EV Digest 6694
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Electric Boats
by "peekay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: We're screwed .. nope .. THEY'RE screwed .. just now and later too
by "peekay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: We're screwed.
by Lee Hart <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: We're screwed.
by Mark Ward <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Looking for EV Drag Racing DVDs
by Joel Silverman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) OT .. gandhi and chinese quotes
by "peekay" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) Re: We're screwed
by "Richard Acuti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) Re: Electric Boats
by Lock Hughes <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: We're screwed.
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: KillaCycle Adjustable Brush Timing
by Bill Dube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: Electric Boats
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Electric Boat design
by "jerryd" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: We're Screwed
by Chip Gribben <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: We're screwed
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) motor info?
by Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) RE: Electric Boats
by "Myles Twete" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) We're screwed.
by Marvin Campbell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) New member
by Steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: We're screwed.
by "Lawrence Rhodes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Weight of Bed S-10
by "Stand Culp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: We're screwed.
by "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Re: motor info?
by Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: We're screwed.
by "Bob Rice" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) Re: We're screwed.
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--- Begin Message ---
i believe lynch motor's old webpage had a link to the world record
set by a german lady in a powerboat using only battery and lynch motor
..peekay
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 6:38 PM
Subject: Re: Electric Boats
> We used to have a few regulars on the EVDL who were into racing electric
> boats. I remember some pretty hair-raising stories! This was probably at
> least 10 years ago. You might try the old Crest archives to see if any of
> their messages are still hanging round.
>
> http://crest.org/discussion/ev/
>
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EV List Administrator
>
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>
> --
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8:18 PM
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
with some innovative moves in south india.. a guy is
setting up charging stations for ev's .. i would
add one more thing ..
just as gas stations opened up after model T, those
very gas stations could stock standard battery
pack duly charged and swap them
ice car owners cannot carry more than 10 gallons
or so of fuel .. so gas stations had to come into
existence
EV's will be the only way to go .. sooner rather than
later .. maybe gas stations will get into batterypack
swapping just like container freight has brought in
container swapping on international scale
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 6:33 PM
Subject: Re: We're screwed.
> On 24 Apr 2007 at 6:32, Mark Ward wrote:
>
> > The first question everyone asks is always
> > "how far will it go?" ... the right ev can do the job.
>
> The way I approach this to ask people how many miles they put on their
cars
> last year. Most EVs can easily do 12,000 miles per year (32 miles a day).
>
> Richard, remember Lee Hart's quotation from Ghandi : "First they ignore
you,
> then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Your
experience
> places you at stage 3. Hang in there, victory's not far off!
>
>
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EV List Administrator
>
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> Want to unsubscribe, stop the EV list mail while you're on vacation,
> or switch to digest mode? See how: http://www.evdl.org/help/
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" or "etpost" addresses will not reach me.
> To send a private message, please obtain my email address from
> the webpage http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Free Edition.
> Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database: 269.5.9/773 - Release Date: 4/22/2007
8:18 PM
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Richard Acuti wrote:
Yesterday, I went to a local car club's weekly meet/hangout yesterday
in my EV Beetle... I went down there to look around and perhaps tap
into the group's knowledge on how I could improve my car figuring that
just because a guy has a 550 cu. in. engine doesn't mean he's closed
minded and won't have any ideas. I guess I was wrong. If this is the
prevalant attitude, we're in deep trouble.
I've seen some of this attitude. My EV is French (a Renault LeCar R5),
so I get even more of a ribbing! :-)
Some of this seems to be young male testosterone poisoning (my anything
is better than your anything). But hot rodders do seem to be suffering
from a persecution complex. I hear them moaning that the cops are "after
them" for reckless driving and violating noise laws. The oil companies
are "cheating them" with high gas prices. The car companies are making
"worthless garbage" that you can't fix no more. And the tree huggers are
"out to get them" banned for polluting.
So, showing up with a car that is slow, quiet, uses no gas, that you
built yourself, and that environmentalists like rubs them all the wrong
ways!
You can still get their attention, and even admiration. John Wayland has
been very successful at this. His EV has a loud stereo (instead of a
loud engine), wild tire-screeching performance, and beautifully detailed
craftsmanship that they have to appreciate.
--
First they ignore you. They they laugh at you. Then they fight you.
