There are 10 messages in this issue.
Topics in this digest:
1a. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Don
1b. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Nicole Valicia Thompson-Andrews
1c. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Anaïs Ahmed
1d. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Padraic Brown
1e. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Tony Harris
1f. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Emanuelo Arbaro
1g. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Christophe Grandsire-Koevoets
1h. Re: Conlang Profanity
From: Allison Swenson
2a. Re: Expressing irony/sarcasm morphologically (was: Re: Fwd: "Even if
From: George Corley
3a. Yingdilah
From: Martin Hasani
Messages
________________________________________________________________________
1a. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Don" librarian....@gmail.com
Date: Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:29 pm ((PDT))
Thanks for the info.
The "multi-purpose swear word" concept is not unheard of in conlangs. Klingon
seems to have some of these all-purpose untranslatable words:
http://www.khemorex-klinzhai.de/Hol/mix/curses.html
Don
On Jul 28, 2013, at 7:04 PM, Nina-Kristine Johnson <ninakristi...@gmail.com>
wrote:
> Hiya!
>
> 'Ay pæško!' is 'Oh..[enter expletive, here]!'
>
> P*æško* means either S***, F***, H***. Its a multi-purpose swear word.
>
> The *-a* is a short *a* sound. (Pa-sh-koh)
>
> I also have (might be unlisted in my glossary, though): *Ka*š*itų* (*
> Kah-shee-too* or Ba****) and *Beina* (*Bay-ee-nah* or B***h).
>
> Tisala-e! (Cheers!),
> Kristine
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 28 July 2013 13:56, Don Boozer <librarian....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm writing a review of Holy Sh*t: A Brief History of Swearing by Melissa
>> Mohr (published by Oxford Univ Press, 2013) for Fiat Lingua (
>> http://fiatlingua.org). However, as part of that review I'm planning on
>> looking at it's implications and uses for constructing languages, worlds,
>> and cultures. And, as part of that, swearing in existing conlangs (both
>> well known (e.g., Esperanto, Dothraki) and personal ones).
>>
>> With that, if anyone would like to share any profanity, vulgarisms, "vain
>> oaths", etc., that they have included in their conlangs or con-cultures, I
>> would be happy to hear about them. If anyone is familiar with Esperanto
>> swearing, that would be interesting as well. I've dug around on the web and
>> on the Conlang-L archives, but it doesn't appear there is an overabundance
>> of people willing to talk about this area of conlanging (or at least hasn't
>> been for a few years).
>>
>> The article is due on Fiat Lingua for Sept. 1.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Don Boozer
>>
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
1b. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Nicole Valicia Thompson-Andrews" goldyemo...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Jul 28, 2013 4:31 pm ((PDT))
Thanks.
Mellissa Green
@GreenNovelist
-----Original Message-----
From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:conl...@listserv.brown.edu] On
Behalf Of Don
Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 7:30 PM
To: conl...@listserv.brown.edu
Subject: Re: Conlang Profanity
Checked Wikipedia. There's a nice article on profanity in scifi.
Just looking for how conlangers and conworlders have handled the issue of
profanity and swearing. Just calques of English (i.e., "conlang word" =
f*ck, etc.) or conculturally-relevant profanity.
Don
On Jul 28, 2013, at 6:44 PM, Nicole Valicia Thompson-Andrews
<goldyemo...@gmail.com> wrote:
> I need to come up with a list, especially since Yemora is an uncensored
> world.
>
> I've sent through the book title in hopes that it can be digitally
recorded.
>
> I'll also check Wikipedia.
>
> I've come up with Oh, dragon dung.
>
> What are you looking for?
>
>
> Mellissa Green
>
>
> @GreenNovelist
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Constructed Languages List [mailto:conl...@listserv.brown.edu] On
> Behalf Of Don Boozer
> Sent: Sunday, July 28, 2013 4:56 PM
> To: conl...@listserv.brown.edu
> Subject: Conlang Profanity
>
> I'm writing a review of Holy Sh*t: A Brief History of Swearing by Melissa
> Mohr (published by Oxford Univ Press, 2013) for Fiat Lingua (
> http://fiatlingua.org). However, as part of that review I'm planning on
> looking at it's implications and uses for constructing languages, worlds,
> and cultures. And, as part of that, swearing in existing conlangs (both
> well known (e.g., Esperanto, Dothraki) and personal ones).
>
> With that, if anyone would like to share any profanity, vulgarisms, "vain
> oaths", etc., that they have included in their conlangs or con-cultures, I
> would be happy to hear about them. If anyone is familiar with Esperanto
> swearing, that would be interesting as well. I've dug around on the web
and
> on the Conlang-L archives, but it doesn't appear there is an overabundance
> of people willing to talk about this area of conlanging (or at least
hasn't
> been for a few years).
