispa.org/ > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org > > Subscribe/Unsubscribe: > http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless > > Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/ -------------- Chuck Bartosch Clarity Connect, Inc. 200 Pleasant Grove Road Ithaca, NY 14850 (607) 257-8268 "When the stars threw down their spears, and water'd heaven with their tears, Did He smile, His work to see? Did He who made the Lamb make thee?" >From William Blake's Tiger!, Tiger! -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wants You! Join today! http://signup.wispa.org/ -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- WISPA Wireless List: wireless@wispa.org Subscribe/Unsubscribe: http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless Archives: http://lists.wispa.org/pipermail/wireless/
