EV Digest 6794
Topics covered in this issue include:
1) Re: EV Merchandise
by "Kip C. Anderson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
2) Re: belly pan plastic
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
3) Re: belly pan plastic
by Danny Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
4) A123 Automotive Propulsion Battery
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
5) Re: A123 Automotive Propulsion Battery
by Bill Dube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
6) Re: A123 Automotive Propulsion Battery
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
7) 10,0000 cycles (was: Battery chart for a hand-out...)
by Bill Dube <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
8) AGNS Joins 100 MPH Club-Sets New NEDRA record
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
9) Re: direct drive or transmission?
by "George Swartz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
10) Re: AGNS Joins 100 MPH Club-Sets New NEDRA record
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
11) Re: belly pan plastic
by DM3 <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
12) Re: belly pan plastic
by "Roy LeMeur" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
13) Re: A123 Automotive Propulsion Battery
by Marc Geller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
14) Electropolitan smokes tire, misses record
by [EMAIL PROTECTED]
15) Re: belly pan plastic
by John Fisher <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
16) Re: Dead start acceleration issues
by Bob Bath <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
17) Re: 92 Civvy gets a refurb! (parts leftover, anyone?)
by "Marty Hewes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
--- Begin Message ---
Images: Man walking, riding a horse, driving a Model A, driving an SUV,
driving an EV (plug hanging out)
Text: EVolve. Drive electric
----- Original Message -----
From: "Brandon Kruger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "EV list" <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2007 3:54 PM
Subject: EV Merchandise
Hey everyone,
I've noticed when I looked around I couldn't find a lot of good t-shirts
and
other merchandise to promote EVs. So I decided I'd see if I could offer
some to the community. I've put together a small store where you can buy
merchandise to show off your support of EVs. If you have any
recommendations or suggestions for what you would want, feel free to reply
or email me.
http://www.cafepress.com/altfuel
Happy shopping!
Brandon Kruger
P.S. I don't mean to be spamming or trolling or anything. If you
consider
this message to be spam, I apologize.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.7.1/805 - Release Date: 5/15/2007
10:47 AM
--- End Message ---
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--- Begin Message ---
Hey it's "strong", don't get me wrong.
It IS breakable however, particularly in thinner pieces. "bulletproof"
Lexan (polycarbonate) is not only very thick but I think it's a
different grade. Hit it hard with a hammer and it breaks easily
enough. In fact the way you usually cut a flat sheet is just score it
and hit it.
Back when the Battlebots show was in its "awesome" phase, a number of
people thought Lexan was a strong housing. It looked neat! But that
stuff just breaks to pieces under that sort of beating. Lots and lots
of pieces actually.
On the other hand, I can hand you a piece of 1/8" UHMW-PE, a 5 pound
sledgehammer, and a concrete sidewalk and the only loser's going to be
the sidewalk. A piece of Coroplast (please stop calling it
"Chloroplast", it hurts my eyes) will be flattened, but probably still
not be broken into separate pieces.
It's partly a tradeoff of stiffness to impact resistance. For example,
try to break a t-shirt with a sledgehammer. Unless you hang it from a
tree and tear it down with the hammer, probably can't be done. But
cloth has no stiffness thus serves no useful function as a belly liner.
Lexan has more stiffness than we require. There are exceptions- UHMW-PE
has fairly high stiffness but no way can it be broken.
I worry about 2 other factors. One, a car frame flexes. I don't know
how significantly. Varies by vehicle and road stress I'm sure. I worry
about the stress around the attachment points. This is also a case
where a stiffer material may be bad.
Second is water. Vehicles are designed to drain under the frame, since
water leaks in past the hood and such or from water off the road. A few
well-placed holes SHOULD drain it but I'd worry a little bit that it may
build up. Actually flat, unribbed surfaces with LOW stiffness are the
worst since they tend to sag under the weight, making water collect in a
new location that only sags more and increases in volume. Hopefully
just putting a little hole there will get rid of that problem though.
Danny
David Roden wrote:
On 16 May 2007 at 7:11, Phil Marino wrote:
Polycarbonate has very high impact resistance. ...
police riot face shields ... motorcycle helmets ...
And the front bumper of the ill-fated Sebring Zzipper EV.
David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EV List Administrator
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--- Begin Message ---
Hi Folks
I am not sure if "A123 Automotive Propulsion Battery" is the correct name,
but somehow the EVDL has missed this (to me) major announcement.
