-Caveat Lector-
On Mon, 2 Jul 2001 14:45:07 EDT, Tito Hammond <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
posted article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, which said:
> -Caveat Lector-
>
> In a message dated 7/1/01 1:01:39 AM Mountain Daylight Time,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
>
> << I believe it, but what would happen if we moved to abolish the government?
> Martial law. Tienneman Square. The Holocaust.>>
>
> We don't need to abolish government, just hold it to the Constitution,
> especially the tenth amendment.
Oh? And how do you suppose we do that? Apparently whatever we're doing is
not working. Rights are still eroding all the time. There are victories,
like the recent ruling saying that cops can't fly over your house to peek
inside your home with high tech gear to see if you've got lots of grow
lights on in your house. I don't need to remind you of the boiling frog
analogy. The point is, we're all aware of what's happening, but the average
Joe Blow is not. Joe Blow is going to recline in his lazy boy with a beer
in one hand and his sausage in the other until one day he wakes up and
realizes that it's too late. Then there will be an overthrow of the
government.
> << > Thankyou for posting this Prudy. It's obvious that most Americans no
> > longer believe in, or are even familiar with, these principles. The
> > public schools (government indoctrination centers) and the mass media
> > have done a thorough job of erasing these beliefs from the public mind.
> > There is a story about old Ben Franklin emerging from the Constitutional
> > Convention after the signing. A woman called out to him: "What form of
> > government have you given us?" He answered: "A Republic....if you can
> > keep it." We haven't. It's gone.
>
> Question is...what comes next? What is the segue going to be? I wonder if
> we're heading to a time of a major abolishment of the few remaining freedoms
> we have. I'm thinking we are.>>
>
> I'm thinking the very same thing.
>
> << It's one of those rock bottom things, kind
> of like alcoholics having to hit "rock bottom" before they can see the light
> and turn things around. Probably society will have to hit rock bottom
> before the cat is cornered and it starts hissing and fighting. It's just a
> matter of compromises. There is a power in place that wants more and more
> control, so lawyers battle it out in court and a compromise takes place.
> Later there is another compromise as someone, somewhere wants more control,
> so we compromise again, each time giving up a little more freedom.>>
>
> Somehow, we need to turn that compromising around and head it in the opposite
> direction. How you do that I don't know. I tend to doubt that it can be
> turned. Perhaps the only way to regain our Republic is to do it the way the
> founding fathers did it ... maybe that's why this government is hell bent on
> abolishing weapons for common people.
Abolishing all the current people in office might do the trick. Send in
some people to take over. Of course, conspiring to do this is illegal...
but that's not going to stop it, of course. But it's governments like the
one currently in place that seems to eventually result in beheadings.
> << The sad part is that there is little I can do about it by myself. There is
> little we can do, even collectively, as members of this mailing list because
> we're really not mainstreamers. Mainstreamers are so strapped for cash that
> mom and dad have to work, the kids are in daycare and everyone is so
> exhausted by the time they come home that all they can manage to do is plop
> down in front of the TV to absorb a few hours of propaganda before falling
> asleep and repeating the same thing until the weekend when some of the
> people get drunk, some of the people have sex and the rest just lay around
> and recuperate from the hell of the weekdays.>>
>
> I'm one of those mainstreamers you are talking about. I joined this list
> because a friend of mine signed off after being here four years. He posted
> many interesting articles from this list at work and got a couple dozen of us
> interested in "politics."
> He didn't have any answers, nor did he find any one complete answer on this
> list, but he did get many people (at work) interested. After being here a
> couple of weeks now, I can see why he got so frustrated. Obviously all the
> thirty or so people on this list care about what is happening in this country
> and to the world, but even these thirty people can't seem to be unified in
> their thinking, so how do you get tens of millions of people to unify against
> the government/powerful corporations?
I don't know why nobody can agree on a single approach. I think that's one
of the things the powers in place know. Each person is unique, yes... but
at the root of the issue is the need for change. I think eventually, once
the work becomes more and more thinking oriented rather than labor oriented,
people might become more willing to sacrifice their knowledge and
understanding rather than demanding payment for it. I know I wouldn't want
to go out and sweat my butt off for 12 hours a day to build a highway
without pay, but it wouldn't bother me so much to share 12 hours of my brain
power for free, just as another person shares his love of music with me,
another shares his vision of house plans he loves, and another shares a
tomato from his garden he loves. Could be a new paradigm working here. We
could set up a system to jump-start the economies of other worlds. We offer
to migrate people from third-world countries to work for money. They become
the manual labor force to build buildings, transportation conduits and other
things, and they would be paid well for it. They'd also get to use what
they've built and they would have access to educational resources to catch
up on world history. The thinkers in the world would benefit from the labor
of the labor force who are busy educating themselves. This idea can spread
around the globe and that will, to use a cliche, "end world hunger".
Ethiopians, for example, could be provided with sustenance and clean water,
and the thinkers can come in and tell them how to build better shelter,
massive greenhouses for growing food, etc... I mean, my gosh... there are
enough people on the planet that nobody has to go hungry. It's just that
the people who have the means to retire from hard, physical labor should
also retire from earning a cash income. Instead, they can be "served" by
the labor of those who have not yet made it. They would essentially live
like kings while the world benefits from their knowledge and organizational
skills. Although I can't totally put it into words (heck I just now thought
of it) I can picture it in my mind and it looks beautiful.
> There seems to be too much pettiness rather than serious discussion and
> no conclusions. Too much right-left, rich-poor, straight-gay,
> black-white-brown-etc, liberal-conservative, gun rights Vs gun
> confiscation, and a thousand other means of dividing people so they
> won't organize a united front and members of this list are just as
> susceptible to these same divisions. What are the answers?
I'm sure they'll surface sooner or later. :-)
Damaeus
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