>
> The article is due on Fiat Lingua for Sept. 1.
>
> Thanks,
> Don Boozer
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
1c. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Anaïs Ahmed" aeetlrcre...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Jul 28, 2013 6:25 pm ((PDT))
Reminds me of the Finnish "paska".
-Anaïs
Nina-Kristine Johnson <ninakristi...@gmail.com> kirjoitti 28.7.2013 kello 18.04:
> Hiya!
>
> 'Ay pæško!' is 'Oh..[enter expletive, here]!'
>
> P*æško* means either S***, F***, H***. Its a multi-purpose swear word.
>
> The *-a* is a short *a* sound. (Pa-sh-koh)
>
> I also have (might be unlisted in my glossary, though): *Ka*š*itų* (*
> Kah-shee-too* or Ba****) and *Beina* (*Bay-ee-nah* or B***h).
>
> Tisala-e! (Cheers!),
> Kristine
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 28 July 2013 13:56, Don Boozer <librarian....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I'm writing a review of Holy Sh*t: A Brief History of Swearing by Melissa
>> Mohr (published by Oxford Univ Press, 2013) for Fiat Lingua (
>> http://fiatlingua.org). However, as part of that review I'm planning on
>> looking at it's implications and uses for constructing languages, worlds,
>> and cultures. And, as part of that, swearing in existing conlangs (both
>> well known (e.g., Esperanto, Dothraki) and personal ones).
>>
>> With that, if anyone would like to share any profanity, vulgarisms, "vain
>> oaths", etc., that they have included in their conlangs or con-cultures, I
>> would be happy to hear about them. If anyone is familiar with Esperanto
>> swearing, that would be interesting as well. I've dug around on the web and
>> on the Conlang-L archives, but it doesn't appear there is an overabundance
>> of people willing to talk about this area of conlanging (or at least hasn't
>> been for a few years).
>>
>> The article is due on Fiat Lingua for Sept. 1.
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Don Boozer
>>
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
1d. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Padraic Brown" elemti...@yahoo.com
Date: Sun Jul 28, 2013 7:40 pm ((PDT))
> From: Don Boozer <librarian....@gmail.com>
>
> With that, if anyone would like to share any profanity, vulgarisms, "vain
> oaths", etc., that they have included in their conlangs or con-cultures, I
> would be happy to hear about them.
I haven't done a whole lot with this kind of language. Although I can't find
the terms in my lexicon, apparently "qennavaz" (knave) and "kerelez" (churl)
are, according to the Big Black Wolf, "terms of some insult". I am quite certain
that scithen / scithez is not the black-list word that shit is in English. It's
just
the ordinary word for poo in Avantimannish.
Not a vulgarism by any stretch, but it is considered slightly insulting to call
one
of the blaowmen "suuart" (swarthy, black), or blaqe (dark black). Their skins
are
a bluish-black (i.e., blaowe). For what it's worth, it's also slightly insulting
to call one of the blaqmen "blancke" (pure white, very pale). That word
is reserved for the local Daine, who are quite pale. And yeah, that wasn't
a typo: blaqe means both "black" and "white".
Among the Werepigs, one of their more dire insults is "gheghe-HEAD.LIFT
burghe, huyhuy!?" = so, who castrated you?
There is, somewhere in the dim and distant lands over the Ocean, a people
who once insulted a Rumelian explorer that had, in typical Rumelian fashion,
when confronted by a recalcitrant Native, started asking his questions like "I
say dear chappy, wot's that bit of highland over yonder called, what?" ever
LOUDER AND SLOWER, as if by some strange dwimmery said recalcitrant
Native will now perfectly understand, by replying "hmungdo nd amdo", which
means "what do you think it is, you stinky foreign git?"
> Don Boozer
Padraic
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
1e. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Tony Harris" t...@alurhsa.org
Date: Sun Jul 28, 2013 11:50 pm ((PDT))
I believe there is actually a book, available in eBook form and possibly
free online, about "tabuaj vortoj" in Esperanto, which would include all
about how to curse. I'm away from home at the moment, but if you can't
find it easily I can see what I can dig up.
I'd have to make a list of Alurhsa profanity, but the ones that come to
mind off the top of my head are:
keçlá - f'ing, an adjective used to indicate extreme disgust and anger
with something. Probably related to keçë (bastard, a child born out of
wedlock).
rïshád - bullsh*t, litterally "master of nonsense"
You can also throw the suffix -ágh (which draws the stress to itself) on
the end which is an extremely insulting depeciative. So "rïshádágh"
works out to "f'ing BS". -ágh is usable on almost any word if you want
to make your displeasure/disgust known.
