EV Digest 6714
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: Upstate NY EV Groups?
by "c" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re:Electric Aircraft
by Rod Hower <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Curtis Controller - experiences
by Steve Powers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) Re: Curtis Controller - experiences
by "Jo Prichard" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) RE: Electric Aircraft
by "Martin Winlow" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: DOD question - new/old debate
by Jeff Shanab <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) RE: Electric Aircraft
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
8) Re: EV Experience with Battery Desulfation?
by "Deanne Mott" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
9) Re: HARD TIME ON CURTIS WARRANTY CLAIM? (WAS Re: Newest Curtis
controllers OK to buy now for 120V EV? Or, go with Zilla controller?)
by <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: [EV] Re: corvette conversion
by Eduardo Kaftanski <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) No "Juiced Up" at PODC
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
12) $5000 dragster challenge at PODC
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
13) Comercial Contactor Controller
by "childreypa" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Re: EV Experience with Battery Desulfation?
by Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
15) cartoon
by Matthew Milliron <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Comercial Contactor Controller
by "George Swartz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: No "Juiced Up" at PODC
by "Jack Knopf" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
18) City El Video on CurrentTV
by nikki <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
19) Re: Electric Aircraft
by David Dymaxion <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
20) Re: Quick question on running two motors
by "Timothy Balcer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
21) Re: corvette conversion
by Jeff Major <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
22) Nationwide Insurance Co... Help!
by "BC" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
23) Re: Upstate NY EV =?UTF-8?B?R3JvdXBzPw==?=
by Tim Humphrey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
24) RE: Comercial Contactor Controller
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
25) Re: $5000 dragster challenge at PODC
by "Philippe Borges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
26) Re: Curtis Controller - experiences
by "Timothy Balcer" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
27) Re: Nationwide Insurance Co... Help!
by Bill Dube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
28) Truncated EVDL messages in the Archive
by robert mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
29) WHICH MODEL/VERSION? Re: Curtis Controller - experiences
by robert mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
30) Any experience(s) with this company can repair Curtis controllers?
by robert mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
31) RE: ADC 6.7 redline and how to measure it.
by "Randy Burleson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
32) Cheap regen/DC-DC eliminator
by "Marty Hewes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
33) RE: ADC 6.7 redline and how to measure it.
by "damon henry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
34) Re: Comercial Contactor Controller
by Jack Murray <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
I've been trying to chair a Central NY chapter of eaaev Contact me @
[EMAIL PROTECTED] I live near Utica (Rome) just east of Syracuse. For a
listing of chapters go to www.eaaev.org
Don B. Davidson III
----- Original Message -----
From: "mclTunes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2007 11:35 AM
Subject: Upstate NY EV Groups?
> Are there any active EV groups near Binghamton or Ithaca NY? For that
> matter is there a directory somewhere of EV groups?
>
> Thanks...
> -- Mark Lepkowski
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
There is also a yahoo group for these ultralites,
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/electricPPG/
Rod
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
> It's an Ultralight aircraft called a PPG. Very high
> lift and low weight. I am only using motors in the
> 8-15hp range. Check out youtube
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=s3pgGDQIgjM and
> http://youtube.com/watch?v=iVN_qEtBqjg to see a
> flying prototype. What about the new LiPo batterys?
> Do they not out preform Li-Ion Batteries? Could
> you explain "746x65 ~ 50 kW?"
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Sent: Sun, 29 Apr 2007 3:40 PM
> Subject: Re: Electric Aircraft
>
>
> Focus on the batteries and put aside any drive
> system design efforts at first.
>
> A very small two-seat airplane needs about 65 HP.
> This is 746x65 ~ 50 kW.
>
> You would like to fly for about an hour, so this is
> about a 50 kW-hr pack.
>
> The very highest energy $tate-of-the-art Li-Ion
> cell$ (that will turn into flamethrowers given the
> opportunity,) approach 200 W-hr/kg. Your 50 kW-hr
> pack will weigh at least 250 kg = 550 lbs.
>
> Now you understand why there are not any electric
> airplanes.
>
> You could possibly do this with a LongEZ by giving
> up the passenger seat.
>
> Bill Dube'
>
________________________________________________________________________
> Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of
> storage and industry-leading spam and email virus
> protection.