(yes, I looked back thru recent postings)
Someone else _has_ mentioned it, here is his post-
~~~~~~~~~~~~
article: A123 announces PHEV auto-class battery system
Paul Wujek wrote:
May 16
I think that a few people on the list will find this interesting:
http://tyler.blogware.com/blog/_archives/2007/5/16/2953846.html
~~~~~~~~~~~
Ok... now here is a post I forwarded from the OEVA list to the SEVA list-
~~~~~~~~~~~~
[seva] FW: [Oeva-list] A123Systems makes Automotive
Yes, I know this subject has already been posted here. But I thought it
needed a little more flag waving. Like... " Hey! Look over here!"
Just a tease from the manufacturer here-
http://www.a123systems.com/newsite/index.php#/products/cells32series/
Roy
~~~~~~~~~
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [Oeva-list] A123Systems makes Automotive
Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 15:12:15 EDT
Daniel
They would work for an EV they have two different mixes depending if it is
a
HEV or a PHEV.
Going by their prices and others I would not expect any pack to cost below
15,000 for a very small one or 30,000 or more for what most of us would
want.
Then of course there is the problem of buying them and a BMS. They are
really
looking for OEM buyers that would be buying very large quantities.
Don
In a message dated 5/19/2007 12:02:36 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Send Oeva-list mailing list submissions to
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
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Today's Topics:
1. Re: Oeva-list Digest, Vol 43, Issue 14 (Daniel Eyk)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 11:45:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Daniel Eyk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] Oeva-list Digest, Vol 43, Issue 14
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
It sounds like these would not work for an EV, is that
correct? Just for reference, do you have any idea what
the cost per cell is? Dan Eyk
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it
is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Oeva-list digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. A123Systems makes Automotive Class Lithium Ion
Cells
([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 23:33:04 -0700
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [Oeva-list] A123Systems makes Automotive
Class Lithium Ion
Cells
To: OEVA <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
http://www.a123systems.com/newsite/index.php#/products/cells32series/
"These two cells, designed for HEV and PHEV
applications offer extremely low
cost per Watt and Watt-hour, respectively...."
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End of Oeva-list Digest, Vol 43, Issue 14
*****************************************
Daniel Eyk
Vancouver, Wa.
Electric S-10 project
E-15 project
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Roy LeMeur
_________________________________________________________________
PC Magazines 2007 editors choice for best Web mailaward-winning Windows
Live Hotmail.
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--- Begin Message ---
They _just_ did a revamp of the whole website with all the latest news.
I get information about high-power stuff, but I
am not in the loop for the rest of what they do.
These "Ultra" cells are quite exciting. They will
have significantly higher specific power than the
present cells. They will also be larger. The
KillaCycle is slated to get these ultra cells
when they begin production. We are really excited
about this. (Who wouldn't be?)
Just reading the web page, it appears to be that
they are making two types of new cells (news to
me.) One looks to be high power (I know about
this one.) The other appears to be high energy content. (News to me.)
Bill Dube'
At 04:40 PM 5/19/2007, you wrote:
Hi Folks
I am not sure if "A123 Automotive Propulsion
Battery" is the correct name, but somehow the
EVDL has missed this (to me) major announcement.
(yes, I looked back thru recent postings)
Someone else _has_ mentioned it, here is his post-
~~~~~~~~~~~~
article: A123 announces PHEV auto-class battery system
Paul Wujek wrote:
May 16
I think that a few people on the list will find this interesting:
http://tyler.blogware.com/blog/_archives/2007/5/16/2953846.html
~~~~~~~~~~~
Ok... now here is a post I forwarded from the OEVA list to the SEVA list-
~~~~~~~~~~~~
[seva] FW: [Oeva-list] A123Systems makes Automotive
Yes, I know this subject has already been posted
here. But I thought it needed a little more flag
waving. Like... " Hey! Look over here!"
Just a tease from the manufacturer here-
http://www.a123systems.com/newsite/index.php#/products/cells32series/
Roy
~~~~~~~~~
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [Oeva-list] A123Systems makes Automotive
Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 15:12:15 EDT
Daniel
They would work for an EV they have two different mixes depending if it is
a
HEV or a PHEV.
Going by their prices and others I would not expect any pack to cost below
15,000 for a very small one or 30,000 or more for what most of us would want.
Then of course there is the problem of buying them and a BMS. They are really
looking for OEM buyers that would be buying very large quantities.
