Totally agree Bill, Zen is not a religion, and I find it slightly odd that it is Buddhism that drove many Zen greats including Hui Neng (diamond sutra). At the end, we meet the end, it doesn't matter if you are alive or dead, both are wonderful and the earth continues to hum along either with you on it, or buried in it.
Zen needed to be discovered to offer a logical, sceptical world another vehicle that suits those who are drawn to a spiritual non religion. Seems to me to be more fundamental and honest than most religions. Having said this I am fully in favour of religions, as I think they offer most people more than the nihilism that abounds today. Bob --- In [email protected], "Bill!" <BillSmart@...> wrote: > > Joe, > > I think your post below is a good introduction to the religion of Zen > Buddhism, but I do want to note that IMO zen is not a religion nor dependent > upon or co-dependent with the religion of Buddhism. > > Also, I'd massage your first paragraph to read, 'I think all the religions > developed in a space and time that was appropriate to convey their founder's > experience.' I offer this because the way you wrote it sounds like the > religion proceeded the founder's experience rather than the other way around. > > ...Bill! > > --- In [email protected], "Joe" <desert_woodworker@> wrote: > > > > Welcome. > > > > I think all the religions developed in a place and time that was right for > > their founders to have some sort of experience. After that experience, and > > after the death of the founders, doctrine and dogma develop naturally, and > > they accumulate. > > > > A few religions -- maybe most -- have "wings", or branches, that are > > devoted to practice(s) in order to enable followers to have the same > > experience as the founder. One of these is the Zen tradition of Buddhism. > > > > There are different streams of Zen practice and tradition. > > > > And there are practices of other religions which look a bit like Zen > > practice, and involve meditation or contemplation. > > > > For example, there is Christian Contemplative practice; and, there is the > > Sufi school of Islam, which is the mystical, direct-experience, branch of > > Islam. > > > > The mystical branches are those that are not so much bound by "the Book", > > as they are kept alive by actual, community, practice, usually involving > > direct experience of a fundamental nature, or Nature. > > > > Thus, I feel it would not be a good idea to mix all the religions of the > > Earth; but, if you feel drawn to direct- and awakened-experience yourself, > > it would be good to choose one tradition and find a teacher who can start > > you out on that sort of practice. I did this in Sufism, and then afterward > > did this in Zen Buddhism, and have stayed with Zen for the past 34 years or > > so. So far, so good. It seems like a good match, and seems to have a > > minimum of baggage or trappings, either ancient or modern. It seems > > basically Human, to me. > > > > That's what I was looking for: not something that would "train" me in a > > certain way, to conform with a book; but something that would open up > > something original in a human being, or restore something that was just > > covered up by education and societal training and conformance. This can > > definitely be found in Zen practice. > > > > If Zen practice interests you, it's important to know that you can get a > > good introduction to it by a teacher. There may be Zen groups near you who > > have teachers. They may have "Newcomer Nights", or something like that, > > which would be a good time to show up. Maybe check out some local "Zendo" > > or Zen group on the web, and see their schedule. Or just show up when they > > are open and see what's going on. > > > > Good luck! > > > > People here at this Zen Forum group may have other suggestions. And of > > course there's lots available to read. But Zen practice involves the whole > > person, and is a collaboration of body and mind. There's nothing better > > than getting the body involved earlier, as early as possible, and it's > > never too soon. There's almost nothing in books but encouragement. > > Encouragement to begin practice. Maybe you'll make a start. > > > > Best, > > > > --Joe > > > > "kaydam60" <kaydam1@> wrote: > > > > > > Hello all I know nothing about Zen. I enjoy the music and recently read > > > a book about Edgar Casey and reincarnation. Found it very interesting > > > and made some sense. I read a little about Zen and some of it sounds > > > like what I read on Edgar Casey. Very interested. Was raised in a > > > Christian household but have always had trouble buying into it. I think > > > it covers some of what is next but with too much ceremony, like the > > > Catholic faith. I liked the Secret but feel it's lacking something also. > > > I truly think that if you could combine all the religions, you would > > > have the answers. Thanks for reading and you will have to help me > > > through this group thing. I'm a group virgin. > > > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! ID required) <*> To change settings via email: [email protected] [email protected] <*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to: [email protected] <*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to: http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