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have the Curtis 120 V / 550 A model running at 108 V
in my 93 Festiva with 9" ADC. No issues. Still
though, even with my 2200 lb car including batteries,
it can't get up steep hills in any gear higher than
1st (15 -20 MPH). For, that' I'd need a Zilla 1k. On
moderate grades and flat, it is similar to stock 1.3 L
engine. Previously it had the 1221B 120 V / 400 A
controller, and it blew out all the FETs and diodes on
the power stage. In between, I used the GE EV-1B
running at 96 V / 320 A. The preformance was more
jerkey on startup, top speed in each gear was higher
(than Curtis), but it gave less range (maybe 10 - 20%
less range) and it is known to be a "battery eater."
Steve
__________________________________________________
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Steve
I have the Curtis 120 V / 550 A model running at 108 V
in my 93 Festiva with 9" ADC. No issues. Still
though, even with my 2200 lb car including batteries,
it can't get up steep hills in any gear higher than
1st (15 -20 MPH). For, that' I'd need a Zilla 1k.
Would the Zilla 1k work ok with the 9" ADC and if so how much more power
would it give you just by replacing the controller?
Jo
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Um... What happens at night?
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Roland Wiench
Sent: 29 April 2007 23:10
To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
Subject: Re: Electric Aircraft
Better hurry up and get it built. There is a group of people, the same
people that flew a aircraft around the world, that is building a electric
aircraft to fly around the world. They contacted Etek for building eight
motors to turn eight props.
There method is to use all eight props with Li-ion cells to take off and
than throttle back for at a very low rpm. The top of the wing, as large or
larger area than some wings will have solar cells to provide power at that
time.
Roland
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bill Dube" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2007 1:40 PM
Subject: Re: Electric Aircraft
> Focus on the batteries and put aside any drive system design efforts at
> first.
>
> A very small two-seat airplane needs about 65 HP. This is 746x65 ~ 50 kW.
>
> You would like to fly for about an hour, so this is about a 50 kW-hr pack.
>
> The very highest energy $tate-of-the-art Li-Ion cell$ (that will turn
> into flamethrowers given the opportunity,) approach 200 W-hr/kg. Your
> 50 kW-hr pack will weigh at least 250 kg = 550 lbs.
>
> Now you understand why there are not any electric airplanes.
>
> You could possibly do this with a LongEZ by giving up the
> passenger seat.
>
> Bill Dube'
>
>
> At 11:01 AM 4/29/2007, you wrote:
> >I have thoroughly enjoyed reading all the great things you guys are
> >building. You guys really seem to know what you are doing. I am
> >building an electric aircraft and am hoping someone might help me
> >figure a few things out. I have three motor options I think will
> >work for my prototype. The Briggs+Stratton Etek brushless, the Perm
> >PMG-132 w/bushes, and the Lemco Lem-200 w/brushes.
> >
> >Because the Etek is brushless is it quieter? Is it more energy
> >efficient? Does anyone know the efficiency % of the new brushless Etek?
> >Which motor will drain the batteries the quickest. One that runs on
> >72volts and 110Amps or one using 48volts and 165amps?
> >
> >The motor will only need to run at full power for the first
> >2mins. After that it will mostly run at percentages around 65% to
> >80% and occasionally at 0 to descend and full power to climb.
> >
> >Are there any battery packs available commercially that weigh less
> >then 50 lbs that could power such a set up for at least
> >30min? LiPo? A123? Could someone show me how to calculate how much
> >battery power I will need? Can I run these batteries all the way
> >down or do I need to recharge before they are completely
> >drained. Thanks for the help and great message board. -Mike
> >________________________________________________________________________
> >Check Out the new free AIM(R) Mail -- 2 GB of storage and
> >industry-leading spam and email virus protection.
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Ya know, I have a vehicle made by the same manufacturer and I go more by
the trip odometer than the fuel guage.
I have seen USB GPS recievers for $79.00 and bluetooth for $200. Even
cheaper gps chipsets are being include in phones.
Type gps chipset into google and you will find integrated soulutions
with arm microcontrollers and modules. Adding this to a project may only
bump price $50 to $100 instead of $1000.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Martin> Um... What happens at night?
>From what I read they are (or were) working on a fuel cell for night
flights.
--
Skip Montanaro - [EMAIL PROTECTED] - http://www.webfast.com/~skip/
"The hippies and the hipsters did some great stuff in the sixties,
but the geeks pulled their weight too." -- Billy Bragg
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
What was the question? The original email is one of those with
incompatible formatting...