Don
In a message dated 5/19/2007 12:02:36 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Send Oeva-list mailing list submissions to
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You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
than "Re: Contents of Oeva-list digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. Re: Oeva-list Digest, Vol 43, Issue 14 (Daniel Eyk)
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 11:45:11 -0700 (PDT)
From: Daniel Eyk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: [Oeva-list] Oeva-list Digest, Vol 43, Issue 14
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
It sounds like these would not work for an EV, is that
correct? Just for reference, do you have any idea what
the cost per cell is? Dan Eyk
--- [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
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visit
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or, via email, send a message with subject or body
'help' to
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
You can reach the person managing the list at
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When replying, please edit your Subject line so it
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than "Re: Contents of Oeva-list digest..."
Today's Topics:
1. A123Systems makes Automotive Class Lithium Ion
Cells
([EMAIL PROTECTED])
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Message: 1
Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 23:33:04 -0700
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subject: [Oeva-list] A123Systems makes Automotive
Class Lithium Ion
Cells
To: OEVA <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Message-ID:
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
http://www.a123systems.com/newsite/index.php#/products/cells32series/
"These two cells, designed for HEV and PHEV
applications offer extremely low
cost per Watt and Watt-hour, respectively...."
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End of Oeva-list Digest, Vol 43, Issue 14
*****************************************
Daniel Eyk
Vancouver, Wa.
Electric S-10 project
E-15 project
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Roy LeMeur
_________________________________________________________________
PC Magazines 2007 editors choice for best Web
mailaward-winning Windows Live Hotmail.
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--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
Bill Dube' wrote:
I get information about high-power stuff, but I
am not in the loop for the rest of what they do.
Bill-
I _did_ look first in the EVDL archives before posting expecting to see a
post that I had missed with your name on it.
Here is the press release-
~~~~~~~~~~~
A123Systems Introduces 32-Series Automotive Class Lithium Ion
Application-Specific Cells at the Advanced Automotive Battery Conference
Cells Optimized for Use in Hybrid and Plug-In Hybrid Applications Offer
Industry-Leading Price-Performance
Long Beach, Calif. - Advanced Automotive Battery Conference (AABC) - May 16,
2007 - A123Systems, developer and producer of state-of-the-art Automotive
Class Lithium Ion batteries, today introduced its 32-series cells,
specifically designed for Hybrid Electric Vehicle (HEV) and Plug-in Hybrid
Electric Vehicle (PHEV) use. These batteries provide unprecedented specific
power, safety and abuse-tolerance and leverage the companys existing
low-cost, high-volume manufacturing techniques to offer the electric drive
industry a new level of price-performance.
A123Systems 32-series lineup is currently comprised of two cells with
custom Nanophosphate electrode designs, based on the same proven chemistry
as the mass produced ANR26650M1 cell: the 32113 M1Ultra and 32157 M1HD.
The 32113 M1Ultra high power cells are optimized to offer industry leading
power by volume and cost-per-watt. Designed to meet the rigorous
requirements of HEV applications, the 32113 is currently designed into
A123Systems programs with major U.S. and European auto manufacturers. The
32157 M1HD cell uses a higher energy electrode design, geared specifically
for PHEVs, and offers greater volumetric energy density and the lowest cost
per watt-hour. Currently used in a Saturn Vue PHEV development program, the
32157 offers superior calendar and cycle life at high depth-of-discharge
(DOD), as well as excellent power density for charge-sustaining operation.
Unlike conventional lithium ion cells that compromise critical parameters to
meet system requirements, A123Systems Automotive Class Lithium Ion cells
are optimized to offer power, safety and life, all at price-performance
targets that enable the industry. Wide power availability over a broad range
of state-of-charge as well as exceptional endurance implies that systems
with both cells require minimal oversizing, allowing for lower overall
systems cost.
"Our 32-series cells provide high performance and abuse-tolerance unmatched
by any other lithium ion battery chemistry," said David Vieau, president and
CEO, A123Systems. "By making it possible for manufacturers to design HEVs
and PHEVs with attractive performance, reliability and safety as well as an
overall lower systems cost, we are able to play a significant role in
speeding the markets acceptance of highly fuel efficient vehicles."
Critical to the adoption of lithium ion batteries in automotive
applications, the 32-series cells are designed with abuse-tolerance in mind.
