It's not just third-party reports like the one both you and I have cited. Oracle also documents its installation of adware/spyware with Java: http://www.java.com/en/download/faq/ask_toolbar.xml
tells expert users how to bypass it: http://www.java.com/en/download/faq/disable_offers.xml and disingenuously pretends it's all good: http://www.java.com/en/download/faq/adware_spyware.xml S. On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 7:10 PM, Patricia Shanahan <p...@acm.org> wrote: > See, for example, > http://superuser.com/questions/549028/how-can-i-prevent-ask-com-toolbar-from-being-installed-every-time-java-is-update > > I just did a simple default install of the current JRE, and it did not > offer Ask.com, so maybe Oracle has seen the error of their ways. > > > On 10/29/2015 11:57 AM, Greg Bullock wrote: > >> Would you confirm that, about the adware/spyware tricks? If confirmed, >> that would definitely interest me. >> >> Perhaps it's just my obliviousness or rapidly fading memory, but I don't >> recall ever seeing a trap on Oracle's Java download trying to install >> adware/spyware. >> >> >> http://www.oracle.com/technetwork/java/javase/downloads/jre8-downloads-2133155.html >> >> >> I've used Java (JRE, JDK and Netbeans) on Windows actively for 5+ years, >> and occasionally for longer than that, and I just don't recall seeing a >> malware trick there. I see them on other sites for other software, but >> not there for Java. >> >> Greg >> >> >> >> On 10/29/2015 11:44 AM, Simon Phipps wrote: >> >>> One more factor to consider is that the official Java installer >>> promoted by >>> Oracle tries really hard to trick the end-user into installing >>> adware/spyware at the same time. We used to avoid this in the Sun >>> installer >>> by bundling Java, but having it as an external dependency for new AOO >>> users >>> means they face the challenge not only of finding and installing Java but >>> avoiding the malware as they do so. >>> >>> I'd say this was a really big negative for a dependency on official Java. >>> It's not a problem on Linux where there is usually an OpenJDK bundle >>> available, but it's a huge negative on Windows. >>> >>> S. >>> >>> >>> On Thu, Oct 29, 2015 at 5:44 PM, Dennis E. Hamilton <orc...@apache.org> >>> wrote: >>> >>> The Java dependency problem keeps coming up buried in other threads. >>>> I am >>>> redirecting the most recent case so we can put light on this situation. >>>> >>>> Before the dependencies on Java are increased/improved, I think there >>>> is a >>>> crucial usability matter. >>>> >>>> 1. Currently users are trap-doored by exercising a feature or >>>> dialog that >>>> suddenly raises a Java dependency, sometimes for which there is no >>>> escape >>>> other than finding a way to shut down AOO that is not a >>>> normally-required >>>> skill. >>>> >>>> 2. The fact that full functioning of AOO is buried in the system >>>> requirements in a way that users can easily overlook (or never >>>> examine) is >>>> a problem. We can fix that page, even providing (or linking to) >>>> specific >>>> details of what the dependencies are. That would be useful so developers >>>> and power-users have the details. However, the system requirements are >>>> probably not read by most who download the software (based on over 40 >>>> million downloads of 4.1.1, overwhelmingly on systems designed for >>>> casual >>>> users). >>>> >>>> 3. If the installer required presence of Java, that would be a clear >>>> indication that it is required for operation. It would also be >>>> helpful if >>>> the installer provided an usable link for installing a workable Java >>>> if one >>>> is not present. >>>> >>>> 4. If the presence of Java is indeed optional, and the user does >>>> not have >>>> it or elects not to use it, AOO should not even offer functions for >>>> which >>>> Java is required. That is another way to improve the usability and at >>>> least avoid users falling through trap-doors. >>>> >>>> 5. Shouldn't we do this better? Or are we to decree that AOO is only >>>> intended for power-users who have strong skills with regard to managing >>>> their configurations, managing the install of dependencies, >>>> trouble-shooting and being able to work around the not-dependable way >>>> things work now? >>>> >>>> Three paths come to mind. >>>> >>>> A. Remove the Java dependencies. >>>> >>>> B. Adjust the Java dependencies, >>>> 1. So that the dependencies are clear and the situation around >>>> failures to find a suitable JRE is made workable for casual users. This >>>> could involve the above (2-4) remedies. >>>> 2. Only then consider increasing the dependencies on Java for >>>> full-function operation in some controllable way. >>>> >>>> C. Make AOO a Java application that has C++ components, rather than >>>> the >>>> reverse. >>>> >>>> These are all serious. Probably on the way to either A or C, one must >>>> address B. >>>> >>>> We also need to consider what the project's capacity for any of these >>>> cases happens to be. >>>> >>>> Thoughts? >>>> >>>> - Dennis >>>> >>>> PS: There is a bigger question about platform presence in here. >>>> There are >>>> distributions for which Java dependency is not particularly >>>> attractive and >>>> we may be cutting ourselves off from those. That might not matter if we >>>> are talking about the small percentage of the downloads that are for >>>> neither Windows nor Macintosh desktop PCs. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -----Original Message----- >>>>> From: Pedro Giffuni [mailto:p...@apache.org] >>>>> Sent: Thursday, October 29, 2015 08:07 >>>>> To: Apache OO <dev@openoffice.apache.org> >>>>> Subject: Re: Thinking of joining OpenOffice as a developer >>>>> >>>>> Hello; >>>>> >>>>> First of all, a warm welcome to Patricia. Java developers are >>>>> particularly welcome at this stage! >>>>> >>>>> Just IMHO, the C++ side of AOO is either under-control or >>>>> too-ugly-to care-about, so we would do good focus more on the >>>>> Java parts, which are also somewhat ugly but still promising. >>>>> >>>> [ ... ] >>>> >>>> >>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >>>> To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org >>>> For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org >>>> >>>> >>>> >>> >> > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: dev-unsubscr...@openoffice.apache.org > For additional commands, e-mail: dev-h...@openoffice.apache.org > > -- *Simon Phipps* http://webmink.com *Office:* +1 (415) 683-7660 *or* +44 (238) 098 7027 *Mobile*: +44 774 776 2816 *or Telegram <https://telegram.me/webmink>*
