Anthony,

I have many.  You could use [email protected].  That's the one I use for 
the Zen Forum...Bill!

--- In [email protected], Anthony Wu <wuasg@...> wrote:
>
> Bill,
>  
> I think you mean to have me forward messages to your private email address 
> outside the forum, but I don't remember yours. Please provide.
>  
> Anthony
> 
> --- On Mon, 18/4/11, Bill! <BillSmart@...> wrote:
> 
> 
> From: Bill! <BillSmart@...>
> Subject: Re: [Zen] Attachment to dharma cc Bill
> To: [email protected]
> Date: Monday, 18 April, 2011, 10:11 AM
> 
> 
>   
> 
> 
> 
> Anthony,
> 
> I've also noticed some strange happenings from time-to-time vis-a-vis 
> email-handling of Yahoo! posts. In trying to research some of these I've 
> never discovered WHY the things I was reasearching occurred, but they always 
> just 'fixed themselves' sooner or later.
> 
> To try to help you research this I'd need more information:
> - what mailbox service are you using? (Yahoo!, POP/POP3 server, ...?)
> - what email application are you using? (Yahoo!, MS Outlook/Outlook Express, 
> Mac, ...?)
> - what SPAM detection application are you using? (Yahoo!, MS Outlook/Outlook 
> Express, Mac, SpamArrest, ...?)
> 
> ...and I'd need you to foward me at least one each of an expample of a Yahoo! 
> Zen Forum email that came to your INBOX and SPAM Folder.
> 
> ...Bill!
> 
> --- In [email protected], Anthony Wu <wuasg@> wrote:
> >
> > Bill,
> >  
> > My following post, as well as some others, went to my 'spam' folder. But 
> > others survived and showed up in the inbox.
> >  
> > I don't understand the operation of Yahoo system.
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Mon, 18/4/11, Anthony Wu <wuasg@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Anthony Wu <wuasg@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] Attachment to dharma
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Monday, 18 April, 2011, 6:24 AM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JM,
> >  
> > I am glad you don't take offense. I believe your Heart Chan is a good 
> > practice. But whether or not it is 'uniquely suitable for me' is another 
> > matter. It does not help to keep putting labels on me. We had better review 
> > what the Diamond Sutra says:
> >  
> > åº"æâ€" æ‰€ä½�è€Å'ç"Ÿå…¶å¿Æ'
> >  
> > You should develop a mind which does not abide in anything.
> >  
> > Remember 'xin' is 'mind' here.
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Sun, 17/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] Attachment to dharma
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Sunday, 17 April, 2011, 9:47 PM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Hi Anthony,
> > 
> > No worries.  I don't take offense.  :-) 
> > 
> > Words are confusing only if your heart is closed. Words are confusing only 
> > if you interpret them in one particular way.  You are confused because 
> > you are thinking.  No thinking.  No confuse.
> > 
> > We use Heart so that it is much easier to learn our practice than two kinds 
> > of mind.  Get it?  I am not saying that you are wrong.  I am just 
> > saying that I have witnessed that using heart is a more effective way to 
> > stop thinking and judging.  It is quite evident in your case.  
> > 
> > Anthony, words are maya.  Please either sit down and let your heart 
> > shine through.
> > 
> > The more I write you, the more I sense that our practice of Heart Chan is 
> > uniquely suitable to you.
> > JM
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We
> > ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/17/2011 2:23 AM, Anthony Wu wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JM,
> >  
> > You say, 'you are studying the Zen with your conscious mind'. Now you have 
> > started to use 'mind', instead of 'conscious heart'.
> >  
> > As long as we have not become a Buddha, we need to use words. Your teacher 
> > uses a lot of words, as did Sakyamuni. Words should not lead to confusion. 
> >  
> > What is the Chinese word for 'mind'?
> >  
> > If you take  offense, you don't have to answer, and I apologize in 
> > advance.
> >  
> > anthony
> > 
> > 
> > --- On Sun, 17/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: [Zen] Attachment to dharma
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Sunday, 17 April, 2011, 2:05 PM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Dear Anthony,
> > 
> > You are so wrong.   So attached to dharma.  
> > 『法相�。  I am sorry.  I don't like to 
> > comment how you think.  But as Sodaiho Sensei suggested, sometimes we 
> > need to talk like a blade.  So here it goes.....
> > 
> > 
> > Terminology is describing the practice, but not the practice itself.  
> > Terminology is describing the experience, but not the experience itself.
> > All formed practice is not the practice.
> > Diamond sutra said, "when see form as no form, then you see Buddha". Words 
> > are form, Anthony.