A123Systems Automotive Class Lithium Ion cells take advantage of lessons
learned from the mass-production of ANR26650M1 cells in order to deliver 10+
year and 150,000 mile projected life requirements in engineered automotive
battery packs.
A123Systems Nanophosphate chemistry has been developed with the assistance
of the Department of Energy FreedomCAR program and is a result of more than
$102 million in private investment. With performance validated by various
national labs and leading automotive OEMs, the A123Systems doped
Nanophosphate batteries achieve the superior durability and safety required
for automotive use of lithium ion technology.
About A123Systemsz
A123Systems has quickly become one of the worlds leading suppliers of
high-power lithium-ion batteries. Based on the companys patent pending
Nanophosphate technology, the batteries deliver previously unattainable
levels of power, safety and life. Applicable to a wide range of industries,
A123Systems products allow OEMs expanded flexibility in system design,
removing many traditional technology constraints. Currently, the Company
sells millions of battery cells to Black and Decker and Dewalt for use in
the most advanced handheld power tools available on the market today.
Founded in 2001, A123Systems proprietary nanoscale electrode technology is
built on initial developments from the Massachusetts Institute of
Technology. For additional information please visit www.a123systems.com.
~~~~~~
Roy LeMeur
_________________________________________________________________
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--- Begin Message ---
Here is the cycle life info on their new website:
http://www.a123systems.com/newsite/index.php#/applications/phev/pchart2/
Notice that it is a straight line for % capacity remaining versus
cycles. As I mentioned earlier, if 50% remaining capacity is OK with
you, then the cycle life is 10,000 cycles.
Like I said, I don't just make this stuff up. :-)
Many (perhaps most) of the battery manufacturers use 50% remaining
capacity for the "end" of the cycle life.
Bill Dube'
At 07:53 PM 5/17/2007, you wrote:
You need to dust off your calculator and actually do the math.
At 50% capacity loss (10 times 5%) you will get 10,000 cycles (10
times 1,000.) This is direct quote from the engineers a A123
Systems. I don't make this stuff up.
By the way, can you find another brand of battery that lists the
cycle life for 10 C discharge?
At 08:33 PM 5/17/2007, you wrote:
What that chart shows:
1C the loss is 5% at 25C after 1000 cycles
2C the loss is 10% at 45C
2C the loss is 20% at 60C
All I can really say is you are now Bill the Battery Salesman
to say expect 10,000 cycles for an EV.
Jack Murray
Bill Dube wrote:
As I mentioned in a post yesterday, (in answer to YOUR post) the
temperature is what really matters in the cycle life. The
high-current cycle tests makes the cells run at high temperatures,
and thus shorten cycle life.
If you look at the chart
http://www.a123systems.com/newsite/pdf/ANR26650M1_Datasheet_FEB2007-1.pdf
you will notice that the 25 C curve indicates a 5% capacity loss
after 1,000 cycles. (This is what you would expect in the typical
EV environment.)
Looking at the 60 C curve, you see that the capacity loss is about
25%. after 1,000 cycles. At the same current, but at 45 C, the
curve shows about 12% loss after 1,000 cycles.
EVs typically discharge batteries at 1C, sometimes less, sometimes
a bit more. Low internal resistance keeps the cell temperature at
30 C or below. Thus, in an EV, you can expect the cycle life of
about 10,000 cycles to 50% capacity.
Why don't you dig up the cycle life of an Optima at 10 C
discharge at 60 C? You can't find this chart because the battery
would be a puddle of smoking molten goo at this temperature.
Bill Dube'
At 06:49 PM 5/17/2007, you wrote:
So the chart that A123 publishes that shows 20% loss at 1000
cycles at 10C discharge is not correct?
Bill Dube wrote:
The cycle life on A123 Systems cells is actually much more than
1,000 cycles, if you rate it the same way other manufacturers'
do. The 1,000 rating is for just 5% loss of capacity. If you
rate it to 50% loss of capacity, (like lead-acid AGMs are rated)
the cycle life is 10,000 cycles.
I don't think Li-Ion FePo has a calender capacity loss like
conventional Li-Ion does. The chemistry is much more stable.
Bill Dube'
At 05:35 PM 5/17/2007, you wrote:
I'm manning a booth at the Maker Faire (San Mateo County Fairgrounds, May
19-20, http://www.makerfaire.com ) over the weekend and wanted to give a
hand-out regarding EVs. In addition to some white papers by
Tesla, I wanted
to put together two charts.
