With this debate seeming to get more deeper by each input I'm but tempted to make my ill-timed entry.
Comrades mine wants us to pinpoint a single part in the whole and that is the police brutality whenever our people are protesting, be it workers or the community members. Informed by the fact that this section of society forms "a crucial" strata of the motive forces of the National Democratic Movement I find it very unpleasing that an organ of an ANC-led state can ill-treat its own people in this way, not when those people are unarmed and are not physically attacking anyone.
In some cases the ire of the protestors is agitated by the very cops and officials. For instance, how would you expect to see happening when the very person who is the focus of the protest fails to show up and instead sends his/her subordinate to accept a memo of grievences? Furthermore I'm of the view that no matter how disciplined you could be you can't be always sure that your protest will go according to "acceptable" manner throughout. Maybe the new Top Cop, Mr. Cele, can also focus at teaching his cops "acceptable" methods of controlling crowds instead of being obsessed with the amendment of section 26 and 49 of Criminal Act. I don't know how many times have we heard complaints on unresolved cases of police brutality swelling the Independent Complaints Directorate - a toothless dog.
From: Mduduzi H Vilakazi <[email protected]>
Subject: [YCLSA Discussion] YCLSA condemns the dismissal of soldiers bytheMinister of Defence and Military veterans
To: [email protected]
Date: Thursday, 3 September, 2009, 7:52 AM
Cde Claire,
I fully agree with you on the second part, however your first part is somehow. I am not a communist but a young communist and a socialist. I am raising issues as they stand and those like you who have the communist theory will put flesh and give a communist direction. I believe that in that way I will learn.
I still remain firm to my view that no matter the size, society must be taught to respect the rule of law. If not, we will stop to control lawlessness. Does your statement mean that poor people who genuinely need food can go to any hypermarket and take whatever they want? Even with a genuine demand, society should do things within parameters of law. Why in the first place did they go to court if they dont believe in law.
I must remind you that apartheid regime was long buried, we are operating in a democratic dispensation. We have all through elections legitimized the state (all its organs). Soldiers by their very nature are law enforcers and peace keepers. I am not saying that they should have rested the case where they received the court ruling. The minister is a political head sitting in the highest structures of the ANC. They could have addressed it political.
Let me explain, most of these soldiers come from the ranks of MK and Apla. They can push their matters politically by requesting a meeting with the SG of the ANC or the country's president who in turn is a Commander-in-Chief of the army. None of these routes were attempted. We can justify in any way the actions of the soldiers but frustration must not be the determinant of justifying a wrong course of action. There are many frustrated people, if we allow for lawlessness to continue because of frustration, the country will cease to be peaceful and anarchy will be the order of the day.
I rest my case.
Eish comrades. I’m amazed to hear a communist make a giant general statement like this: “No matter the size, society must be taught to respect the rule of law”.
Should we have respected the rule of apartheid law? We would still be living with it if we had! So instead of making a broad statement, the comrade really needs to tell us WHY we should respect a law that says soldiers may not strike, or march on a certain day, or what-what. The comrade who replied to you is very correct in pointing out that soldiers felt like there were no more ‘legal’ channels to follow. People will end up disrespecting laws that prevent them from getting justice. If it wasn’t for that we’d never be able to imagine defeating capitalism, a system based on the entirely legal theft otherwise known as exploitation.
Date: Wed, 2 Sep 2009 13:03:24 +0200
From: [email protected]
To: [email protected]
Subject: [YCLSA Discussion] YCLSA condemns the dismissal of soldiers bythe Minister of Defence and Military veterans
You are concluding on the result other than the root cause. The root cause of the problem is that the soldiers undermined a court ruling. This is but one of the organs of the state.
I fully agree with comrade Tom, lawlessness is lawlessness and we must not make a hullabaloo about it. Society should learn that this is but one country rich in law and should always be taught to abide by the law.
It is not correct that because those who broke the law are many then dismissal is incorrect. No matter the size, society must be taught to respect the rule of law. There is no due process in undermining organs of the state. There is court proof that what the soldiers was against the law. There is no need for a hearing, dismasal is the only way to send a message that no matter your responsibility in the country, we are all expected to function within the confines of the law.
I believe that the inputs by Cde Tom, Cde Morgan and others will assist you to grasp the base and not solve the result. The dismissal is the result of disrespect for the rule of law - Isnt that simple?
I remain.
>>> "Mxolisi Mlatha" <[email protected]> 02/09/2009 10:14 >>>
Our country becomes a banana republic when we start firing
people without any due process. Any caring society must
always be weighted in favor of the poor, disadvantaged and
weak no the state. When workers (soldiers) are dismissed
without regard to due process and the outdrawn failures of
the state to respond to legitimate grievances then we are
fading into a banana republic.This is the only thing that
is right about your banana republic statement my comrade.
Mxolisi
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