I am trying to summarize some of what happened over last few years from my
perspective. I am just a zope 3 user and not involved with core development.
So my knowledge is limited. Zope 3.3 was good. It was a big monolithic
package containing most of what was necessary to develop component based web
applications. It was rock solid and Phillipp wrote a great book describing
the framework in depth.  Then came egg based development. All the individual
packages inside the zope system were separated into individual eggs and
developers started maintaining them separately. The idea was that one should
not need to load all the packages one doesn't need. Its a component based
architecture, hence one should pick and choose the components which one
needs in his application. All the eggs had separate versioning. Along came
KGS (Known Good Set). KGS is an index of versions of individual zope
packages which are known to work together very well. Build-out introduced
another layer. When you prepare your application buildout you just specify
the packages you need for your application and the versions of those
packages. Zope 3 was already hard to get started (it required a lot of
learning in terms of component architecture and a new configuration language
called ZCML). So some thought that there should be a much easier way to get
started with the system. That was GROK. GROK is built on top of Zope 3 and
provides a much easier getting started path for people who want to
experience the advantages of Zope 3 system. GROK doesn't require you to use
ZCML. Alll configuration can be done in Python code itself. GROK doesn't
require you to learn component architecture in depth before getting started.
At this point of time, GROK is the best way to get started with the latest
and greatest of Zope 3. Though I think its still has some glitches on the
Windows OS.

With regards,
- Shailesh

At this point of time, grok is the best

On Tue, Jun 16, 2009 at 12:43 PM, Jens <ad...@fh-schmalkalden.de> wrote:

> I'm a newbie to zope3 too.
> Last November, I started my small app using the excellent framework
> "Grok", and I'm happy. I do ldap-auth, i18n, sessions and database
> connections.
> So don't be stuck, use Grok: grok.zope.org
> Best regards
> Jens
> Edward Zwart schrieb:
> > I've been limping along for a couple weeks trying to learn this
> > framework, and I'm completely stuck, and can barely even form a good
> > question... so apologies in advance...
> >
> > My problem is I'm brand new to Zope, and it's impossible to tell when
> > I'm reading something current or not.  I've been following the z3c
> > (3.4 specific?) tutorial and also von Weitershausen's book.  But I
> > think sometimes those two approaches are mutually exclusive.  I don't
> > even know if that's true or not.  If someone could confirm that, that
> > alone would be great.
> >
> > Someone on this list recently pointed out to me that Zope 3.4
> > directory stucture (using zopeproject) versus the 3.3 one (using
> > mkzopeinstance) was the issue I was encountering...  but I really
> > don't know how far that issue goes when I'm reading other literature.
> >
> > Then today, I downloaded the just-announced z3c.form 2.0.0 demo to see
> > if I could gain some insight into the various problems I've created
> > for myself in the last few weeks, and I see again a completely
> > different directory structure!
> >
> > So, there's mkzopeinstance, zopeproject, and the demo uses
> bootstrap.py...
> >
> > using mkzopeinstance, there's your root instance folder with an etc
> > directory (with some of the config files in it)...
> >
> > using zopeproject, you get site.zcml and zope.conf and others in the
> > root folder, no etc directory...
> >
> > and then there's the demo using bootstrap.py....with config files
> > under the parts directory (as well as the db, no more var)....
> >
> > Ok, so how do I learn from this?  It is extremely difficult to
> > penetrate!  Is there a process for reducing this barrier to newcomers?
> >  What can I do to help?!  I'm sold on many aspects of Zope, and I
> > would really like to be able to employ them!
> >
> > Please pardon the rant, but I've held off a long time, and I'm really
> > at a loss...
> >
> > In the meantime, here's a specific problem...
> >
> > I am trying to make a custom template to render my form...
> >
> > Basically, I followed the Carduner z3c tutorial, and am trying to do
> > this in my template...
> >
> > <div tal:content="view/render">the form goes here?</div>
> >
> > That gives an infinite recursion error.  Am I supposed to implement
> > render()?  I would think it would just display the form as it does if
> > I do not define a custom template.
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> > e.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Zope3-users mailing list
> > Zope3-users@zope.org
> > http://mail.zope.org/mailman/listinfo/zope3-users
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