Then you win. -- Mahatma Gandhi
--
Lee A. Hart, 814 8th Ave N, Sartell MN 56377, leeahart_at_earthlink.net
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I figure I get to keep a bit of the Snob factor with my Saab
:-) LOL
---- Sean Korb <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On 4/24/07, Richard Acuti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > I went down there to look around and perhaps tap into the group's knowlege
> > on how I could improve my car figuring that just because a guy has a 550
> > cu.
> > in. engine doesn't mean he's closed minded and won't have any ideas. I
> > guess
> > I was wrong. If this is the prevelant attitude, we're in deep trouble.
> >
>
> It's not the prevalent attitude for all car nuts. It sounds like you ran
> into some domestic car snobs. Try your local autocross group. They're more
> eclectic in their tastes and VWs are not unwelcome. For many, the animosity
> between the muscle car and the VW goes back to the mid '60s.
>
> Next time someone compares your car to Hitler's vision, remind them that
> Henry Ford was presented the Iron Cross before the war broke out. That will
> make you the instant friend of all the Chevy heads :)
>
> --
> Sean Korb [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.spkorb.org
> '65, '68 Mustangs, '68 Cougar, '78 R100/7, '71 Pantera #1382
> "The more you drive, the less intelligent you get" --Miller
> "Computers are useless. They can only give you answers." -P. Picasso
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The MN chapter of the EAA will have a booth at the
Minnesota Living Green Expo in May 5-6. We will have
both converted and OEM EVs in the booth.
I would like to have a DVD playing of EV drag racing
going throughout the show.
Does anyone on the list have a decent quality DVD that
they are willing to copy, lend to me or I can purchase
for the event?
Please let me know ASAP since the show is coming up
soon.
Thanks
Joel Silverman
612-203-2621
__________________________________________________
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
i've been wanting to do this for a looooong time ..
lee's quotes are nice !
..peekay
(ah ! now i've done it !)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You're all right of course and thanks. Here's something I'm taking away from
this otherwise negative experience:
Some of you have been tinkering, experiementing and driving EV's for 10 or
20 years, starting with forklift motors and aircraft engine starters. You
may have gotten into it because you remember the '70's fuel crunch and you
were thinking "what will we do next time?". People have probably been
calling you all "chicken little" and deriding you for a lot longer than I've
been putting up with this criticism. I guess I just need a thicker skin.
Honestly, I did not go to this event to preach or try to "convert" anyone.
When the arguments started, I did indeed concede all of the shortcomings
without arguing. After that, all I said was that even with the car's
shortcomings, I've been able to avoid buying gasoline for my other car for
months at a time, I keep up with traffic, and I've never been stranded
anywhere. I kid you not, a couple (but not all) of these guys looked at me
like I was un-American for not buying gasoline when I told them this!
Let me tell you why I personally got into EV's:
#1. One day I said "I don't want to pay this much for gasoline" and people
told me that I had no choice because it's a "staple" or something that you
can't live without. Oh yeah? Nobody tells me that I don't have a choice.
#2. I'm in the US Navy and I've already done one tour in the Persian Gulf on
27' patrol gunboats in 115F degree heat to protect our national "interests"
(read: oil) and I'm interested in reducing our "interests" that need
protecting over there so I don't have to go anymore!
I'll keep the faith but as far as sharing my experiences with non EV
people....I'm going to rethink that one.
Rich A.
_________________________________________________________________
The average US Credit Score is 675. The cost to see yours: $0 by Experian.
http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=660600&bcd=EMAILFOOTERAVERAGE
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Jim Rudholm's 26ft. picnic launch "Sneakeasy". 48v 12-20m.range,
10.8knots top speed. Seen here:
http://www.psnw.com/~jmrudholm/sneakeasy.html
tks
Lock Hughes
alive, and kicking, in Toronto
human-electric hybrid ped
--- Mark Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> i was curious since I'm a water skier what lind of hulls are the most
>
> efficient (go the fastest) when converting to electric, say 48V, 8ea
> 6V
> Trojan's. Most of the set-ups in Ocalla Florida and Silver Springs
> were
> pontoon boats at 48V for the park service and tourists. I would
> probably
> have to give up water skiing though but at 5mpg that may be worth
> doing. I
> saw some with Ray Electric Outboards (Advance DC & Curtis control)
> and one
> solar tampoon boat with twin large 1hp trolling motors on the back
> "The
> Chabunagunamog". They all apppeared to do fairly slow, I'm thinking
> about
> 6-12 knots for about 6 hours run time. What is the best electric
> boat
> recepe'?