The first one, I was hoping to put gas price over time, vs
battery cost over
time. Does anyone know where I'd get data for battery
cost? Say, for NiMH
and LiIon, over the past 10 years or so?
The second one was inspired by
http://www.madkatz.com/ev/batteryTechnologyComparison.html
and it's a chart of battery specs, with an added emphasis on
total cost of
the battery, per kilowatt-hour, over the lifetime of the battery.
Here it
is so far... does anyone have good info on what a modern NiCad
would be to
use? Anyone had experience (and pricing) with Valence's U-Charge?
Also,
what's the realistic peak power out of a flooded lead-acid or hawker
Genesis? (I figure the racers on this list would know for real...)
Tech Density #Cycles Discharge Cost
Wh/kg W/kg (per month) $/kWh $/kW
$/LifeTimekWh
Est Range
Flooded lead-acid 47 600 20%? $85 $0.14
"AGM" lead-acid 35 412? 500 5%? $145 $12?
$0.29 ~60
NiCad 50? 2000? 100%? $300? $0.15
NiMH (Nilar) 55 385 4000 $960 $137
$0.24 ~110
LiIon (18650) 176 631 500 ??% $535 $149
$1.07 ~250
LiPho (A123) 110 3000 1000* $1300 $47
$1.30 ~180
Notes:
LiIon loses 5% of capacity per year, regardless of whether you
use it. See
http://www.buchmann.ca/Article5-Page1.asp
NiCads have severe memory effects.
W/kg is max possible "peak" rate.
Wh/kg is "average" or "nominal" discharge rate.
Range is affected by how much extra packaging must surround the
battery, for
example extra temperature monitoring that affects 18650 cells.
18650 cells est. at $5 each
* - cycles claimed by A123
Sources:
http://www.nilar.com/index.php?pageID=33&languageID=1
NiMH based on Nilar 24V 9AHr=216WHr @3.9kg $208 each
http://www.madkatz.com/ev/batteryTechnologyComparison.html
http://www.teslamotors.com/display_data/TeslaRoadsterBatterySystem.pdf
=> 56kWH, 200kW, 200 miles, 375V, 450kg (317kg batt weight est)
6,831 cells, 46.5g each at $5 each would be $34,150 for 56kWHr
http://libattery.ustc.edu.cn/english/introduction%203.htm
Flooded specs based on US Battery US185 spec 195AHr=2340WHr @49kg $200
AGM Specs based on Hawker G70EP 72AHr=864WHr @24.9kg $125
A123 specs based on 3.3V, 2.3Ah, 7.6WHr @70g $10.00 (dev kits
are $20 each
in much smaller quantity)
--- End Message ---
--- Begin Message ---
On what was supposed to be a nice sunny day in Thompson Ohio The
Lawless Industries AGNS bike and crew were looking for 4-5 good runs
and a shot at both the NEDRA 144 volt motorcycle record and the 100 MPH
club. Well unexpected rain put a damper on the fire but not until 2
runs were in the books. Run # 1 flashed on the board as a 12.92 @ 102
MPH. AGNS is in the club! An hr. later we got a chance to back it up.
Run #2 showed the 12 old Hawkers were starting to come alive. 12.67 @
106 MPH. I believe that since these are more than 1% apart that the
slower time of 12.92 will stand as the new NEDRA record. We started
having visions of the 11's and 110+. We saw the rain coming but since
the batteries were getting into their temperature comfort zone we went
ahead and charged ole AGNS till she couldn't take any more. It wasn't
meant to be. The rain came and we departed for a victory dinner,
leaving behind a whole group of folks scratching their heads over how a
silent little minibike can stay darn near a tricked up Hayabusa for
half a track and keeps gets quicker and quicker every single run. Next
stop 125 MPH Club. I cannot explain how much darn fun this little bike
has become.
Dear Mr. Rudman, per your comments of a few days ago... AGNS will be at
the track on Wednesday with sights on the 168 volt record of 12.49 @
100 MPH. Prepare to eat your hat.
Shawn Lawless
________________________________________________________________________
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Its probably been mentioned already, but the major disadvantage to a low RPM
wheel motor is the detrimental effect it has of adding to unsprung weight.
This makes the suspension more difficult to stabilize for handling and
vehicle control. Most wheel motor designs I have seen use at least a
planetary gear reduction, so they are not "direct drive" per the popular
definition on this web site.