On 4/30/07, David Roden <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
We get this question a fair bit. I don't see anything addressing it in the
FAQ.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I wonder it they died from the voltage being hi from the batteries end of
charge , ?
>
and he had TWO
> Curtis controllers die "in their sleep" within a
> month. Said he had a hard time getting them replaced
> Now, his ontrollers failed, didn't blow up, or burn
> up, while the truck wasn't used. Reason for this?
>
> His Curtis controllers weren't the "whistling" model,
> so can we assume that Baird had an older model that
> was prone to failure?
>
> He had the 144V model.
>
> Also said his truck drew up to 435A or so, according
> to a sophisticated digital ammeter. The Tofino area is
> flat, too.
>
> Can anybody provide details of their RECENT (2006, or
> 2007) experiences with a Curtis warranty claim?
> (Otmar's is posted in the Cafe Electric website.)
>
> Interestingly, Baird's new electric small car is 96V.
> Is it fair to say that, at 96V, the Curtis controller
> is robust?
>
> BTW, I haven't confirmed any of Baird's allegations
> about the Curtis controllers.
>
>
>
> --- robert mat <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> > There were posts on several forums about "lots" of
> > Curtis controller failures on electric vehicles,
> > which
> > leads me to the following questions, in respect to a
> > 120V EV:
> >
> > - What is the waiting time for a Godzilla (Otmar)
> > controller?
> >
> > - Are the newest Curtis 120V (72V-120V) 400A
> > controllers better built now, so they don't blow up
> > at
> > low speeds? How about the 120V-144V model, 550A
> > model,
> > is that a "solid" controller? Are the newer models
> > the
> > ones that make the low-speed whine-whistle-buzz
> > sounds?
> >
> > - Our "non-whistling" (12+ year old model)120V 400A
> > Curtis failed at low speed, while moving from a
> > stop,
> > reversing. Should it be equipped with a precharge
> > circuit, to prevent this from happening? (This
> > controller failure doesn't appear to be in the power
> > section; it may be in the controls section.) Is a
> > failure likely to happen again, after we repair it?
> >
> > - What is the bullet-proof 120V controller for an
> > S-15
> > EV, in your experience?
> >
> > Thanks in advance for all suggestions.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Photo link: Using the world's first licensed
> > Revived Battery electric pickup truck
> > for everyday errandshttp://my-ev-diary.blogspot.com/
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________________________
> > Do You Yahoo!?
> > Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> > protection around
> > http://mail.yahoo.com
> >
> >
>
>
> Photo link: Using the world's first licensed
> Revived Battery electric pickup truck
> for everyday errandshttp://my-ev-diary.blogspot.com/
>
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
>
> I know some people will probably disagree, but I would modify that statement
> to read, "Because 95% of my driving will be in the mountains, I >NEED< regen
> capabilities."
>
What do you define as mountains?
Where I live there is a 600 foot difference betweenn the lower parts and the
higher parts of the city, although, as there is also a 30 mile distance
it is not that apparent in normal driving.
--
Eduardo K. | Roses are #FF0000
http://www.carfun.cl | Violets are #0000FF
http://ev.nn.cl | All my base Are belong to you
|
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
BAD NEWS
It's looks as though our new "Juiced Up" dragster will not be ready for
the PODC this year. At least not in the form I would be satisfied
bringing it to an official NEDRA event. Four nine inch motors, four 2K
Zillas, and 3000+ battery cells with full regulation presents some
challenges. The Zillas our here on the shelf, the motors should be here
by the end of May, and I am not ready to share final details of the
battery pack at the time being, but rest assured "Juiced Up" will be
completed, tested, tuned and at a NEDRA asap. I had considered bringing
it with me to PODC in an incomplete state but don't see the purpose in
that.
GOOD NEWS
So what to do with four new 2K Zillas while they wait for their new
home. I installed one in AGNS last week. She ran a 14.7 @ 85 on
Saturday at 84 volts. Darin and Piranha have moved up to 96 volts so it
will be a class shootout in Maryland on June 3! A guy from Texas took
the 96 volt record held by the Electropolitan last fall so I found a
temporary home for Zilla#2. Not sure what 2000 amps will do to that
tiny little rear axle in but I have a spare one just in case. We will
have her at PODC as well. OJ is going to have to carry the water one
more time for us in the dragster category and will be there withe not
only a 2K, but, (are you listening Rudman?) an nice green box that
doesn't shock the %&*# out of you while charging. We're still looking
for that elusive 240 volt 10.55 number......