Then there is actually an insulting, or depreciative 2nd person pronoun
and person form of the verb, so you can for example say something like
"äçán!" (from the verb äçâ, to depart, leave, go away, get out) which
would have the effect of something like "get the f' out of here!".
On 07/28/2013 09:56 PM, Don Boozer wrote:
> I'm writing a review of Holy Sh*t: A Brief History of Swearing by Melissa
> Mohr (published by Oxford Univ Press, 2013) for Fiat Lingua (
> http://fiatlingua.org). However, as part of that review I'm planning on
> looking at it's implications and uses for constructing languages, worlds,
> and cultures. And, as part of that, swearing in existing conlangs (both
> well known (e.g., Esperanto, Dothraki) and personal ones).
>
> With that, if anyone would like to share any profanity, vulgarisms, "vain
> oaths", etc., that they have included in their conlangs or con-cultures, I
> would be happy to hear about them. If anyone is familiar with Esperanto
> swearing, that would be interesting as well. I've dug around on the web and
> on the Conlang-L archives, but it doesn't appear there is an overabundance
> of people willing to talk about this area of conlanging (or at least hasn't
> been for a few years).
>
> The article is due on Fiat Lingua for Sept. 1.
>
> Thanks,
> Don Boozer
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
1f. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Emanuelo Arbaro" emanuelo.arb...@gmail.com
Date: Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:56 am ((PDT))
Le 28/07/2013 22:56, Don Boozer a �crit :
> If anyone is familiar with Esperanto
> swearing, that would be interesting as well.
Le 29/07/2013 08:50, Tony Harris a �crit :
> I believe there is actually a book, available in eBook form and
> possibly free online, about "tabuaj vortoj" in Esperanto, which would
> include all about how to curse. I'm away from home at the moment, but
> if you can't find it easily I can see what I can dig up.
Yes, I have it :
http://emmanuel-wald.pagesperso-orange.fr/interlinguistique/Tabuaj_vortoj_en_Esperanto.doc
. I don�t know if you can read Esperanto; if you can�t, I can make a
summary for you.
Emanuelo.
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
1g. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Christophe Grandsire-Koevoets" tsela...@gmail.com
Date: Mon Jul 29, 2013 2:14 am ((PDT))
On 28 July 2013 22:56, Don Boozer <librarian....@gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm writing a review of Holy Sh*t: A Brief History of Swearing by Melissa
> Mohr (published by Oxford Univ Press, 2013) for Fiat Lingua (
> http://fiatlingua.org). However, as part of that review I'm planning on
> looking at it's implications and uses for constructing languages, worlds,
> and cultures. And, as part of that, swearing in existing conlangs (both
> well known (e.g., Esperanto, Dothraki) and personal ones).
>
> With that, if anyone would like to share any profanity, vulgarisms, "vain
> oaths", etc., that they have included in their conlangs or con-cultures, I
> would be happy to hear about them. If anyone is familiar with Esperanto
> swearing, that would be interesting as well. I've dug around on the web and
> on the Conlang-L archives, but it doesn't appear there is an overabundance
> of people willing to talk about this area of conlanging (or at least hasn't
> been for a few years).
>
>
This Wikipedia article about Esperanto profanity is actually quite good:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esperanto_profanity
In Moten, I haven't built much profanity yet (it's a difficult area to
develop and I'm not even sure what is considered profanity in Moten). I do
have a few words though:
- _dloamas_ and _dloazes_, both based on _dloa_: "pear", with the masculine
and feminine diminutive suffixes _-mas_ and _-zes_. They both basically
mean "fatso" (i.e. pear-shaped), respectively for men and women;
- _kamas_, from _ka|se_: "man" and the masculine diminutive suffix _-mas_
again, is a disparaging term of address towards men. The feminine
equivalent is _ezes_ (from _e|lon_: "woman" and _-zes_).
I don't have anything else yet, and have no idea what expletives even look
like in Moten. I do know, however, that the diminutives are commonly used
to indicate distaste or contempt (basically a sarcastic use of their
meaning of endearment).
--
Christophe Grandsire-Koevoets.
http://christophoronomicon.blogspot.com/
http://www.christophoronomicon.nl/
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
1h. Re: Conlang Profanity
Posted by: "Allison Swenson" jlon...@gmail.com
Date: Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:30 am ((PDT))
This is something I keep meaning to devote a day or two to in Tirina, but
haven't yet. So I've really only got a couple that I know of... one proper
profanity and one that's just horribly insulting.
tensad - I'm not solid on the exact meaning, but in context it's used as a
pretty direct equivalent of f***ing (as an adjective). The literal meaning
is most likely something similar as well. Pretty standard. :)
satoda - lit. "liar". In this culture, being "truthful" is extremely
important. (for certain values of "truthfulness", anyway) You can deceive,
you can mislead, you can misdirect, but you *never* speak a direct lie.