>
> Have a renewable energy day,
> Mark
Be smarter than spam. See how smart SpamGuard is at giving junk email the
boot with the All-new Yahoo! Mail at http://mrd.mail.yahoo.com/try_beta?.intl=ca
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Several thoughts:
Trash talking is a tradition among many car groups. Ford guys do it to Chevy
guys, domestics do it to imports, etc. I get grief because I haven't modified
my car enough (although it generally stops people in their tracks when I say
"any further mods would put me in a higher racing class"). Others get grief
because they have modded their car too much, etc. We even see a bit of that
here with things like AC vs. DC, and racers vs. practical cars.
Have you tried a VW club? Bill Dube has reported good receptions about his
electric rabbit.
Another thought is to introduce yourself to a club, and then introduce your car
later. I'm not sure how well the local Porsche club would receive it if I just
showed up with an electric Porsche, and it was the first time they had ever
seen me. I'm working up to it by attending a few events starting now.
Finally, I have found racers to be pretty open and friendly, and they care less
about what kind of car or how it looks. You might try wandering around the
parking lot of an autocross (http://www.scca.com).
----- Original Message ----
From: Richard Acuti <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 7:12:09 AM
Subject: We're screwed.
I'm a car guy. I like all kinds, even unpopular ones and just because
someone owns a car I hate, I don't demean it, or them.
Yesterday, I went to a local car club's weekly meet/hangout yesterday in my
EV Beetle, not to preach the gosspel of EV, but just to look around and see
if anyone had anything new or cool. The hostility I received was beyond
belief. One guy told me my car was a "rolling memorial to Adolf Hitler". I
explained what drivetrain was under the skin and why I chose it and everyone
else pretty much agreed that it was a useless idea because you can't jump in
and drive for an unlimited number of miles.
I went down there to look around and perhaps tap into the group's knowlege
on how I could improve my car figuring that just because a guy has a 550 cu.
in. engine doesn't mean he's closed minded and won't have any ideas. I guess
I was wrong. If this is the prevelant attitude, we're in deep trouble.
If anyone needs me, I'll be looking for jobs and a place to live in Italy.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
That is an excellent question.
If we manage get some time to put the bike on the dyno (and manage to
figure out how to keep it tied down) we will try different settings
while we watch the commutator for arcing.
If we don't manage to get it on the dyno, we will just take an
educated guess as to how much to advance the timing. Since the motors
don't toast every time, I know we are close to a good number at the
moment. I'd pick 5 degrees more advance as a PIOMA without the dyno.
Bill Dube'
At 11:56 PM 4/23/2007, you wrote:
Sounds exciting. How are you going to tune for optimal brushing
timing as a function of RPM and current?
----- Original Message ----
From: Bill Dube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 1:28:01 AM
Subject: KillaCycle Adjustable Brush Timing
Hopefully, we can push a few more amps and volts into the motors (and
have them survive) if we advance the timing a bit as we go down the track.
I put a few pictures up on the website of the nifty parts that Derek
made on his uber-nice CNC milling machine.
http://www.killacycle.com/photos/motor-details/page/2
Everything fits together correctly and moves smoothly so far. If it
all works on the track, we will make the bike go just a bit faster. :-)
__________________________________________________
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I think Rich had the BLDC motor from hell?
Seth Allen also did an electric boat using a golf cart
motor, not sure if he still has the boat.
Back in 2001 I was touring the Imperial Electric
(Advanced DC motors parent company) and they had a
pontoon boat with a Merc 25HP engine that was removed
and an Advanced DC golfcart motor mounted. Not sure
if they ever got than one on the lake or pursued plans
to enter the electric pontoon motor/control business.
I live on a lake in Ohio (Portage Lakes). During my
trips around the lake I have seen an all electric
pontoon type boat that is top of the line. I stopped
at the guys house and he told me he's a distributor
and that his model costs $25,000 (which isn't that
much for some of the people on this lake, his house
probably cost $1,000,000). I couldn't find the link
for his boat , but here's a few others that are
interesting,
http://www.tamarackelectricboats.com/new.htm
http://www.outboardelectric.org/choosing.htm
Rod
--- Tim Humphrey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> I think they may still be here, wasn't Rudman one of
> them?