Shawn Lawless
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The OJ dragster will be at PODC on June 3 running lead acid AGM
batteries, and 8 LMC PM motors. As I see it, by this time next year
lead acid AGM dragster racing will be a vintage class. Why don't we
have a last hurrah, east-west, winner take all grudge match at PODC
between the 2 fastest electric dragsters of the past 5 years. I propose
we each put up $2K. (Brian and Chip, Can NEDRA add another $1k to the
winner?) and we have it out. I still think 8 motors are better than
one. I don't care if we go by best ET of the day or one Grudge type
run, (You should win that easily with you excellent light cutting
skills) What do you say Dennis? Come on over here and show us how it's
done.
Shawn
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hey,
I, along with a couple others I've noticed on the list am still looking
for some detailed info on a simple contactor controller. I know, I know,
it's such a simple contact. Just close the circuit and off you go. But
still, there must be something somewhere like a how to, or step by step
documentation by someone who did it first. Pictures and diagrams would
be nice. Also, is there a company that makes a contactor controller? Or
a decent speed control device. Something simple and reliable. Seems like
if you want a commercial controller, the only option is an expensive
PWM. What about a cheap contactor controller? Anyone know where I can
get one?
Thanks,
Paul
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On Sun, 29 Apr 2007 20:41:08 -0700 (PDT), you wrote:
>Hi all,
>
> I hope you had a great weekend. Has anyone had experience with battery
> desulfators in their EVs? I hear a lot of talk about battery balancing, but
> not too much about desulfation. There's an older article in HomePower that
> talks about keeping deep-cycle batteries healthy for the long run by putting
> an inexpensive home-made desulfator on each battery. The link I have is:
>
>http://www.flex.com/~kalepa/desulf.htm
>
>I'm wondering if people have tried this circuit and found it effective. Any
>thoughts? Thanks for your time.
>
The gang charger I am using consists of 10 Schumacher 1200A's. These
have an automatic desulfate cycle. It does this if it senses the
battery needs it.
R. Matt Milliron
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
1981 Jet Electrica
http://www.austinev.org/evalbum/702
My daughter named it, "Pikachu". It's yellow and black,
electric and contains Japanese parts, so I went with it.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Just thought you might chuckle at this.
http://comics.com/wash/bonanas/archive/bonanas-20070428.html
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
I have a 100% contactor controller made by Hartman in my Battronic van. It
uses series parallel battery packs, and has multiple contacts for voltage,
rather than blow outs. These were made in the 1960's and early 1970's.
Hartman is the same company that made the high quality relays for WW2
aircraft. Good luck.
On Mon, 30 Apr 2007 10:12:21 -0400, childreypa wrote
> Hey,
> I, along with a couple others I've noticed on the list am still looking
> for some detailed info on a simple contactor controller. I know, I
> know, it's such a simple contact. Just close the circuit and off you
> go. But still, there must be something somewhere like a how to, or
> step by step documentation by someone who did it first. Pictures and
> diagrams would be nice. Also, is there a company that makes a
> contactor controller? Or a decent speed control device. Something
> simple and reliable. Seems like if you want a commercial controller,
> the only option is an expensive PWM. What about a cheap contactor
> controller? Anyone know where I can get one? Thanks, Paul
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Good luck on your racing Shawn!
Jack.
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 8:31 AM
Subject: No "Juiced Up" at PODC
BAD NEWS
It's looks as though our new "Juiced Up" dragster will not be ready for
the PODC this year. At least not in the form I would be satisfied
bringing it to an official NEDRA event. Four nine inch motors, four 2K
Zillas, and 3000+ battery cells with full regulation presents some
challenges. The Zillas our here on the shelf, the motors should be here
by the end of May, and I am not ready to share final details of the
battery pack at the time being, but rest assured "Juiced Up" will be
completed, tested, tuned and at a NEDRA asap. I had considered bringing
it with me to PODC in an incomplete state but don't see the purpose in
that.
GOOD NEWS
So what to do with four new 2K Zillas while they wait for their new
home. I installed one in AGNS last week. She ran a 14.7 @ 85 on
Saturday at 84 volts. Darin and Piranha have moved up to 96 volts so it
will be a class shootout in Maryland on June 3! A guy from Texas took
the 96 volt record held by the Electropolitan last fall so I found a
temporary home for Zilla#2. Not sure what 2000 amps will do to that
tiny little rear axle in but I have a spare one just in case. We will
have her at PODC as well. OJ is going to have to carry the water one
more time for us in the dragster category and will be there withe not
only a 2K, but, (are you listening Rudman?) an nice green box that
doesn't shock the %&*# out of you while charging. We're still looking
for that elusive 240 volt 10.55 number......