That's just... not done. So to accuse someone of being a liar, of telling a
deliberate and intentional untruth, that's a deathly insult.
sator - lie or falsehood--"satoda" is derived from this. Accusing someone's
speech of having satormir in is slightly less horrific than outright
calling them a liar, but not really much better. Even using a term like
"ton sader" (lit. "not true") is pretty harsh. What you actually do is say
that a statement is a "ton idcas"--"not a certainty". It's allowing for an
amount of hedging, basically saying "Of course I'm sure that any falsehood
in what you said was clearly a complete accident and you would never think
of telling untruths, but there is a slight possibility that something in
what you said might not directly align with reality..."
Which is in itself a somewhat untrue statement, as obviously you think
they're a lying liar who lies, but so goes it.
On Mon, Jul 29, 2013 at 5:13 AM, Christophe Grandsire-Koevoets <
tsela...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On 28 July 2013 22:56, Don Boozer <librarian....@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > I'm writing a review of Holy Sh*t: A Brief History of Swearing by Melissa
> > Mohr (published by Oxford Univ Press, 2013) for Fiat Lingua (
> > http://fiatlingua.org). However, as part of that review I'm planning on
> > looking at it's implications and uses for constructing languages, worlds,
> > and cultures. And, as part of that, swearing in existing conlangs (both
> > well known (e.g., Esperanto, Dothraki) and personal ones).
> >
> > With that, if anyone would like to share any profanity, vulgarisms, "vain
> > oaths", etc., that they have included in their conlangs or con-cultures,
> I
> > would be happy to hear about them. If anyone is familiar with Esperanto
> > swearing, that would be interesting as well. I've dug around on the web
> and
> > on the Conlang-L archives, but it doesn't appear there is an
> overabundance
> > of people willing to talk about this area of conlanging (or at least
> hasn't
> > been for a few years).
> >
> >
> This Wikipedia article about Esperanto profanity is actually quite good:
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esperanto_profanity
>
> In Moten, I haven't built much profanity yet (it's a difficult area to
> develop and I'm not even sure what is considered profanity in Moten). I do
> have a few words though:
> - _dloamas_ and _dloazes_, both based on _dloa_: "pear", with the masculine
> and feminine diminutive suffixes _-mas_ and _-zes_. They both basically
> mean "fatso" (i.e. pear-shaped), respectively for men and women;
> - _kamas_, from _ka|se_: "man" and the masculine diminutive suffix _-mas_
> again, is a disparaging term of address towards men. The feminine
> equivalent is _ezes_ (from _e|lon_: "woman" and _-zes_).
>
> I don't have anything else yet, and have no idea what expletives even look
> like in Moten. I do know, however, that the diminutives are commonly used
> to indicate distaste or contempt (basically a sarcastic use of their
> meaning of endearment).
> --
> Christophe Grandsire-Koevoets.
>
> http://christophoronomicon.blogspot.com/
> http://www.christophoronomicon.nl/
>
Messages in this topic (13)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
2a. Re: Expressing irony/sarcasm morphologically (was: Re: Fwd: "Even if
Posted by: "George Corley" gacor...@gmail.com
Date: Sun Jul 28, 2013 5:50 pm ((PDT))
On Sun, Jul 28, 2013 at 5:50 PM, H. S. Teoh <hst...@quickfur.ath.cx> wrote:
>
> In speech, there's room for more subtlety because you can insert a
> subtle twinkle in the eye or gesture that only those in the know will
> pick up -- something rather hard to achieve in a written medium for
> irony. (For non-irony one could, of course, employ jargon, but that's
> another topic.)
>
Kinda brings up something -- humans can't alter the reflectivity of our
eyes, so "twinkle in the eye" is obviously just a figure of speech. I
wonder if what we refer to there is some subtle facial expression that we
don't consciously register, or if it refers to anything physically real at
all. What are equivalent expressions in other languages? What do we know
about human facial expressions.
Messages in this topic (8)
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
3a. Yingdilah
Posted by: "Martin Hasani" an20...@gold.ac.uk
Date: Sun Jul 28, 2013 6:46 pm ((PDT))
I would like to go shopping for fruit - Amah jah istia pul-pul leh mengumperah
What are you doing, brother? - Pasap, apa meh kera?
I am making an offering - Amah banten baya
Messages in this topic (6)
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