Thanks for all the responses. I must find someplace in my area that practices Zen. I read over these posts but have on idea how to get started. I just know that the traditional things make no sense. I not saying I have the answers but I'm willing to look at new things with an open mind. Any direction you can provide would be greatly appreciated.
--- In [email protected], "Bill!" <BillSmart@...> wrote: > > William, > > I agree with your post below. Zen is all about experience and not about > reading or teachings. If you're really lucky the readings or teachings can > lead you to an experience, but without the experience it's all just talk, > talk, talk. > > ...Bill! > > --- In [email protected], William Rintala <brintala@> wrote: > > > > I was drawn to Zen through the writings of Alan Watts and Eckhart Tolle. > > There > > was a simplicity devoid of the trapping of having to believe something or > > having > > to accept information that I know to have been adulterated through millenia > > of > > translations and editing. To practice, imo, one simply needs to open your > > eyes > > and be aware. Your experience is unique, your situation is your situation. > > Start > > from there. As many here will say all of the reading and teaching and > > memorizing > > that you might do simply are fingers pointing.  > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________ > > From: bobthomas564 <bobthomas564@> > > To: [email protected] > > Sent: Fri, April 26, 2013 11:18:03 PM > > Subject: [Zen] Re: New > > > >  > > Totally agree Bill, Zen is not a religion, and I find it slightly odd that > > it is > > Buddhism that drove many Zen greats including Hui Neng (diamond sutra). At > > the > > end, we meet the end, it doesn't matter if you are alive or dead, both are > > wonderful and the earth continues to hum along either with you on it, or > > buried > > in it. > > > > Zen needed to be discovered to offer a logical, sceptical world another > > vehicle > > that suits those who are drawn to a spiritual non religion. Seems to me to > > be > > more fundamental and honest than most religions. > > > > Having said this I am fully in favour of religions, as I think they offer > > most > > people more than the nihilism that abounds today. > > > > > > Bob > > > > --- In [email protected], "Bill!" <BillSmart@> wrote: > > > > > > Joe, > > > > > > I think your post below is a good introduction to the religion of Zen > > > Buddhism, > > >but I do want to note that IMO zen is not a religion nor dependent upon or > > >co-dependent with the religion of Buddhism. > > > > > > Also, I'd massage your first paragraph to read, 'I think all the > > > religions > > >developed in a space and time that was appropriate to convey their > > >founder's > > >experience.' I offer this because the way you wrote it sounds like the > > >religion > > >proceeded the founder's experience rather than the other way around. > > > > > > ...Bill! > > > > > > --- In [email protected], "Joe" <desert_woodworker@> wrote: > > > > > > > > Welcome. > > > > > > > > I think all the religions developed in a place and time that was right > > > > for > > >their founders to have some sort of experience. After that experience, and > > >after > > >the death of the founders, doctrine and dogma develop naturally, and they > > >accumulate. > > > > > > > > A few religions -- maybe most -- have "wings", or branches, that are > > > > devoted > > >to practice(s) in order to enable followers to have the same experience as > > >the > > >founder. One of these is the Zen tradition of Buddhism. > > > > > > > > > > > There are different streams of Zen practice and tradition. > > > > > > > > And there are practices of other religions which look a bit like Zen > > >practice, and involve meditation or contemplation. > > > > > > > > For example, there is Christian Contemplative practice; and, there is > > > > the > > >Sufi school of Islam, which is the mystical, direct-experience, branch of > > >Islam. > > > > > > > > The mystical branches are those that are not so much bound by "the > > > > Book", as > > >they are kept alive by actual, community, practice, usually involving > > >direct > > >experience of a fundamental nature, or Nature. > > > > > > > > Thus, I feel it would not be a good idea to mix all the religions of > > > > the > > >Earth; but, if you feel drawn to direct- and awakened-experience yourself, > > >it > > >would be good to choose one tradition and find a teacher who can start you > > >out > > >on that sort of practice. I did this in Sufism, and then afterward did > > >this in > > >Zen Buddhism, and have stayed with Zen for the past 34 years or so. So > > >far, so > > >good. It seems like a good match, and seems to have a minimum of baggage > > >or > > >trappings, either ancient or modern. It seems basically Human, to me. > > > > > > > > That's what I was looking for: not something that would "train" me in a > > >certain way, to conform with a book; but something that would open up > > >something > > >original in a human being, or restore something that was just covered up > > >by > > >education and societal training and conformance. This can definitely be > > >found in > > >Zen practice. > > > > > > > > If Zen practice interests you, it's important to know that you can get > > > > a good > > >introduction to it by a teacher. There may be Zen groups near you who have > > >teachers. They may have "Newcomer Nights", or something like that, which > > >would > > >be a good time to show up. Maybe check out some local "Zendo" or Zen group > > >on > > >the web, and see their schedule. Or just show up when they are open and > > >see > > >what's going on. > > > > > > > > Good luck! > > > > > > > > People here at this Zen Forum group may have other suggestions. And of > > > > course > > >there's lots available to read. But Zen practice involves the whole > > >person, and > > >is a collaboration of body and mind. There's nothing better than getting > > >the > > >body involved earlier, as early as possible, and it's never too soon. > > >There's > > >almost nothing in books but encouragement. Encouragement to begin > > >practice. > > >Maybe you'll make a start. > > > > > > > > Best, > > > > > > > > --Joe > > > > > > > > "kaydam60" <kaydam1@> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hello all I know nothing about Zen. I enjoy the music and recently > > > > > read a > > >book about Edgar Casey and reincarnation. Found it very interesting and > > >made > > >some sense. I read a little about Zen and some of it sounds like what I > > >read on > > >Edgar Casey. Very interested. Was raised in a Christian household but have > > >always had trouble buying into it. I think it covers some of what is next > > >but > > >with too much ceremony, like the Catholic faith. I liked the Secret but > > >feel > > >it's lacking something also. I truly think that if you could combine all > > >the > > >religions, you would have the answers. Thanks for reading and you will > > >have to > > >help me through this group thing. I'm a group virgin. > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------------ Current Book Discussion: any Zen book that you recently have read or are reading! Talk about it today!Yahoo! Groups Links <*> To visit your group on the web, go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/ <*> Your email settings: Individual Email | Traditional <*> To change settings online go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Zen_Forum/join (Yahoo! 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