Shawn Lawless
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi everyone,
I have uploaded my City El video to Current TV. Please support it and
add any high-quality videos to Current.tv as well! The more exposure
we can get to this fantastic new TV channel the better! (There must
be some high-res stuff of drag racing?)
Nikki.
My pod is at http://uk.current.com/watch/32295648
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Electric flight is going to be tough, but is has been done. Electric model
airplanes and helicopters are doing great, but you can't just scale that up to
full size. The Smithsonian has an Aeroenvironment solar powered plane. There
has been some success in using electricity for a short time to get up high
enough to start thermalling. A guy in Utah (Dell Schanze) plans to start
selling paragliders that are electrically powered. He claims an hour of flight
time, but I would imagine that is with thermal help. You could google on his
name and ask him about it.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Thanks much Lee!
I already knew the performance benefits and etc (having read quite a
bit about White Zombie and et al) but here the business end of it is
simply that it is -just- as efficient (within a small margin) however
two smaller motors are more practical from an operational standpoint
if you have a series/parallel switching controller (like the Zilla)
given the additional power at speed.
That clears up a few things for me :)
--T
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Steve,
Most likely the Siemens AC would come as a package,
motor and controller. And your comment about regen,
it may be hard to come by with a DC system.
Jeff
--- Steve <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Hi All,
>
> First, thanx to everyone who replied to my
> questions on titleing
> an EV in CO, both directly, and thru the list.
>
> Although I have gotten almost as many different
> opinions as answers,
> I believe that it will be technically easy, but
> possibly
> bureaucratically difficult. Once I get past the
> first level droids
> all should fall into place.
>
> So now, back to the design. The prevailing
> opinion is that the AC55
> is underpowered for my application. People seem
> evenly split on the
> issue of AC vs. DC. Because 95% of my driving will
> be in the
> mountains, I really would like regen capabilities.
> I see 2 basic
> courses:
>
> Siemens AC motor and ? controller.
>
> ? DC motor and Zilla controller (DC motor
> compatible with regen).
>
> converted weight approx. 3800-3900 lbs (24-28
> group 24 gels)
>
> Suggested configurations?
>
> ---
> tia,
> Steve
>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
...First go round my insurance company, Nationwide, says my conversion is an
experimental vehicle and they will not underwrite it. I haven't come armed
with all my info yet, but before I do is anyone out there insured with
Nationwide and would you be able to provide me with your agent's name and
number for handy assistance?
E-mail me off-list.
Thanks,
Bill in Delaware
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
It seems like it may be time for "us" to discuss. Maybe a tentative get
together.
>From the looks of things "our chapter" should be based in Syracuse. It appears
>to be about the center of all our location plots. And of course is the home of
>Advanced DC and D&D Motors.
I count 5 or 6 on this list within an hour of Syracuse. Auburn HS had (has?) an
EV program, so I would imagine there are quite a few near Syracuse not on this
list. I know of one in Syracuse, not on this list.
What say you? Want to set up a meeting location in Syracuse, sometime somewhere?
--
Stay Charged!
Hump
I-5, Blossvale NY
East of Syracuse...with Don.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
> Behalf Of c
> Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 5:54 AM
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
> Subject: Re: Upstate NY EV Groups?
>
> I've been trying to chair a Central NY chapter of eaaev Contact me @
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] I live near Utica (Rome) just east of Syracuse. For a
> listing of chapters go to www.eaaev.org
>
> Don B. Davidson III
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "mclTunes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
> Sent: Sunday, April 29, 2007 11:35 AM
> Subject: Upstate NY EV Groups?
>
>
>> Are there any active EV groups near Binghamton or Ithaca NY? For that
>> matter is there a directory somewhere of EV groups?
>>
>> Thanks...
