--- In [email protected], Kristy McClain <healthyplay1@...> wrote:
>
> Hi Steve,
> Â
> Actually, I have no interest at all in the egoic power exchange in
> relationships. This is off-topic for this group, but I welcome the
> opportunity to discuss this with you .   What did fascinate me , and the
> reason I brought D/s into this thread was how Sally KÂ described the guru
> relationship. It sounded a little scary to me. But thats me. One of
> the qualities i am working to develop within myself is trust. This has
> never come easily for me. Probably why I am such an analytical
> thinker. It is a block I am working on.Â
> Â
> But back to to the subject... Surrendering your being to a guru by trusting
> another to completely shape your inner spiritual developmen (and god knows
> what else) is uncomfortable for me. There is a correlation to D/s, butÂ
> there are marked distinctions as well.
> Â
> I don't completely agree with your analysis on submissives and Dominants.Â
> Perhaps in some cases, elements of this can be true. But let me give you
> some background. I learned about D/s, and BDSM 10 + years ago, when I
> worked with a group of female submissives who had been seriously abused
> physically and psychologically.   Let me be clear, as I do not judge those
> who choose this lifestyle. What works for others is fine with me, provided it
> does no lasting harm. I could write a book on this, but fortunately, there
> are plenty already. You may know some like, "Screw the Roses-- Send Me
> the Thorns", and the like.
> Â
> It was, and is-- a common perception that submissive females were abusedÂ
> in childhood, often with dysfunctional backgrounds including addictions.Â
> They may have a history of abusive relationships, and have very low
> self-esteem. Dominants were perceived as inwardly insecure with
> volitile emotions about females,  that may have begun with their own
> mothers.  The sexual  dance they play has been perceived as a means of
> "eroticized" therapy,  wherein they acts out their own neurotic and
> narcissitic needs. But its a lot more complex than that.
> Â
> One element I found interesting is that you can't really stereotype the
> Dominants, and to a degree the subs /slaves. I have known Doms from the
> inner-city back streets.  I also know a CEO of a global insurance compamy
> that is one. I know a plastic surgeon in Beverly Hills that is. A
> pediatrician in NC , who is. So, its a complex dynamic, and there are some
> sexy ideas involved. I can't deny that. D/s never troubled me the way S/m
> did. I understand intellectually, the S/m dynamic and the endorphin play.Â
> Frankly, what goes on in someone's bedroom is none of my business, provided
> it is consentual, does not involve minors, and does not create a public
> safety hazard.
> Â
> Not that you are asking, but I certainly have experimented a bit myself in
> alternative sexual roles. I enjoyed the role of being an "odalisque" in
> relationships.  This is a sexually submissive female, but involves no S/m
> at all.  There is a very distinct difference between being an odalisque
> in consentual sexual slavery, and being a sub in BDSM. The odalisque is
> actuallya luxury item for her partner. She is valued for her sexual beauty
> and talents, and is always treated with great respect.Â
> Â
> I'd be lying if I told you that I no longer engage in such play. We do.Â
> But I am also older and despite trying to divorce the traditional ,
> loving, and "vanilla" part of me-- i can't.  Those qualities are still
> part of what makes Kristy--Kristy. So, I engage in both traditional and
> not-so-traditional sex play.
> Â
> I will offer this.. I find this kind of role-play to be very helpful in
> gaining a deeper understanding of myself and my partner. Yes-- it is
> intensely erotic, but also psychologicaly broadening. (So-to-speak;) It helps
> me to be psychologically naked, which is a lot harder than being physically
> so. The intimacy that is created is unparalled.
> Â
> But to sum-- I have no interest in the ego part of sex. I believe we should
> be all that we are. Not one bit more. and not one bit less. Offer all that
> we are to each other and the world. Never be afraid to make mistakes or
> appear foolish.  Those are actually the times that draw others in, I think.
> Â
> Back to the original topic. Should a Teacher sleep with a discipline? I
> can only tell you what is right for me.  I could never do this. It
> would compromise my ability to discern more clearly who I am. It would
> cloud my perception, and very likely-- because sex is something I value
> highly. I don't cling  to it, or obsess about it. Its simply aÂ
> healthy, normal, happy part of a balanced life.
> Â
> Thanks for your great comments!!
> Â
> Kristy
>
> Hi Kristy. Thank you for your professional perspective. I do
suppose I play Pop Psychologist a bit too much. I certainly
agree with you that teachers should not sleep with students.
IMO, in the context of spiritual practice, it would compromise
the teacher's objectivity. I have no opinion about whether piano
teachers, etc. should or should not sleep with their pupils.
Though I would say, from the perspective of one who has taught
martial arts, that I would never sleep with a student. But then,
I regard traditional karate as one of the ways to learn to let-go
of ego.
Steve
>
>
>
>
>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
------------------------------------
Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are
reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links
<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/
<*> Your email settings:
Individual Email | Traditional
<*> To change settings online go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join
(Yahoo! ID required)
<*> To change settings via email:
[email protected]
[email protected]
<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
[email protected]
<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