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Tom, Mark and All,
----- Original Message Follows -----
From: tt2tjw <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Electric Boats
Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 15:15:39 +0100
Electric boats can be done but if you want any range,
you need to keep the speed down. How far down depends on
boat type, beam, weight.
First, forget about planning or semi planning as both
take too much power.
That leaves you with displacement boats with hulls
like sailboats. In fact the Many small trailer sailers to
30' are just about perfect for great electric boats. These
you need to keep at about 1x sq root in mph and one can get
20-30 mile range.
If you want to go faster, say 7-10 mph, you need to
narrow the hull,s so you have no wave making drag which is
best around 8-1 beam to length which normally means going to
a catamarran style. Preferably with rounded bottoms and
double ended canoe style or bottom of the transom not
underwater for least drag. The transom style doesn't
hobbyhourse if you cruise choppy waters.
Since you need length if a monohull, go very narrow
with good length so you can call it a canoe to get a lower
tax rate. Check your local boat tax laws before starting so
you don't get a $200/yr tag tax. Canoes here in Fla are only
$12/yr of any length so a 26' or so one about 4' wide would
be a great EV.
Another good way is a long thin 8-1 center hull for
passengers, batts and a pair of outriggers with tramps on
each side for sunbathing, ect can be very eff, long range.
>Mark,
>
>to achieve 6 knots with a displacement hull you will need
>an overall length of about 35 ft.
For a sailboat type monohull yes if you want range.
>
>a well designed semi displacement (semi planing hull) of
>about 25ft and about 600Kg overall weight could reach
>about 15 knots with about 25hp. Increasing the weight will
>increase the required horsepower.
I don't think that would work, at least not for long.
You get about 1-1.5 hphr out of each golf cart battery so
you really want to run under 2hp if you want range.
>
>A good estimate of speed for conventional planing hulls is
>Crouch's formula speed(knots) = C * sqrt ( displacement
>(lbs) / Hp at the prop)
>
>Hp at the prop is about 85% of the rated Hp, you may get
>higher with a well designed electric motor)
>C is between 150 and 175 depending on hull form.
As your range will be measured in minutes, ususally
under 10, it's not a good choice.
>
>
>A more exotic planing hull will go faster but you must keep
>the weight very low.
>If you want to get clever and you are on a calm piece of
>water you could think about foils.
Foils work well in rough water, in fact that's what
they are used for, highspeed in waves with comfort.
Regretfully plastic bags, seaweed, ect gets caught on them.
I use to live next to the Navy's Hydrofoils in Key
West. One was cruising the Straits of Fla when it hit a
whale at 55 knots. It wasn't a pretty sight. The Hydrofoil
was badly damaged with the front foil, bow ruined, the crew
airlifted to the hospital, and no one mention the poor
whale!!
So that leaves foils out.
One thing you can do is use a large dia, low rpm
prop to get more hp to the water. At least 1' dia, 18" or
more if you can makes a big eff difference.
You can make good outboards by taking an outboard
leg, removing the powerhead, puting a couplers on the
driveshaft and the motor. Mount it by mounting a alum plate
on the top of the leg, then using all thread, nuts to make
spacers to mount the motor above. Use a 50hp leg or a
sailboat outboard leg to get a bigger prop on say a 5hp E
motor.
This is one place where a solar power EV really
works as you normally have lots of area for panels and if
speeds low like 4-5 mph, can go all day!! Or go faster and
let the batts recharge while swimming, ect. Also a windgen
can work well in some places for less cost, more power. Most
docks have power so if you have a fast charger, you can suck
240ac at many docks.
I have a nice design for an e-cat if interested.
Jerry Dycus
>
>All these estimates ignore the drag of the waterskiier, I
>have no idea how large this is but I imagine its pretty
>big to get him out of the water, I guess its OK if your
>batteries can deliver the amps for a short period.