>> -- Mark Lepkowski
>>
>>
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
The main problem is that with the price of the contactors you need to use,
it turns out that that expensive PWM controller is not so expensive after
all. In fact a contactor controller built with all new and properly rated
parts could end up being more expensive. I bought enough contactors and
diodes surplus off of Ebay to make a rectactor controller. All the parts at
a deep discount still cost me $200 and I still would have needed to
fabricate a bunch of stuff to put it all together. Ultimately I decided not
to go that route. I don't feel like I wasted the money, as beefy contactors
and huge diodes are always nice to have around and at least some of them
will undoubtedly end up in my new EV. I decided to spend the money and buy
an Alltrax 7245 instead. This cost me about $650 deliverd. Once I factored
in all my needs the Alltrax just made a lot more sense.
If you have a very cheap source of suitable contactors you can certainly
make a contactor controller. If you go to the File archive section of the
Yahoo EVDL archive you will find some scanned copies of contactor
controllers.
A 3 step contactor controller takes 9 contactors. A 3 step rectactor can be
built with 3 contactors and 6 diodes. The one I was going to build took 5
contactor but included one for field weakening and one for a startup
resistor.
damon
Here is the original message from Lee Hart I was working off of.
No; the rectactor is a better circuit. Here it is (view with a fixed
width font like Courier New or Fixedsys):
_________________________________||__________||___
| _|_ __|__+ | || | | || |
| D1 /_\ S4a ___ B1 | S1 | | S2 |
_|_ |____||____| - | | |_ _|
D5 /_\ +__|__ || _|_ |___|/___| \/\/\/ |
| B2 ___ /_\ D2 +|\- | R1 |_
| - |__________| C1 _|_ _| MOTOR
| S3 | S5 ___ _| FIELD
|______||_________| | _|
| || | | |
____|_____ | |____|
_|_ __|__+ _|_ |
D3 /_\ S4b ___ B3 /_\ D6 _|_
|____||____| - | MOTOR / \
+__|__ || _|_ | ARMATURE | |
B4 ___ /_\ D4 | \___/
|__________|___________|________________________________|
B1-B4 are your four 12v batteries. S1 is your main contactor, and has
capacitor C1 across it as a snubber. R1 is your starting resistor, and
S2 is the bypass contactor for it.
S4 is your 12v/24v series/parallel contactor. When open, B3 and B4 are
in parallel via diodes D3 and D4; and B1 and B2 are in parallel via
diodes D1 and D2. When you close S4, it connects B1 and B2 in series,
and B3 and B4 in series.
S3 is your 24v/48v series/parallel contactor. It works with diodes D5
and D6 to select 24v or 48v.
S5 is a field weaking contactor. It wires part of the starting resistor
across the field to get a speed halfway between two voltage steps.
Notice that at full voltage (48v), there are no diodes in the power
path. At 24v, there is only one diode in the power path (D5 and D6 are
effectively in parallel, each carrying 1/2 the motor current). At 12v,
there is two diode drops in the power path (D1, D2, D3, and D4 are
effectively in parallel, each carrying 1/4th the motor current).
Also note that no contactor ever needs to switch the full 48v. In an
emergency shutdown, opening all contactors doesn't have more than 12v
across any of them.
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
_________________________________________________________________
Mortgage rates near historic lows. Refinance $200,000 loan for as low as
$771/month*
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h27f8&disc=y&vers=689&s=4056&p=5117
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
8 LMC PM motors<
that's going to give very efficient high power !
hoping good results for you, let us know how it was fun please :^)
Cordialement,
Philippe
Et si le pot d'échappement sortait du volant, quel carburant choisiriez-vous
?
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr
Forum de discussion sur les véhicules électriques
http://vehiculeselectriques.free.fr/Forum/index.php
----- Original Message -----
From: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Monday, April 30, 2007 3:43 PM
Subject: $5000 dragster challenge at PODC
The OJ dragster will be at PODC on June 3 running lead acid AGM batteries,
and 8 LMC PM motors. As I see it, by this time next year lead acid AGM
dragster racing will be a vintage class. Why don't we have a last hurrah,
east-west, winner take all grudge match at PODC between the 2 fastest
electric dragsters of the past 5 years. I propose we each put up $2K.
(Brian and Chip, Can NEDRA add another $1k to the winner?) and we have it
out. I still think 8 motors are better than one. I don't care if we go by
best ET of the day or one Grudge type run, (You should win that easily
with you excellent light cutting skills) What do you say Dennis? Come on
over here and show us how it's done.
Shawn
________________________________________________________________________
AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free
from AOL at AOL.com.
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
the '1k' means 1000 Amps, so roughly double the Amps of the Curtis,
however the Zilla 1k can handle upwards of 360v, so it is actually 5
times more powerful. The curtis can handle 66k watts, the Zilla 1k can
handle 360k watts. Or so.
