Ok, some more here. I took the copied address into a text editor and changed the userreference value manually. I opened a new browser pasted the address with the changed key (to simulate user vars timed out)
And the user variable was blank and no session cookie was created. Interesting :-b Ben Johansen - http://www.pcforge.com Authorized Witango Reseller http://www.pcforge.com/WitangoGoodies.htm Authorized MDaemon Mail Server Reseller http://www.pcforge.com/AltN.htm -----Original Message----- From: Ben Johansen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:28 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key Ok, Now I am confused myself :-) Ok attached is a new TestAutoCookie.taf >From page 1 -> page 2 a session cookies is created On page 2 there is a new bottom form enter a value and press "to page 3" Highlight the address Close the browser window Open a new browser window and paste the address Your user variable will be there but no session cookie. Hmmm... Ben Johansen - http://www.pcforge.com Authorized Witango Reseller http://www.pcforge.com/WitangoGoodies.htm Authorized MDaemon Mail Server Reseller http://www.pcforge.com/AltN.htm -----Original Message----- From: Scott Cadillac [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 1:10 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: RE: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key Hi Atrix, Just another follow-up on your testing. And sorry, I haven't taken a look at Ben's code yet. But maybe if a _UserReference value is passed to the Server on the first request - Witango isn't bothering to issue the "Set-Cookie" header, which would explain why you don't see the cookies in HTTPLook. Just another thought from my rambling brain. And I guess I should just stop rambling and do more actual work, eh :-P I'm going to get myself in trouble here...I can just feel it.... > -----Original Message----- > From: Atrix Wolfe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 12:40 PM > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Subject: Re: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key > > > I tested w/ R:Tango 5 (not sure what build or version number > but I know it > is pre- the latest secuirty patch), Apache 1.3.24 and windows 2000. > > As far as i can see there is no user ref cookie. Im not sure > the name of > the cookie so i dumped <@varnames scope='cookie'> and it was > empty, also > using HTTPLook i see no cookies (: > > Single work station, working localy across 127.0.0.0 > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Scott Cadillac" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 11:19 AM > Subject: Witango-Talk: RE: Reusing the UserReference key > > > > Thank you Atrix, > > > > Could you also include what version of Witango you tested > with, OS and > > Webserver brand? > > > > In a serious test environment, it would also be good to see what the > > session-cookie value is in this scenario (should be the same as the > > UserReference key). > > > > I'm sure this has been discussed on the list in the past, > but just can't > > remember the results. > > > > Did you use more than one workstation? Just wondering.... > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Atrix Wolfe [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 12:09 PM > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Subject: Re: Reusing the UserReference key (was: > > > Witango-Talk: what happens with expired userReference?) > > > > > > > > > Well i just tested it. > > > > > > I have a .taf with a results html with this in it: > > > > > > <a href="<@cgi><@appfile>?<@userreferenceargument>">test!</a><br> > > > > > > what i did was create some links to this with edited user > > > refs (to simulate > > > expired user refs since they arent currently valid) and yeah, > > > each one used > > > the linked user ref as its own...meaning if there was a > > > search engine or > > > something that included the user reference argument in the > > > link, they would > > > all be using the same session which is no bueno! > > > > > > there might be a way to force the client to a new user > > > reference number. > > > > > > if so, at every page you can check to see if > user$validuser=1. If it > > > doesnt, force a new user reference number and set > > > user$validuser to 1 so the > > > first time someone visits your pages, they are forced to get > > > a new user ref > > > number, which would solve this issue. > > > > > > One of many solutions people will present, im sure :P > > > > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Scott Cadillac" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 10:46 AM > > > Subject: Reusing the UserReference key (was: Witango-Talk: > > > what happens with > > > expired userReference?) > > > > > > > > > After sending my post, and thinking about it.... > > > > > > I suppose my answer is probably not right, that the old > > > UserReference is > > > reused for a new session. > > > > > > In theory, if 10 different people all clicked on the same > > > Search page links, > > > which all had the same UserReference key value - and the old > > > key IS reused > > > for the new session(s) - then 10 people could be sharing > the same User > > > variables. Not good. > > > > > > Does somebody have a better answer than me? > > > > > > Like I mentioned, I don't personally use > > > <@USERREFERENCEARGUMENT> in my apps > > > and strictly rely on the session-cookie. So the above > > > wouldn't happen to me, > > > and I don't have an opportunity to test my own answer. > > > > > > Any feedback anyone??? > > > > > > Scott Cadillac, > > > Witango.org - http://witango.org > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > -- > > > Information for the Witango Developer Community > > > --------------------- > > > > > > XML-Extranet - http://xml-extra.net > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > -- > > > Well-formed Development (for hire) > > > --------------------- > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Scott Cadillac [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 11:34 AM > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > Subject: RE: Witango-Talk: what happens with expired > userReference? > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi Roland, > > > > > > > > As long as the VariableTimeout has expired by the time of > > > the new page > > > > visitor (with the old link), then the old User Variables are > > > > gone - and new > > > > ones are assigned as needed. > > > > > > > > I think, but not 100% sure, that the old UserReference key > > > > value in the old > > > > link is actually reused. This particular question is tough to > > > > answer because > > > > for myself, I don't use <@USERREFERENCEARGUMENT> and > just rely on > > > > session-cookies, which means your scenario would never > > > present itself. > > > > > > > > It is when the VariableTimeout period has not expired yet > > > (default 30 > > > > minutes), that a Security issue is introduced where the new > > > > visitor can be > > > > given access to someone else's User Variables. This is known > > > > as Session > > > > Hijacking. > > > > > > > > But, with all that said, your scenario I think is less > problematic. > > > > > > > > Your concern is about when a SearchBot hits your site, and is > > > > automatically > > > > granted a <@USERREFERENCE> key. This key value is then stored > > > > as part of > > > > your site links for a search engine - which is then exposed > > > > to anonymous > > > > users. > > > > > > > > In theory the SearchBot is not logging in to secure pages > > > > with a password, > > > > and is typically not trying to do on-line purchases - so I > > > > would think there > > > > is very little to hijack. Especially given the fact > that a case for > > > > hijacking is very remote here. > > > > > > > > In theory, in your code, any User Variables you assign to > > > > anonymous visitors > > > > on the public side of your pages are relatively non-critical > > > > - which is all > > > > a SearchBot would be granted, or any other public visitor who > > > > has not logged > > > > in yet. > > > > > > > > Of course that is just theory because I don't really know > > > what you're > > > > assigning your public anonymous visitors, with respect to > > > > Variables or your > > > > VariableTimeout setting. > > > > > > > > Hope this helps. Cheers.... > > > > > > > > Scott Cadillac, > > > > Witango.org - http://witango.org > > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > -- > > > > Information for the Witango Developer Community > > > > --------------------- > > > > > > > > XML-Extranet - http://xml-extra.net > > > > 403-281-6090 - [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > -- > > > > Well-formed Development (for hire) > > > > --------------------- > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Stefan Gonick [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, August 06, 2003 11:05 AM > > > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > > > Subject: Re: Witango-Talk: what happens with expired > > > userReference? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I'm pretty sure that the Witango server starts a new > > > > > user session if the user reference has expired. > > > > > > > > > > Stefan > > > > > > > > > > At 09:47 AM 8/6/2003 -0700, you wrote: > > > > > >when you have a project and the company's IT manager > > > > > personally refuses > > > > > >cookies, he writes it into the job spec that the site work > > > > > for people who > > > > > >hate cookies. ain't that nice? > > > > > > > > > > > >On Wednesday, August 6, 2003, at 09:36 AM, Bill Conlon wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > >>Yet another reason to use <@USERREFERENCECOOKIE> > > > > > >> > > > > > >>>when a bot cruises through a site and each link has a > > > > > userReference=xxx > > > > > >>>URL argument, it stores those along with the stable URL. > > > > > What happens > > > > > >>>when someone comes back to that exact URL, userreference > > > > > and all, after > > > > > >>>the session variables have expired? > > > > > > > > > > > >_____________________________________________________________ > > > > > ___________ > > > > > >TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf > > > > > > > > > > ======================================================== > > > > > Database WebWorks: Dynamic web sites through database > integration > > > > > http://www.DatabaseWebWorks.com > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > > > > __________ > > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf > > > > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > > > __________ > > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf > > > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > > __________ > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > > > __________ > > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf > > > > > > > > ______________________________________________________________ > __________ > > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf > > ______________________________________________________________ > __________ > TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf > ________________________________________________________________________ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf ________________________________________________________________________ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf ________________________________________________________________________ TO UNSUBSCRIBE: Go to http://www.witango.com/maillist.taf