>
>
>Mark Hanson wrote:
>> i was curious since I'm a water skier what lind of hulls
>> are the most efficient (go the fastest) when converting
>> to electric, say 48V, 8ea 6V Trojan's. Most of the
>> set-ups in Ocalla Florida and Silver Springs were
>pontoon boats at 48V for the park service and tourists. I
>> would probably have to give up water skiing though but
>> at 5mpg that may be worth doing. I saw some with Ray
>> Electric Outboards (Advance DC & Curtis control) and one
>> solar tampoon boat with twin large 1hp trolling motors
>> on the back "The Chabunagunamog". They all apppeared to
>do fairly slow, I'm thinking about 6-12 knots for about 6
>> hours run time. What is the best electric boat recepe'?
>>
>> Have a renewable energy day,
>> Mark
>>
>>
>___________________________________________________________
>> ______ Need a break? Find your escape route with Live
>> Search Maps. http://maps.live.com/?icid=hmtag3
>>
>>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Richard,
Don't hang out with those Bozo's. Hang out with us. You can't reason
with those oily afflicted folks.
We are car buffs too. One of our members used to be a mechanic on the
Ferrari racing team.
Our next EVA/DC meeting is May 15, at Davis Library in Bethesda,
Maryland.
Also come out and hang out with us at the Rockville Science Day this
Sunday at Montgomery College.
And you can spend the whole weekend with us Maryland EVers at the 7th
Power of DC in Hagerstown, Maryland (June 2 and 3). EVers from across
the state, and from all over the East Coast will be there. Bryan
Murtha drives his Toyota RV-4 EV towing his electric Ranger round
trip, 80 plus miles from Owings, in Southern Maryland.
Later,
Chip Gribben
EVA/DC
Electric Vehicle Association of Washington DC
http://www.evadc.org
NEDRA
National Electric Drag Racing Association
http://www.nedra.com
On Apr 24, 2007, at 10:16 AM, Electric Vehicle Discussion List wrote:
From: "Richard Acuti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: April 24, 2007 7:12:09 AM EDT
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: We're screwed.
I'm a car guy. I like all kinds, even unpopular ones and just
because someone owns a car I hate, I don't demean it, or them.
Yesterday, I went to a local car club's weekly meet/hangout
yesterday in my EV Beetle, not to preach the gosspel of EV, but
just to look around and see if anyone had anything new or cool. The
hostility I received was beyond belief. One guy told me my car was
a "rolling memorial to Adolf Hitler". I explained what drivetrain
was under the skin and why I chose it and everyone else pretty much
agreed that it was a useless idea because you can't jump in and
drive for an unlimited number of miles.
I went down there to look around and perhaps tap into the group's
knowlege on how I could improve my car figuring that just because a
guy has a 550 cu. in. engine doesn't mean he's closed minded and
won't have any ideas. I guess I was wrong. If this is the prevelant
attitude, we're in deep trouble.
If anyone needs me, I'll be looking for jobs and a place to live in
Italy.
Rich A.
Maryland
_________________________________________________________________
Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate. Check
savings https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%
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56&p=5117
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
snip
I'll keep the faith but as far as sharing my experiences with non EV
people....I'm going to rethink that one.
Rich A.
Just keep in mind, if we want our "interest" to be more at home we are
going to have to put out some heavy effort in turning the gas momentum
around. It won't be easy, but, somebody has to do it! It won't happen
if we stay in our private little group. You have to expect some
bruising along the way, but, it does get better! And the better it
gets, the better it gets. Its a momentum thing.
I must admit that I have a very thin skin. I care what others think
and I don't plan on thickening up. I just realize that this is
important - vital - and is well worth the fight.
Ken
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
two things:
1. I was dumpster diving and found a motor. Voltage and amperage on
the info plate have me confused.
Voltage 230A/230F
Amperage .80A/.215F
2. Does anybody want a small shunt wound SEP-EX motor?
GE Model 5BCC56CB3B
RPM 1140
HP 1/6
V 230A/230F
A .80A/.215F
TIME RATING CONT
AMB TEMP 40 CELCIUS
INS CLASS B-R
wound SHUNT - SEP EXC
FR 56
GEJ 4360
SERIAL # FJN
This was part of a door opener for a Dover elevator.
R. Matt Milliron
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
1981 Jet Electrica
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and black,
electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 09:08:59 -0400, "David Roden" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> We used to have a few regulars on the EVDL who were into racing electric
> boats. I remember some pretty hair-raising stories! This was probably at
Tim asked:
> I think they may still be here, wasn't Rudman one of them?
