cde Ian Some of us have now developed thick skin and are nolonger moved by statements that seek to demonise the MDC. We confine ourselves to substance and nothing else.
As cde Jeremy Cronin would say, "Lets try again." I have more than four times (and am counting) asked you a very simple question, which am asking again: which writen policy document of the MDC from its policy positions in print and on the MDC website, am giving it to you for the 4th time, www.mdc.co.zw, makes you conclude that the MDC is an imperialist organisation, and therefore not an organisation of the people of Zimbabwe? Please point to the positions it makes our debate to be based on facts rather than what we had for breakfast in the morning or the mood we are in. You make some wild accusations which you do not substantiate. The MDC can not be an imperialist organisation simply because you say so-really now cde Ian. By refusing and side stepping pointing to the positions of the MDC which make you say the MDC is an imperialist organisation, you are not taking the discussion anywhere. Since you raised the issue you have refused to take the challenge therefore for now it is safe to conclude that you are arguing from a position of enthusiasm rather than facts and substance. You seem to concede in your last email that the MDC has a propressive land policy. You sweepingly concede and in a sophistry way. Its fine to concede properly and clearly that you have read the MDC position on land and you think you have educated yourself and were wrong. Again cde Ian, which policy position of the MDC from its website or from print position makes you say that the MDC is an imperialist organisation? The website of the MDC is www.mdc.co.zw, three economic policy documents of the MDC are, BRIDGE, RESTART and STEP, and Medium Term Plan (MTP). These can be found on the MDC website or at zimtreasury.org or just google them. I have assisted you, now assist yourself so that you can assist the discussion. It is pointless to respond to the issues you raise unless you address yourself to these matters. Asikhulume On 12/15/09, Dominic Tweedie <[email protected]> wrote: > Cde Ian, > > Would you mind explaining to me why I should not call you a sectarian? > > Could you explain why I should not say, on the strength of your latest > contribution, that Ian is a person who loves to divide, and hates to unite? > > I wonder why you ignore the entire discussion, but then five days after it > has stopped, you come flying in with an aggressive, provocative pile of > insults and accusations? > > Have you been mentally visiting another planet in the mean time? Why can you > not see the danger that follows when people make intemperate statements like > you have done? Can you not see the examples all around you in Johannesburg, > or Pretoria, here in South Africa where you are now living? > > Why did you not notice that we had arrived at certain understandings here on > this forum, during this very discussion, that are relevant to what is going > on in our country? Understandings about being reasonable with each other? > > Do you perhaps want us to start emulating the situation in Zimbabwe, where > you used to live, and where people hold sectarian grudges against each other > for years and decades at a time? > > Why can you not respect the masses, in the way that I advocated in the > discussion above? > > I am mortified by this repeated ugly aggression of yours. This is not a good > example for anyone in the present circumstances. > > Our task is to stay in touch with the masses and not to withdraw from them > and fire verbal artillery at them from a distance. That is how we legalise > ourselves and it is how we avoid being persecuted. The relationship with the > masses is the key. The communists must not cut themselves off from any part > of it. > > In struggle, > > *VC* > > > > > > 2009/12/15 Ian Beddowes <[email protected]> > >> The idea that there should be a communist party linked to the imperialist >> organisation in Zimbabwe known as the MDC is Utterly Ridiculous. In >> mentioning the forces which came together to form the MDC, the person who >> put the list together conveniently leaves out the Rhodesian Front. >> Whatever >> the stated policy on the land issue, Tsvangirai was filmed taking cheques >> from ultra-right white farmers, and in Zimbabwe, it has never been a >> secret >> that massive sums of money came in from the UK and USA who put sanctions >> on >> Zimbabwe following the defeat of US backed forces by the Zimbabwe Army in >> the DRC war. (In which the biggest battle was Cabinda, Angola). If >> comrades >> read "The Zimbabwe Democracy and Economic Recovery Act" available on the >> Internet, they will see the bloody lie perpetrated by the MDC, the US and >> UK >> that sanctions are targetted. Simplistic workerism, which disregards the >> tactics of imperialism, in particular the Anglo/American Alliance is not >> in >> any way connected to >> socialism but rather to the Social Democracy that led Millions to >> slaughter >> in the First World War. By the way, those of us who were around Bulawayo >> during the US invasion of Iraq could not help but see the large numbers of >> pro-US T-shirts worn by the same MDC supporters who masquerade as >> progressives. This is the same kind of Trade Unionism used by the >> imperialists in Chile, Poland and Zambia. >> At least one person has mentioned the great Joshua Nkomo -- ZAPU thee >> original and authentic liberation movement of Zimbabwe, has now extricated >> itself from the unity accord. ZAPU has neither dirtied itself by beatings >> and killings of political opponents nor has it gorged itself at the trough >> of imperialism -- something that certain people are inviting the SACP to >> do. >> -----Original message----- >> From: Nqobizitha Mlilo M [email protected] >> Date: Tue, 08 Dec 2009 14:12:12 +0200 >> To: [email protected] >> Subject: Re: [YCLSA Discussion] The Changing Times Online >> >> >> > -- > Blog at: http://domza.blogspot.com/ > Communist University web site at: http://amadlandawonye.wikispaces.com/ > Subscribe for free e-mail updates at: > http://groups.google.com/group/Communist-University/ > Library of documents (CU "CD") at: http://cu.domza.net/ > [email protected] > > -- > You are subscribed. 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