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Wow! Congratulations Shawn!
Hey Plasma Boy! Are you listening? This little bike is coming closer to your
MPHs and ETs. (@144V)
Can't wait to see what the other Lawless Industries vehicles will do.
"The records are dropping like flies in the face of Lawless Industries"
No charge for the plug :^D
~~~~~~
Roy LeMeur
_________________________________________________________________
More photos, more messages, more storageget 2GB with Windows Live Hotmail.
http://imagine-windowslive.com/hotmail/?locale=en-us&ocid=TXT_TAGHM_migration_HM_mini_2G_0507
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As i mentioned previously I used PVC sheet as a belly pan. I used it on the
Karmann GhiLectric
and it made a considerable difference in aerodynamics and wind noise. One word
of caution, make
sure not to cover the lift points (where you jack up the car). It is best to
cut out a small
section to expose these areas if it is necessary to cover the area around them.
One good feature
is it keeps the underside of the car much cleaner and helps to deflect any
foriegn objects on the
road from causing any damage to otherwise exposed areas. I will try to take
some pictures and
post them on the site.
http://www.dm3electrics.com/
mario
> > Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 14:19:06 -0700 (PDT)
> From: Bruce Weisenberger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Subject: Re: belly pan plastic
> To: ev@listproc.sjsu.edu
>
> I am tired of deleting theses emails on belly pan
> plastic.
> Choroplastic is being used by folks trying to get the
> best Gas mileage possible. The biggest reason for a
> belly pan is to reduce air drag or to make a vehicle
> more aerodynamic.
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Wow.
I am counting 37 posts on "belly pan plastic"
The EVDL _is_ getting busy recently (can you say $4 per gallon?)
FWIW, Coroplast is used for everything. Look at the sign materials when you
park at the convenience store.
Cheaper than dirt, (almost) you can dumpster dive it.
Strength to weight to cost no brainer.
Plastic Corrugated Cardboard.
Try it, you will like it.
Pyrophobia types? I can't help you.
Can we stop now?
~~~~~~
Roy LeMeur
_________________________________________________________________
Make every IM count. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now.
Its free. http://im.live.com/messenger/im/home/?source=TAGHM_MAY07
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Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
From: "Marty Hewes" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Subject: Re: 92 Civvy gets a refurb! (parts leftover, anyone?)
Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 21:42:08 -0500
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain;
format=flowed;
charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
Are you sure that's a problem? I know nothing about E-meters, but the
difference between 1.059 and 1.067 megs is less than 1%. Most meters aren't
that good, much less most electronics.
Marty
----- Original Message -----
From: "Bob Bath" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <ev@listproc.sjsu.edu>
Sent: Saturday, May 19, 2007 5:44 PM
Subject: 92 Civvy gets a refurb! (parts leftover, anyone?)
Well, the good news is that I finally took off the
dash for the first time since completing the
conversion, and yanked the e-meter from its' little
hole where the side-view mirror motor controls _would_
be mounted in an LX or EX model-- and put it into a
"pod pillar." It's much more visible now.
Another thing I did was to install a Belktronix
DCDC converter. That means 60A of 12V, not 30.
SWEET, since my aux. battery is the wimpiest size.
That leaves a leftover DCP DCDC 350watt converter, now
listed on the EVTrading Post. It works _perfectly_.
But without the extra 12V _bipolar supply_ from the
DCP DCDC to the E-meter, I also installed a Belktronix
E-meter supply. And here is where it takes a poor
turn: I miswired the meter just enough to (what I'm
fairly certain is) damage the prescaler. It's
supposed to read 1.059 megs between in hot and out
hot, and mine is reading 1.067 megs. There is some
diode test too, but I haven't done that. I bought a
new one, and it works fine. Sooo if someone wants to
pay postage and gamble that they can melt the potting
compound, or somehow alter/repair the prescaler, it's
free except for the postage.
How cool to finally have digital current Ah,
voltage, etc. readings even when the car is _off_
now!!
Gotta' go drive summore!!!
Converting a gen. 5 Honda Civic? My $20 video/DVD
has my '92 sedan, as well as a del Sol and hatch too!
Learn more at:
www.budget.net/~bbath/CivicWithACord.html
____
__/__|__\ __
=D-------/ - - \
'O'-----'O'-'
Would you still drive your car if the tailpipe came out of the steering
wheel? Are you saving any gas for your kids?
____________________________________________________________________________________
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