Father Time (Don Crabtree), Dave Cloud and others used to do electric
hydroplane racing here in the NW.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I've had much the same experience with one of my neighbors. Big gear-head.
Lots of big trucks, hotrods, etc.
But the guy went out and bought a GEM a couple of years ago- so I thought
there might be hope for him.
Apparently, his is one of the first ones that came out with charging issues,
and he only got about 1200 miles out of his first battery pack, so now he
runs around town (in his GEM) preaching to everyone about how EVs suck, the
batteries suck, it's a crappy technology, ICE rules, etc.
Once, I tried to explain to him that the first gen GEMs had the wrong
charging algorithm, and if he got that corrected the batteries would last
longer, but, like all ideologues, he refused to hear any of it.
As far as he's concerned, there's no correcting the "fact" that battery
powered cars suck- and who should know better than him? He bought
one...right?
What an idiot.
Marv
Culver City, CA
> From: "Richard Acuti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Tue, 24 Apr 2007 07:12:09 -0400
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: We're screwed.
>
> I'm a car guy. I like all kinds, even unpopular ones and just because
> someone owns a car I hate, I don't demean it, or them.
>
> Yesterday, I went to a local car club's weekly meet/hangout yesterday in my
> EV Beetle, not to preach the gosspel of EV, but just to look around and see
> if anyone had anything new or cool. The hostility I received was beyond
> belief. One guy told me my car was a "rolling memorial to Adolf Hitler". I
> explained what drivetrain was under the skin and why I chose it and everyone
> else pretty much agreed that it was a useless idea because you can't jump in
> and drive for an unlimited number of miles.
>
> I went down there to look around and perhaps tap into the group's knowlege
> on how I could improve my car figuring that just because a guy has a 550 cu.
> in. engine doesn't mean he's closed minded and won't have any ideas. I guess
> I was wrong. If this is the prevelant attitude, we're in deep trouble.
>
> If anyone needs me, I'll be looking for jobs and a place to live in Italy.
>
> Rich A.
> Maryland
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi,
I am embarking on a project to build a somewhat impractical, but
fun EV. Never played with EV before, but have been wrenching
cars and other machinery for 40 years.
Specifics:
Car: 1980-82 Corvette (its a corvette thing, either you get it or
not...)
Rational for specific model:
80-82 has large hood area for batteries, as well as room in rear
once gastank and spare tire removed. Hope to maintain f/r weight
distribution near 50/50.
80-82 has aluminum differential and rear crossmember, composite
rear spring standard/available.
several aftermarket aluminum 5 speed manual trans kits available.
numerous racing coil-over shocks available to deal with battery
load.
decent coefficient of drag, fiberglass body.
Specs for 80-82 vette:
approx. 3300 lbs. curb weight, less V8 approx 600 lbs.
new trans approx 70-90 lbs.
expect to use billet aluminum flywheel, approx 16 lbs.
Current plan:
AC motor, current candidate is electroauto.com heavy vehicle kit.
24-28 (288v-336v) group 24/27 gelcells. 14-18 front, 10 rear.
Goals:
I live in mountain country, about 5 miles from town. So a daily
range of 15-20 miles would suffice, above that is gravy. You don't
drive vetts in winter anyway, so it will only be on the road from
April thru October. I can scrap the heater and AC. Flatland top
speed of 70 mph desirable. Between the 5-speed gearing and wide
range of "steep" rearend gearing available this looks do-able on
paper.
Help needed:
Any and all suggestions.
References to useful books and articles. Being from a scientific
background, I like detailed math, etc.
Pros/Cons of the solectria AC55 and controller, as well as other
comparable systems from other suppliers.
Pros/Cons of gelcell approach. I do need to install batteries at
other than vertical orientation. I DON'T have unlimited budget.
tia,
Steve
__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
This looks like a job for a Wayland/Zillaized vehicle. Let out a can
O"whoopass on these suckers & their attitude might change. Mention that
your car is about 1.5 cents a mile for the energy to operate & it was
designed for local use only. This is an isolated attitude in my opinion.