> > I use heart because all we teach is a practice.  And this practice 
> > begins with the heart.  At the end of the practice, the heart is gone, 
> > only a certain synchronization remain.  There is no heart, no mind, no 
> > nothing, no label, no form, only chi, electricity and lights.  We call 
> > that the realm of ultimate truth.  It is our way of teaching the 
> > practice.  Unless you practice this way, you will not witness these 
> > experiences.
> > 
> > In other words, as said in all the sutra, words are for our convenience 
> > only and they are not absolute.   I was repeated remind by my 
> > teacher, "Please do not take notes. Do not memorize my words."  Now I am 
> > asking you to do the same.  Because someday, I may just use mind, when I 
> > am awakened to it.  :-) 
> > 
> > What is your experience about conscious mind and beginner's mind.  Not 
> > definition from someone else, but your personal experience. If you do not 
> > have one than you are studying the Zen with your conscious mind.  Or to 
> > be blunt, you are attached to dharma.  All these notions of yours are 
> > the rising of your conscious mind attached to absolute dharma.  That is 
> > our teaching.  Sorry, that's really Buddha's teaching, if I understand 
> > it correctly.
> > 
> > Please do not read my words.  They are external to you.  The answer 
> > to all of your comments is within you.
> > 
> > My words are meaningless unless you can sync to it with your heart.  My 
> > words are just one of many ways to reach enlightenment. By no means they 
> > are the only way.  
> > 
> > If you don't like our way, please find your own way.  However, if you 
> > are interested to learn how we Sit Chan, I will be happy to send you a book 
> > free of charge.
> > 
> > Okay?
> > 
> > All these time you utilized your valuable time to discuss with me about the 
> > accuracy of translations.  I appreciate your good will.  Words are 
> > however relative and context driven in the teaching that I have absorbed.
> > 
> > Please don't be trapped by definitions of other people.  Only trust your 
> > own witness.
> > 
> > JM
> > 
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/16/2011 9:01 PM, Anthony Wu wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JM,
> >  
> > The terminology has nothing to do with what we practice. 
> >  
> > One more question: how do you translate 'mind' into Chinese?
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Sun, 17/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Sunday, 17 April, 2011, 8:26 AM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Hi Anthony,  Thank you for your suggestion.  When one day you 
> > practice the same way as I do, having similar experience, then it's the 
> > time for us to continue this subject.
> > 
> > Okay?  With respect, JM
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/16/2011 4:37 PM, Anthony Wu wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JM,
> >  
> > Your teacher has a profound mind. But I disagree with your translation. In 
> > modern English, 'heart' is used to refer to the physical organ, as well as 
> > the thought associated with emotions and feelings. So to say he teaches you 
> > about the heart is not to give him enough respect.
> >  
> > Yishi xin is conscious mind.
> >  
> > Ben xin is original mind, or maybe the beginner's mind.
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Sat, 16/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Saturday, 16 April, 2011, 9:55 PM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Hi Anthonyï¼Å' 
> > 
> > Actually he never used the "mind" word.  He always say we need to tune 
> > down the 『� è­˜ å¿Æ'� and let the 『æÅ"¬ 
> > å¿Æ'� shine through.  Or translated literally into English, 
> > [original heart] and [conscious heart].  
> > 
> > Let me know if you have more question.
> > JM
> >       
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/16/2011 2:35 AM, Anthony Wu wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JM,
> >  
> > I believe all mental functions you mention can be included in the 'mind', 
> > but 'chi' is not there. So roughly I think your 'heart' is 'mind' plus 
> > 'chi'. 
> >  
> > You have not answered my question: what does your teacher say in Chinese 
> > when he refers to 'heart' and 'mind'?
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Sat, 16/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Saturday, 16 April, 2011, 6:32 AM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Somewhat Yes, Anthony.  To be exact to our teaching, the Heart Chakra, 
> > is what I usually refer to as the location of the "heart", which is not the 
> > organic heart, nor is just an energy point.  It is just the center of 
> > the energy point.  The Heart Chakra however is not the "heart" that I 
> > refer to either.
> > 
> > The Heart that I refer to is the collective feeling, sensing, wisdom, 
> > energy, joy, sadness, etc. etc.  our entire being, physiological, mental 
> > and spiritual combined, unified, integrated into one, yet it is invisible 
> > and formless.
> > 
> > Let me ask you this, does the "mind" IYO, includes all of this or not?  
> > I could be wrong, but I understand that the mind does not include all this.
> > 
> > For instance, the Heart that I refer to definitely includes energy, or chi 
> > and emotions.  Does the mind include that?
> > 
> > If not, then heart is the term communicates my experience more accurately.
> > 
> > Well?