The ADC motor can probably not handle that much power, but thats how
much the Zilla can dish out.
On 4/30/07, Jo Prichard <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Steve
>I have the Curtis 120 V / 550 A model running at 108 V
> in my 93 Festiva with 9" ADC. No issues. Still
> though, even with my 2200 lb car including batteries,
> it can't get up steep hills in any gear higher than
> 1st (15 -20 MPH). For, that' I'd need a Zilla 1k.
Would the Zilla 1k work ok with the 9" ADC and if so how much more power
would it give you just by replacing the controller?
Jo
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
You are best to deal face-to-face with an independent agent rather
than by phone with a clerk that is a mere cog in a national chain.
Generally, they will give you liability insurance without
much of a hassle. Just say it has been converted to alternative fuel,
electricity.
Since it is a "customized" car, the comprehensive and
collision are a can of worms.
If you deal with an independent agent, face-to-face, these
issues can be dealt with because the agent is interested in the
commission and does not particularly care about the actuarial nuances.
Bill Dube'
At 09:09 AM 4/30/2007, you wrote:
...First go round my insurance company, Nationwide, says my conversion is an
experimental vehicle and they will not underwrite it. I haven't come armed
with all my info yet, but before I do is anyone out there insured with
Nationwide and would you be able to provide me with your agent's name and
number for handy assistance?
E-mail me off-list.
Thanks,
Bill in Delaware
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Messages in the Yahoo Group (echo'd archive) seems
complete.
In contrast, I just looked in the archive
http://www.mail-archive.com/ev@listproc.sjsu.edu/msg07668.html
, and noticed that many of the messages there are
truncated, with this message:
--- Begin Message ---
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * *
* ---REMAINDER OF MESSAGE TRUNCATED---
*
* This post contains a forbidden message
format *
* (such as an attached file, a v-card, HTML
formatting) *
* Lists at sjsu.edu only accept PLAIN TEXT
*
* If your postings display this message your mail
program *
* is not set to send PLAIN TEXT ONLY and needs
adjusting *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * *
--- End Message ---
Photo link: Using the world's first licensed
Revived Battery electric pickup truck
for everyday errandshttp://my-ev-diary.blogspot.com/
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Hi Steve,
how old is your 1231c? (PRESUMED)
Is this the whistling model/version?
--- Steve Powers <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I have the Curtis 120 V / 550 A model running at 108
> V
> in my 93 Festiva with 9" ADC. No issues. Still
> though, even with my 2200 lb car including
> batteries,
> it can't get up steep hills in any gear higher than
> 1st (15 -20 MPH). For, that' I'd need a Zilla 1k.
> On
> moderate grades and flat, it is similar to stock 1.3
> L
> engine. Previously it had the 1221B 120 V / 400 A
> controller, and it blew out all the FETs and diodes
> on
> the power stage. In between, I used the GE EV-1B
> running at 96 V / 320 A. The preformance was more
> jerkey on startup, top speed in each gear was higher
> (than Curtis), but it gave less range (maybe 10 -
> 20%
> less range) and it is known to be a "battery eater."
>
> Steve
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
> protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
Photo link: Using the world's first licensed
Revived Battery electric pickup truck
for everyday errandshttp://my-ev-diary.blogspot.com/
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
http://www.fsip.biz/
EV America sez they repair failed Curtis controller
that blew up. Any reviews of this company?
Photo link: Using the world's first licensed
Revived Battery electric pickup truck
for everyday errandshttp://my-ev-diary.blogspot.com/
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Per UVE's EV calculator, the 6.7 motor redlines at 8K rpm.
Randii
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Anybody tried using an air conditioner compressor clutch on the front shaft
to engage a belt to an alternator to charge a 12V accessory battery during
deceleration? Free power for pumps, lights, heater etc?
Marty
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Intersting, I wonder where that figure came from. It is a little higher
then I would have guessed, but I am just going off of numbers I have heard
on this list in the past. I did download and look at some motor curves from
EVParts.com on the different 6.7 inch ADCs they have. Most of them had data
up to 6000 RPM so it seems they are safe up to at least that high.
damon
From: "Randy Burleson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Reply-To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
CC: "Randy Burleson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: RE: ADC 6.7 redline and how to measure it.
Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2007 10:37:06 -0700
Per UVE's EV calculator, the 6.7 motor redlines at 8K rpm.