While I get it once in a while out on the Left Coast I would think it to be
more prevelant on the more conservative Right Coast. If these guys had a
chance to ride/drive a high performance EV or be beat by one they will be
eatin crow. Don't let it get you down. Lawrence Rhodes.....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Acuti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 4:12 AM
Subject: We're screwed.
> I'm a car guy. I like all kinds, even unpopular ones and just because
> someone owns a car I hate, I don't demean it, or them.
>
> Yesterday, I went to a local car club's weekly meet/hangout yesterday in
my
> EV Beetle, not to preach the gosspel of EV, but just to look around and
see
> if anyone had anything new or cool. The hostility I received was beyond
> belief. One guy told me my car was a "rolling memorial to Adolf Hitler". I
> explained what drivetrain was under the skin and why I chose it and
everyone
> else pretty much agreed that it was a useless idea because you can't jump
in
> and drive for an unlimited number of miles.
>
> I went down there to look around and perhaps tap into the group's knowlege
> on how I could improve my car figuring that just because a guy has a 550
cu.
> in. engine doesn't mean he's closed minded and won't have any ideas. I
guess
> I was wrong. If this is the prevelant attitude, we're in deep trouble.
>
> If anyone needs me, I'll be looking for jobs and a place to live in Italy.
>
> Rich A.
> Maryland
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate. Check savings
>
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h2bbb&disc=y&vers=925&s=4056&p=5117
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
David,
thanks for the input :-) I'll be using my S-10, unconverted for
awhile, for landscaping projects around here, while I finish doing
research and decisioning on stuff. I would have guessed another
hundred lbs, but I think building a bed from aluminum square beams and
plastic sheathing will be worth the effort.
So this is exactly the info I needed, thanks again!
_______________________________________________________________
On 4/23/07, David (Battery Boy) Hawkins <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Yo back at you,
I thought about replacing the bed on my '89 extended cab until I hauled it
down to a local stone yard during the conversion and weighed it on there
pallet sized scale. Let's see, were did I put the notes with all the
various scale weights? Oh yes, here it is in this pile! Including the tail
gate it was only, wait for it, here it is, 210 pounds, so I did the
hinge/lift thang and kept it on the truck to contain stuff. Unless you plan
on building a flat bed that doesn't use wood, it would be hard to build a
lighter bed. I would also like to get a fiberglass shell eventually,
instead of putting the wife-unit's dog in a crate...
Hope this helps,
Suck Amps...
50,000 plus pure eelectric miles on the buggies, and a countin',
Dave (B.B.) Hawkins
Member of the Denver Electric Vehicle Council:
http://www.devc.info/
Card carrying member and former racer with The National Electric Drag
Racing Association:
http://www.nedra.com/
Lyons, Colorado
1979 Mazda RX-7 EV (192V of Orbs for the teenage daughter)
1989 GM (General Murderers of the pure EV!) S10 (144V of floodies, for Pa
only!)
2004 Toyota Prius (for Ma, and Pa if Ma is a supervising!)
>Date: Sun, 22 Apr 2007 13:07:43 -0700
>From: "Stand Culp" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
>Yo-theList,
>
>Is anyone familiar with the weight specs breakdown on an extended cab
>S-10 pickup (1992) ?
>In the interest of shaving weight off during conversion (and seeing as
>the mechanical stuff is more my forte) I'm planning on fabricating a
>replacement for the steel box behind the cab. The bed is 6' long and
>55" wide (interior measurements.)
>TIA
>
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--- Begin Message ---
David Roden wrote:
> Richard, remember Lee Hart's quotation from Ghandi : "First they ignore
> you,
> then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Your
> experience
> places you at stage 3. Hang in there, victory's not far off!
Hmm .. I guess down here in South-Texas this would position me
somewhere around 1 1/2 :)
mm.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Matt,
I think it means A for Armature and F for Field. But
that does not sound like a good ratio of A to F
current or power.
Jeff
--- Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> two things:
>
> 1. I was dumpster diving and found a motor.
> Voltage and amperage on
> the info plate have me confused.
>
> Voltage 230A/230F
> Amperage .80A/.215F
>
> 2. Does anybody want a small shunt wound SEP-EX
> motor?
>
> GE Model 5BCC56CB3B
> RPM 1140
> HP 1/6
> V 230A/230F
> A .80A/.215F
> TIME RATING CONT
> AMB TEMP 40 CELCIUS
> INS CLASS B-R
> wound SHUNT - SEP EXC
> FR 56
> GEJ 4360
> SERIAL # FJN
>
> This was part of a door opener for a Dover
> elevator.
