Edgar, I see you have since posted your thoughts on the subject. I don't agree with everything you said, especially singling out women, but do believe as you do that this has nothing specifically to do with zen or Zen Buddhism. I do however believe the teacher-student relationship, especially when the teacher is revered, can encourage this type of behavior.
I already stated my bottom line on this: zen masters/teachers are nobody special. Good ones can help you move your zen practice along, but bad ones cannot really derail you unless you allow them to. In the end its all up to you. ...Bill! --- In [email protected], "Bill!" <BillSmart@...> wrote: > > Edgar, > > I don't really care what others in the 'Zen community' have to say about this > situation. And, I have absolutely no idea why you associate me with zen > orthodoxy. Scandals and rumors of scandals like this in the 'Zen community' > are numerous. In fact this kind of thing is pretty common in every community > I know of - especially communities which are organized around a single > leader. This one doesn't surprise me at all. > > Does it surprise you? What are your thoughts about it? > > ...Bill! > > --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen <edgarowen@> wrote: > > > > But Bill, aren't you interested in what others in the Zen community, > > including a number at the highest levels, have to say about this situation? > > > > After all you and Joe especially are into the Zen orthodox tradition and > > these people are its representatives... > > > > Frankly I think you and Joe especially are just trying to dodge the issue > > because you guys have a strong attachment to zen orthodoxy you haven't been > > able to release or haven't realized the need to release and confronting > > this issue threatens that attachment... > > > > Edgar > > > > > > > > On Feb 19, 2013, at 3:07 AM, Bill! wrote: > > > > > Edgar, > > > > > > I just wanted to show you how I do read your posts thoroughly. I am > > > interested in what you have to say. I'm not that interested in what > > > others who are not participants on the Zen Forum have to say. Perhaps > > > that's so because I can't interact with them - ask for clarification or > > > more information. > > > > > > ...Bill! > > > > > > --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen wrote: > > > > > > > > Bill, > > > > > > > > Yes, you got all those points correct! > > > > > > > > Congratulations! > > > > > > > > Edgar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 17, 2013, at 8:29 PM, Bill! wrote: > > > > > > > > > Edgar, > > > > > > > > > > The article is the article. So what? I want to know YOUR opinion on > > > > > the contents of the article, not just read the article. In your > > > > > retort below you did reveal a lot: > > > > > > > > > > You believe: > > > > > > > > > > - some newspapers are 'respected' and some are not > > > > > - some newspapers are 'major' and some are not > > > > > - the content of articles printed in newspapers that you consider > > > > > both 'respected' and 'major' are more legitimate than someone's > > > > > opinion > > > > > - some on this forum don't want to hear anything bad about zen > > > > > - zen has something to do with censorship and truth > > > > > > > > > > Thanks for sharing...Bill! > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], Edgar Owen wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > It's news by a respected major newspaper about a major Zen figure, > > > > > > NOT someone's opinions. > > > > > > > > > > > > But of course we wouldn't want anything not Zen politically correct > > > > > > on the group now would we? > > > > > > > > > > > > Censorship or truth? Which is true Zen? > > > > > > > > > > > > Edgar > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Feb 17, 2013, at 8:04 PM, Bill! wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > I second that wholeheartedly! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I participate in this forum to hear YOUR views, not just be > > > > > > > directed to SOMEONE ELSE's views (who are not even members of > > > > > > > this forum) unless that are cited to support something you have > > > > > > > said. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ...Bill! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "Joe" wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > (never yet looked at a link without commentary by the poster) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --Joe > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Edgar Owen wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > http://www.nytimes.com/2013/02/12/world/asia/zen-buddhists-roiled-by-accusations-against-teacher.html?hp > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