Randii
_________________________________________________________________
The average US Credit Score is 675. The cost to see yours: $0 by Experian.
http://www.freecreditreport.com/pm/default.aspx?sc=660600&bcd=EMAILFOOTERAVERAGE
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
My thought is to just tap the pack at 24, 48, 96 volts. Yes this will
unevenly discharge the pack, so you must have a very good balancing
charging system. It also reduces the range since its not taking
advantage of all battery power. But it reduces the contactors to just
4, and is very simple.
Has anyone else purchased the new Tyco LEV200 contactors? I've bought 4
of them, and 3 of them were defective!
Jack
damon henry wrote:
The main problem is that with the price of the contactors you need to
use, it turns out that that expensive PWM controller is not so expensive
after all. In fact a contactor controller built with all new and
properly rated parts could end up being more expensive. I bought enough
contactors and diodes surplus off of Ebay to make a rectactor
controller. All the parts at a deep discount still cost me $200 and I
still would have needed to fabricate a bunch of stuff to put it all
together. Ultimately I decided not to go that route. I don't feel like
I wasted the money, as beefy contactors and huge diodes are always nice
to have around and at least some of them will undoubtedly end up in my
new EV. I decided to spend the money and buy an Alltrax 7245 instead.
This cost me about $650 deliverd. Once I factored in all my needs the
Alltrax just made a lot more sense.
If you have a very cheap source of suitable contactors you can certainly
make a contactor controller. If you go to the File archive section of
the Yahoo EVDL archive you will find some scanned copies of contactor
controllers.
A 3 step contactor controller takes 9 contactors. A 3 step rectactor
can be built with 3 contactors and 6 diodes. The one I was going to
build took 5 contactor but included one for field weakening and one for
a startup resistor.
damon
Here is the original message from Lee Hart I was working off of.
No; the rectactor is a better circuit. Here it is (view with a fixed
width font like Courier New or Fixedsys):
_________________________________||__________||___
| _|_ __|__+ | || | | || |
| D1 /_\ S4a ___ B1 | S1 | | S2 |
_|_ |____||____| - | | |_ _|
D5 /_\ +__|__ || _|_ |___|/___| \/\/\/ |
| B2 ___ /_\ D2 +|\- | R1 |_
| - |__________| C1 _|_ _| MOTOR
| S3 | S5 ___ _| FIELD
|______||_________| | _|
| || | | |
____|_____ | |____|
_|_ __|__+ _|_ |
D3 /_\ S4b ___ B3 /_\ D6 _|_
|____||____| - | MOTOR / \
+__|__ || _|_ | ARMATURE | |
B4 ___ /_\ D4 | \___/
|__________|___________|________________________________|
B1-B4 are your four 12v batteries. S1 is your main contactor, and has
capacitor C1 across it as a snubber. R1 is your starting resistor, and
S2 is the bypass contactor for it.
S4 is your 12v/24v series/parallel contactor. When open, B3 and B4 are
in parallel via diodes D3 and D4; and B1 and B2 are in parallel via
diodes D1 and D2. When you close S4, it connects B1 and B2 in series,
and B3 and B4 in series.
S3 is your 24v/48v series/parallel contactor. It works with diodes D5
and D6 to select 24v or 48v.
S5 is a field weaking contactor. It wires part of the starting resistor
across the field to get a speed halfway between two voltage steps.
Notice that at full voltage (48v), there are no diodes in the power
path. At 24v, there is only one diode in the power path (D5 and D6 are
effectively in parallel, each carrying 1/2 the motor current). At 12v,
there is two diode drops in the power path (D1, D2, D3, and D4 are
effectively in parallel, each carrying 1/4th the motor current).
Also note that no contactor ever needs to switch the full 48v. In an
emergency shutdown, opening all contactors doesn't have more than 12v
across any of them.
--
"Never doubt that the work of a small group of thoughtful, committed
citizens can change the world. Indeed, it's the only thing that ever
has!" -- Margaret Mead
--
Lee A. Hart 814 8th Ave N Sartell MN 56377 leeahart_at_earthlink.net
_________________________________________________________________
Mortgage rates near historic lows. Refinance $200,000 loan for as low as
$771/month*
https://www2.nextag.com/goto.jsp?product=100000035&url=%2fst.jsp&tm=y&search=mortgage_text_links_88_h27f8&disc=y&vers=689&s=4056&p=5117
--- End Message ---