> > JM
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/15/2011 2:45 PM, Anthony Wu wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JM,
> >  Without the heart pumping blood to the brain.  The brain is dead.'
> >  
> > Equally correct is 'without a living brain, the heart can only pump blood 
> > for a zombie, or for another person it is transplanted into.'
> >  
> > Since you pay attention to chakras, I suspect your 'heart' has to do with 
> > the heart chakra, which Tantra considers an important center. Is it right?
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Fri, 15/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Friday, 15 April, 2011, 9:50 PM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Yes, Anthony, no problem.  The heart includes the mind.  But the mind 
> > does not contain the heart.  As Daniel said, heart is the "grand central 
> > station".  Forget the Chinese definition, just feel it.  :-)  JM.
> > 
> > Or, perhaps, think in physiological term.  Without the heart pumping 
> > blood to the brain.  The brain is dead.
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/15/2011 6:05 AM, Anthony Wu wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JMJM,
> >  
> > Don't think I am making trouble for you. I am just curious. On your part, 
> > you have not 'conquered your terminology' either, because you keep 
> > enhancing the 'heart' and disparaging the 'mind'. I am wondering what your 
> > teacher says in Chinese referring to 'heart' and 'mind'. As far as I can 
> > see from my limited knowledge, both are referred to in Chinese by 'xin'. In 
> > general, they are the same, but sometimes they may mean different things. 
> > That is why I keep asking. My question is not about terminology, but you 
> > say you have different experiences with regard to the mind and the heart. 
> > Can you elaborate?
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Fri, 15/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Friday, 15 April, 2011, 7:53 AM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Hi  Anthony,
> > 
> > I understand that you trying to discuss from a logic or definition of 
> > words.  I am not saying whether I am correct or wrong.  At the 
> > beginning of my journey I am like you.  I struggle with these terms as 
> > well.  As I said, it took me six year to conquer my terminology.
> > 
> > Actually, all my posts are from my experience.  My experience like 
> > Daniel's youtube is center in the heart and not in the brain.  It is a 
> > whole body experience.  And this experience coincide more and more with 
> > my Teacher's teaching as time passes.  
> > 
> > Don't mean to confuse you.  I also like to say, in my states, there is 
> > no mind and no heart, just chi, electricity and lights.  The key point 
> > IMO, is that state of kensho, satori, or even just Jhana can not sustained 
> > without chi, which is labeled as vital energy by Daniel.
> > 
> > Of course, my experience could also be labeled as maya by Bill.  :-) 
> > 
> > It is not important what I say or experience.  It is only important what 
> > you experience.  As you well know, Buddha said clearly in Diamond sutra 
> > that He said NO dharma.
> > 
> > Best,  JM
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/14/2011 4:10 PM, Anthony Wu wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > 
> > JM,
> >  
> > What is 'mind'? What is 'heart'? What is the difference between 'mind' and 
> > 'heart'?
> >  
> > Anthony
> > 
> > --- On Fri, 15/4/11, Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 
> > <chan.jmjm@> wrote:
> > 
> > 
> > From: Jue Miao Jing Ming - 覺妙精明 <chan.jmjm@>
> > Subject: Re: [Zen] The Three Dimensions of Release
> > To: [email protected]
> > Date: Friday, 15 April, 2011, 3:36 AM
> > 
> > 
> >   
> > 
> > Wow,  Thank you ED.  I have watched the first one.  
> > 
> > HuangDi Neijing said it very clearly for 2,000 years, "Our Shen, or inner 
> > divine, requires the support of Qi or Chi."
> > 
> > Personally, having a high tech BG, it took me 6 years to wake up to the 
> > fact that our Teaching is not about our mind.  It is about our entire 
> > being.  And at the center of it, is our heart.
> > 
> > That's my witness.  Now there is someone else too.  Thank you again, 
> > ED.  Lovely day today.
> > :-) 
> > JM
> > 
> > BTW, I was just informed that our version of Diamond Sutra is on youtube 
> > with English subtitle.  
> > http://www.youtube.com/joycedaolian#p/u/4/ROkmtB1fB8I
> > Be Enlightened In This Life - We ALL Can
> > http://chanjmjm.blogspot.com
> > http://www.heartchan.org
> > 
> > On 4/14/2011 10:25 AM, ED wrote: 
> >   
> > 
> >  
> > Mike,  two more tapes by Empty_Grace. I experience this guy as knowing 
> > what he is talking about. JM, he has good things to say about the 
> > Heart.   --ED   
> > The Three Dimensions of Release
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ejQsIFDrb4M&NR=1   Part 1
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z-4Vw54Dabw&feature=related  Part 2
> >
>




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