What a nice email, thanks. Yes I'm at the hotel bar at LA and you're right, this was a recipe to fix the chest pain my system was giving my young heart. :) This is a very supportive list of some very good people and I'm sorry when I just lash out but Thursday's 16 hour work day and 8 outages was about all I could take. I fully understand those saying "route your network" but last week when I put in a gig switch with layer 3 switching to start the routing chain, just installing it caused 4 outages before I even put it on the network. Some day I think the 'gods against progress' just wait for me to start improvements then slam me with outages to keep me from finishing. I almost feel dramatic in my response but I hate drama and people who whine but I've called these "experts" and they all disagree "use WDS", "turn on STP", "no don't use STP", its all so confusing when not a true geek in the literal sense. I"m trying to grasp the technicalities but I'm more a marketing guy who has a pretty kick ass system and a lot of really really loyal customers, I just want to do good by them. Have a great weekend and I look forward to seeing you at MUM. Well off to bed, I'm going to go ride roller coasters tomorrow, dammit I'm not too old even at 52!


On 9/17/2010 5:52 AM, Steve Barnes wrote:

Forbes, I understand your feelings and I hope your vacation is better than you expect. My recommendation is you have good people they can do it. Have someone hide your laptop and leave your cellphone in your room and go enjoy your vacation. Take an hour at the end of the day and check up on where things are to ease your mind. We will learn ways at MUM to help you out. Maybe you ought to pay a MTik Guru to look over your network layout and help you out. I will have such a guru riding shotgun with me at MUM. He may want to charge you for real support if you get two deep but he will give you some time I am sure on evening.

But till then relax if nothing else for the weekend.

*Steve Barnes*

RC-WiFi Wireless Internet Service <>

*From:* [] *On Behalf Of *Ryan Ghering
*Sent:* Friday, September 17, 2010 8:41 AM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* Re: [WISPA] I'm pulling Mikrotik

You know its funny I read these experiences with different types of gear, mind you we have never used Mikrotik for SM's to the customers but we do use them exclusively for other things. However we have similar problems with ANY of the gear we have purchased over the years. Most the most problems we experience are nearly 90% customer related.

LIke.. "Well yea I unplugged it all and replugged it in and it still don't work" I.E the customer plugged the gear in WRONG again..

Or I'm getting all sorts of packet-loss.. I.E the customer had roof work done and never told us so the antenna is out of alignment and or cable was cut and soldered back together.
( We get a lot of that one btw.)

And EVEN with a 65.00 trip fee they continue to do stupid crap, its the nature of our business I think..

However my FAVORITE problem of all time and we have had about 9 of these is from customers on Canopy 900 units.

It goes..


yes somehow we blew up the customers gear even though the SM is setup properly using a Canopy Surge Suppressor and a router between the SM and PC..

We actually had 2 customers try to Sue us over this.. And even though we won, they STILL don't believe that it wasn't us.. Stranger is that they still want to be customers..

BTW all 9 of those ended up with a bad AC line in the house or broken ground and or neutral..

My main point here is that even we the ISP's need to remember that we are dealing with mass produced electronics. Products that are made as cheaply and quickly as possible to feed our customers needs. While some of us may get years of good service from one brand others may only get months or days. To many factors go into why that is..

But in the most basic form, I'll tell you what my instructor told all of us in my DC electronics class nearly 20 years ago.. If its got a circuit board it will break in some manner.. Its only a matter of when.

BTW I do know that most config issues where the config is lost and or reset is due to large amounts of static electricity hitting the gear.. Doesn't matter what gear it is.. When a large (static burst)
hits the NVRAM on a board it will often erase the config.

But thanks for reading.. Just my 2 cents..


On Fri, Sep 17, 2010 at 6:18 AM, Jeremy Parr < <>> wrote:

On 17 September 2010 04:27, Forbes Mercy < <>> wrote:

    How my day ended, I really don't mean to slight Mikrotik or it's
    dealers.  People who route their networks will have a fraction of
    the problems I have but I have to admit the excuse of "must be
    your employees" or " that never happens" got old about 20 outages
    ago.  Today I had 8 major outages, 4 of them we found a bridge or
    ports erased and the IP displaying  This was an easy fix,
    log in and add the bridge and ports then click on the IP and it
    came back legitimate again.  Shame we had to make the trip to the
    towers to do that.  The other 4 not so easy, they showed the IP
    correctly but not in Winbox and they had the MAC address as, well 12 times, you get it.  Those we had to pull
    the backhaul and reset it then reprogram it.  A hellish day but we
    didn't miss the fact that the UBNT units never crashed no matter
    what this crazy bridging issue was.  It was just a real bad day to
    be in this business but I appreciate the help that I got from
    Mikrotik dealers who really care to help resolve this but are as
    equally frustrated as I was, while aging about 3 years in one
    day.  Like watching a baby sleep the night is uneventful after a
    15 hour work day and my with my added worry about taking 4
    vacation days this weekend.  I wish I could trust the equipment
    from overreacting to every damn bit of unfriendly traffic by
    shutting down the LAN port or resetting the radio but I can't,
    it's my employees problem now but it will certainly take away from
    the joy of my time off since I know their attitude is more like,
    'let them wait' then my feeling of 'people down is lost income',

What hardware do you run MT on, and what versions of the software are you using?

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Ryan Ghering
Network Operations - Plains.Net
Office: 970-848-0475 - Cell: 970-630-1879

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