>
> R. Matt Milliron
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> 1981 Jet Electrica
> http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
> My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and
> black,
> electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with
> it.
>
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
----- Original Message -----
From: "Michaela Merz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: We're screwed.
Another Gandhi Good One that I'll be using as a bumper sticker; " We Must
Be the change We wish to see in the World" That's right next to an old
plaque from some old DC machine;"Start Slowly" I thought they went well,
together.
Seeya
Bob
>
> David Roden wrote:
>
> > Richard, remember Lee Hart's quotation from Ghandi : "First they ignore
> > you,
> > then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win." Your
> > experience
> > places you at stage 3. Hang in there, victory's not far off!
>
> Hmm .. I guess down here in South-Texas this would position me
> somewhere around 1 1/2 :)
>
> mm.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Don't lump conservatives in this, and
don't lump 'east/right coast' in this either!
I'm a green conservative, and no, its
not an oxymoron!
We don't have to have more government
to save the planet! (ok, I'm done).
I agree with Lawrence; you'll find crazies
no matter where you go, you don't even have to look.
It sounds to me like you were confronted
with dislike on 2 angles:
1 from having a "German" car,
and another for having an electric - neither of which is valid -
A friend and I took his newly converted
1991 Dodge Dakota to a car-show in Monroe, NC.
His was the only street vehicle there
that was electric; I'm obviously not counting the "ez-go" vehicles
that were there.
There was a great deal of positive interest,
and while I walked away to look at the other cars occasionally,
I don't recall even a single deragatory
comment about my friend's truck -
and we're in "Conseravtive South"
(not that near-by Charlotte is that conservative).
My recommendation? Ignore those folks,
and keep NOT burning oil, and keep NOT funding terrorists!
Also, be encouraged by the work that
Tesla and Phoenix Motorcars are doing.
May 2007 issues of Popular Mechanics,
Popular Science, Car and Driver magazines (and one other) all had positive
articles about electric (and plugin-hybrid) vehicles.
The Car and Driver magazine article
was about racing; it even had pictures of Gone Postal and others there;
the other articles were about electric (but mostly about hybrid) vehicles.
Its going to happen. Just keep your
chin up, and ignore the idiots.
Best Regards -
Ed Cooley
"Lawrence Rhodes"
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
04/24/2007 12:59
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This looks like a job for a Wayland/Zillaized vehicle.
Let out a can
O"whoopass on these suckers & their attitude might change. Mention
that
your car is about 1.5 cents a mile for the energy to operate & it was
designed for local use only. This is an isolated attitude in my opinion.
While I get it once in a while out on the Left Coast I would think it to
be
more prevelant on the more conservative Right Coast. If these guys
had a
chance to ride/drive a high performance EV or be beat by one they will
be
eatin crow. Don't let it get you down. Lawrence Rhodes.....
----- Original Message -----
From: "Richard Acuti" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Tuesday, April 24, 2007 4:12 AM
Subject: We're screwed.
> I'm a car guy. I like all kinds, even unpopular ones and just because
> someone owns a car I hate, I don't demean it, or them.
>
> Yesterday, I went to a local car club's weekly meet/hangout yesterday
in
my
> EV Beetle, not to preach the gosspel of EV, but just to look around
and
see
> if anyone had anything new or cool. The hostility I received was beyond
> belief. One guy told me my car was a "rolling memorial to Adolf
Hitler". I
> explained what drivetrain was under the skin and why I chose it and
everyone
> else pretty much agreed that it was a useless idea because you can't
jump
in
> and drive for an unlimited number of miles.
>
> I went down there to look around and perhaps tap into the group's
knowlege
> on how I could improve my car figuring that just because a guy has
a 550
cu.
> in. engine doesn't mean he's closed minded and won't have any ideas.
I
guess
> I was wrong. If this is the prevelant attitude, we're in deep trouble.
>
> If anyone needs me, I'll be looking for jobs and a place to live in
Italy.
>
> Rich A.
> Maryland
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Mortgage refinance is Hot. *Terms. Get a 5.375%* fix rate. Check savings
>
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url="">
>
--- End Message ---
